AI transcript
0:00:02 (upbeat music)
0:00:06 – Hey, welcome to the Next Wave Podcast.
0:00:06 I’m Matt Wolf.
0:00:08 I’m here with Nathan Lanz.
0:00:11 And once again, we’ve got an amazing episode for you.
0:00:12 In this episode, we’re gonna break down
0:00:15 some business ideas that leverage AI
0:00:18 that we wish existed that don’t exist yet.
0:00:21 So ideally, people listening to this episode
0:00:24 will go and maybe build some of these things
0:00:25 ’cause these are ideas that we think
0:00:27 there’s some money behind.
0:00:29 – Today we have a Siki Chin on.
0:00:30 He originally was in the game industry,
0:00:32 so he created a startup called Serious Business
0:00:37 that he sold to Zynga for a ton of money back in the day.
0:00:39 And since then, he’s been one of the most prominent
0:00:41 angel investors in Silicon Valley.
0:00:44 He’s now running Runway.com, which is a great startup.
0:00:46 – Yeah, so this is legitimately
0:00:48 one of the most fun conversations I think we’ve had
0:00:50 on this show where me, Nathan, and Siki,
0:00:53 we just sort of bounce ideas off each other for businesses.
0:00:56 And as we share ideas, the ideas just ramp up more
0:00:59 and more and more and get spicier and spicier
0:01:01 to the last one, which I think is gonna blow
0:01:02 some people’s minds.
0:01:04 I mean, I know it scared me a little bit
0:01:06 when he gave the idea.
0:01:08 We get into some crazier and crazier ideas
0:01:10 as this episode goes on.
0:01:12 So check this episode out.
0:01:14 It’s probably gonna give you some ideas
0:01:17 for spin-off businesses or ways that you can use AI
0:01:19 at your business that you’re not thinking of
0:01:22 or businesses that you can potentially go build.
0:01:25 But it is a fun episode, a fascinating episode.
0:01:26 I think you’re really gonna enjoy it.
0:01:28 So let’s dive in with Siki Chen.
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0:02:15 (upbeat music)
0:02:18 – Hey Siki, thanks for coming on today.
0:02:20 – Hey Nathan, thanks for having me.
0:02:21 – Yeah, I guess first it’d be good to give people
0:02:23 some context of like why you’re here,
0:02:24 how you got on the show,
0:02:27 and you know a little bit about how we know each other.
0:02:29 – Yeah, funnily enough, I thought I was here
0:02:31 because I tweet about AI,
0:02:34 and I’d have, you know, people would follow me
0:02:35 on Twitter or whatever.
0:02:36 – Yeah.
0:02:37 – But as it turns out, I was just reminded
0:02:39 that the reason why I’m here is,
0:02:41 you announced you had a podcast.
0:02:42 That’s why I’m here.
0:02:43 I invited myself.
0:02:46 (laughing)
0:02:49 – So cool, so I mean, we were thinking the day
0:02:50 we really want to try something new.
0:02:53 Just like share AI business ideas,
0:02:54 you know, some of them may be great,
0:02:55 some of them may suck.
0:02:56 – Sounds good, I keep prepared.
0:02:57 – Awesome.
0:02:59 Let’s go ahead and talk about some of these business ideas.
0:03:01 I think we should start with Nathan,
0:03:02 ’cause I know Nathan’s got three lined up,
0:03:04 and again, if they suck,
0:03:06 the comments section will let us know.
0:03:08 – Yeah, so my first idea was just, you know,
0:03:09 it actually comes back,
0:03:11 I think the last time we met Siki was in Hong Kong,
0:03:13 is that the last time we met in person?
0:03:14 And that was back when I was,
0:03:16 when I was partying with Barry Osborn,
0:03:18 you know, the producer of Lord of the Rings, The Matrix,
0:03:19 I was trying to create this crazy
0:03:21 crypto-funded movie studio,
0:03:23 and you know, we were going out to New Zealand,
0:03:25 Hollywood a lot together, like me and Barry,
0:03:28 and I got this tour of Weta when I was out in New Zealand,
0:03:29 and it was amazing.
0:03:30 I was blown away by it.
0:03:34 You know, I got to hold Aragorn Sword, Weta Workshop,
0:03:35 and also like seeing their business,
0:03:36 like how much money they make,
0:03:37 just making all the special effects
0:03:39 and stuff for movie studios.
0:03:41 It’s like, that’s a great business.
0:03:43 And now that you’ve got AI video,
0:03:44 it feels like there’s an opportunity
0:03:46 for like almost like a Weta for like AI video, right?
0:03:48 We’re all the, you know,
0:03:51 whether it’s in movies or TV or games
0:03:52 to go out there and be like the shop
0:03:57 that specializes in creating AI videos for films.
0:03:58 But yeah, I don’t have much to say about it beyond that,
0:03:59 but that’s the idea.
0:04:01 So good, interesting, sucks.
0:04:04 – Oh, I don’t know.
0:04:05 I’m not sure how much I could say.
0:04:08 There isn’t much, but I think it’s a great idea.
0:04:08 – Yeah.
0:04:11 – I am aware of some new companies
0:04:13 that I’m not allowed to disclose doing this
0:04:15 with very credible people.
0:04:18 But a thing I can talk about though is related,
0:04:21 which is there’s a company called NIN video
0:04:26 and it started by this guy, Yuri, who ran Superdow
0:04:29 and very credible founder, raised a lot of money.
0:04:33 And the entire idea is the state of the arch
0:04:36 for generative models is going to be open source.
0:04:40 And so you’re going to need professional grade workflow tools
0:04:42 to orchestrate all of these.
0:04:44 So, you know, you want something more fine-grained
0:04:47 than what runway ML alone can provide you.
0:04:50 And he’s getting started with that.
0:04:51 It’s got a bunch of traders on a platform.
0:04:54 So this idea of professionalizing in general,
0:04:58 a AI tools and special effects, I think it’s huge.
0:05:01 – I guess my question though is like,
0:05:05 how close are we to not necessarily needing an agency
0:05:07 where you’re just enter the prompt of like,
0:05:09 here’s the video I need.
0:05:11 And it gives it back to you that, you know,
0:05:13 the agency is just like a middleman
0:05:15 that people don’t need anymore.
0:05:16 – There’s a very related question,
0:05:19 how we think about AI and our own product at runway.
0:05:23 So we build like this finance platform and, you know,
0:05:27 there’s a lot of people who use AI to make finance better,
0:05:29 whether it’s like planning or modeling.
0:05:31 And our very particular philosophy on this
0:05:36 is that the best use of AI in this curriculum is today.
0:05:37 And I think also in the future,
0:05:40 it as a tool for a spot rather than a tool
0:05:42 that does the thinking for you.
0:05:44 And I think when I think about like anything creative,
0:05:47 I think apparently most things that you do are creative,
0:05:50 whether it’s like finance business or like creating a movie.
0:05:53 Like you would rather have something
0:05:55 that helps you offload your intent,
0:05:57 your creative intent faster.
0:06:00 And that’s like, I think what AI can do at its best.
0:06:03 I’m a little bit less bullish on the AI
0:06:05 is just gonna do it all for you.
0:06:08 Until, you know, when ASI happens,
0:06:09 like I think we can live in that world.
0:06:11 But until that point, tools for thought
0:06:14 is my bet on good AI products.
0:06:15 – Yeah, yeah.
0:06:15 And I mean–
0:06:16 – Yeah, and if ASI happens,
0:06:17 we probably don’t have to worry about
0:06:19 having an agency or money anyways, right?
0:06:19 So it’s like–
0:06:21 (laughing)
0:06:23 – Yeah, and I mean, like right now you’ve got AI art tools,
0:06:25 you’ve got AI video tools, you got runway,
0:06:26 you got gen three.
0:06:28 There’s some people who somehow managed
0:06:30 to get really amazing stuff out of it.
0:06:32 And then a lot of people who,
0:06:33 no matter what they do, can’t get anything good.
0:06:35 So I mean, even using AI,
0:06:37 there seems to be some level of skill
0:06:40 to get really good stuff out of them, you know?
0:06:42 – I should clarify this, you mentioned runway.
0:06:45 I am the founder of runway ML, which is the one
0:06:48 that makes the videos.
0:06:50 Again, I run a company called runway.com
0:06:52 and we’re forming this platform.
0:06:53 – The real runway.
0:06:54 – You’ve got the better domain name.
0:06:56 (laughing)
0:06:58 – Yeah, people get the two COVID-19 issues all the time.
0:06:59 It’s actually really wild.
0:07:05 – So I guess I’ll share my first business idea.
0:07:06 It’s actually the second on my list,
0:07:09 but it’s related to video, so I’ll share this one first.
0:07:11 And it’s something that I wish I had,
0:07:12 and it may exist.
0:07:14 So if it does exist, feel free to share.
0:07:18 But I want a tool where I can take
0:07:19 like video footage out in the wild.
0:07:22 Let’s say I’m like going on vacation with the family
0:07:24 and I take video with the family
0:07:27 and I record like a roll of me talking to my camera
0:07:31 or I find stock footage on a website.
0:07:32 And I just wanna be able to take
0:07:34 all of this video footage that I have
0:07:36 loaded into some sort of platform,
0:07:40 have AI like scan all of the content for me
0:07:43 and then give it tags, give it descriptions.
0:07:46 And right now it’s easy to do if there’s like talking, right?
0:07:49 It can obviously transcribe the audio
0:07:50 and then figure out tags and stuff.
0:07:53 But I want something where I can throw videos
0:07:56 of just like me filming the Eiffel Tower
0:07:59 or me filming my family running on the beach.
0:08:01 And I throw it in there and it watches the video
0:08:05 and organizes with tags and descriptions
0:08:07 based on the content of the video.
0:08:09 That way when I’m going to like make my YouTube videos,
0:08:11 I can go in and say my family on the beach
0:08:14 and you’re like find that video for me and surface it.
0:08:17 And it feels like something that should exist,
0:08:19 but I haven’t found it yet.
0:08:22 And that’s something I really, really want to see exist.
0:08:24 It’s just something that I could just dump
0:08:28 tons of video content in and have it sort, organize, tag
0:08:30 and just make searchable for me.
0:08:32 – A few things come to mind.
0:08:34 I saw where we were going is you just want a bunch of clips
0:08:36 that haven’t just edited the video for you.
0:08:38 – No, I actually like the editing process.
0:08:40 For me, that’s like where the creativity lies
0:08:41 that I enjoy doing.
0:08:44 But I have a hard time when I shoot like hours and hours
0:08:46 and hours of footage while I’m at an event
0:08:48 and then come home and then look for the specific clips
0:08:50 that I need to pull my video together.
0:08:54 – So I don’t know of specific products that do exactly that.
0:08:57 The closest thing I didn’t think of though is Google Photos.
0:08:57 – Yeah, I was gonna say that.
0:08:59 I think Google will do this, right?
0:09:01 ‘Cause Google does it for photos already, so.
0:09:03 – It does work for video too already.
0:09:04 – Oh, does it?
0:09:07 – So you can search for like sushi, text, beach.
0:09:10 – I have not tried Google Photos for that.
0:09:11 So maybe.
0:09:13 So it could be a horrible business idea
0:09:14 if Google’s already doing it.
0:09:19 – I mean, I do think the idea of like generally
0:09:21 you have a bunch of close and will make stuff for you
0:09:23 or help you tag it as a great one.
0:09:26 I know Captions is, you know, the most,
0:09:27 there’s a closest company to that.
0:09:30 I’m not sure how much it does of organizing
0:09:33 or treating for you, but the tools it has like really good
0:09:34 and it’s doable on your phone.
0:09:35 – Yeah.
0:09:36 – That’s the first one I would think about.
0:09:38 – Captions may have even been the company,
0:09:40 ’cause I actually put this idea on Twitter.
0:09:41 – I don’t know.
0:09:43 – It’s been several months and a company jumped in
0:09:45 and said, “Oh, we’re working on this wink, wink.”
0:09:48 And I feel like it might have actually been Captions.
0:09:48 – Yeah.
0:09:50 I’d be surprised if they weren’t.
0:09:52 That sounds like right up there.
0:09:53 Yeah, Ali.
0:09:54 – Yeah, yeah.
0:09:54 Cool.
0:09:55 Siki, your turn.
0:09:56 – Okay.
0:10:00 So not so I see one, but very practical.
0:10:03 I use a service called Stainbox
0:10:06 and it’s an email prioritizer filter
0:10:07 and it’s really good.
0:10:10 I just apply a label to my emails
0:10:12 and it’ll know, okay, if this type of email
0:10:15 is in the subperson, I’m gonna put it later
0:10:17 or I’m gonna black hole it, never see it again.
0:10:19 Or I can create a custom label.
0:10:21 It’s just really good at what it does.
0:10:23 It’s been around for like 15 years,
0:10:25 got all kinds of like little features.
0:10:28 What I love about it is a primary interface is Gino,
0:10:31 because you don’t actually interact with the website really.
0:10:33 You just set it up once and then you just apply labels
0:10:34 and then just automatically learn.
0:10:37 And it’ll pick up like, and you’re training it, right?
0:10:38 And the way you untrain it,
0:10:40 just like we still can’t get your box.
0:10:41 And I was like, oh, this is actually cool.
0:10:45 So what I want, and I wanted this so bad,
0:10:48 I actually built a crappier version of this myself
0:10:52 using Zapier, is I wanted to be able to categorize my emails
0:10:54 automatically in unstructured ways.
0:10:58 So I wanna say, hey, all of the really intellectual
0:11:01 smart substacks should go here.
0:11:04 And everything related to my kids should go this folder
0:11:07 and my kids’ school stuff and homework should go here.
0:11:10 And everything from our investors should go there.
0:11:11 And I don’t want to, you know,
0:11:14 you don’t want to maintain like a running list
0:11:15 of this stuff.
0:11:17 You just wanna say, this is my intent.
0:11:20 So I have a Zap that does this.
0:11:24 It reads every single email and I have a giant prompt
0:11:25 that describes all the labels
0:11:28 and all of the descriptions of the labels
0:11:31 and it’ll actually go and apply the labels.
0:11:31 It’s not great.
0:11:33 The thing that is missing is,
0:11:35 and it’s not much you do to work on this,
0:11:37 but I just wish someone would build this for me,
0:11:42 which is I want to learn and rag it
0:11:45 as I’m changing the labels, right?
0:11:46 So if it gets something wrong,
0:11:47 I want it to just say, oh, well, this is,
0:11:49 I got this wrong, I’m gonna update the prompts.
0:11:51 I think that’ll just be super useful
0:11:54 instead of supporting emails by like domain or person,
0:11:58 I could just ascribe the vibes of the email I want
0:12:00 and I’ll know what to show me, where to put it.
0:12:04 And that’s my not spicy idea as the one is not.
0:12:06 – Yeah, that’s a, actually I tweet about something similar
0:12:10 that a few months back and then somebody responded to me
0:12:11 saying, oh, I’m building that.
0:12:13 And I guess they like raised a little bit of money,
0:12:15 but then it’s already kind of like it didn’t work out
0:12:17 or something, I’m not sure.
0:12:18 I’ve also been wondering like,
0:12:20 why is super human not done this?
0:12:22 Maybe it’s just too different from their existing product,
0:12:24 but it feels like they should be doing that.
0:12:25 I don’t know.
0:12:26 – Yeah, you would say.
0:12:28 – Yeah, I can see that being super, super useful.
0:12:29 I mean, I run into the same kind of stuff, right?
0:12:32 Like I use the same email address for almost all of my stuff.
0:12:34 So I get emails from my kid’s school.
0:12:37 And also it’d be great if it worked across multiple inboxes,
0:12:37 right?
0:12:39 Like one of the things that I like about super human
0:12:41 is that I could just kind of quickly switch between tabs
0:12:43 of all my email accounts.
0:12:44 So it’d be cool if it was just like,
0:12:48 these are all my email addresses sort of across all those.
0:12:51 – Yeah, so the thing that works
0:12:55 and it’s already like pretty valuable is I can say,
0:12:58 and I do say, if it’s a cold inbound sales email,
0:13:00 put it in a folder and RPEB it.
0:13:01 – Yeah.
0:13:04 – Like that’s just something you can’t do, right?
0:13:06 Like you have to read it like,
0:13:07 oh, is this selling cold inbound sales email?
0:13:08 Yeah.
0:13:10 But if it’s a friend that I know and it’s working,
0:13:12 then like puts it in an inbox.
0:13:14 That’s a level of intent I want to offload, right?
0:13:16 And right now, even with same box,
0:13:17 you have to train it over time and says,
0:13:20 well, these are the specific important email addresses.
0:13:24 And it can’t really figure out if it’s cold, cold email.
0:13:27 It sort of does, but it’s not always super reliable.
0:13:29 And then you actually read an email
0:13:30 and do a pretty good trial of telling.
0:13:32 – So if anybody’s listening to this
0:13:34 and they’ve tried to cold email you with a pitch
0:13:36 and you never got back, now you know why.
0:13:38 (laughing)
0:13:40 – Just pretend like you’re his friend.
0:13:41 Just like, yeah.
0:13:42 – Don’t be mad, don’t be mad.
0:13:44 I do read, I do read kitchen emails.
0:13:44 – Oh, got you, got you.
0:13:45 Yeah, yeah, yeah.
0:13:46 (laughing)
0:13:48 – Well, damn, so my next one’s like very similar.
0:13:50 (laughing)
0:13:51 My next one’s basically like custom newsletter
0:13:53 where like, you know, you take different sources,
0:13:55 you’re getting an inbox, whether it’s newsletters
0:13:57 or other thing, you know, new podcast episodes
0:14:00 or whatever and kind of consolidating all that
0:14:01 into a single newsletter.
0:14:03 Now, I don’t know what the business model would be there,
0:14:04 ’cause like you’re kind of,
0:14:05 I guess you’re screwing over the newsletters
0:14:06 and you know, I have a newsletter,
0:14:09 Matt has a newsletter, so we probably (laughing)
0:14:10 don’t necessarily like this idea personally.
0:14:13 But as a, you know, as a business owner,
0:14:14 I don’t like it as an individual.
0:14:16 I would love to have something where I can just like,
0:14:18 here’s all the stuff that I actually care to learn from.
0:14:20 You know, the sub-stacks and different newsletters
0:14:23 and just give me a summary in one email every day
0:14:24 or every week or whatever I decide.
0:14:25 – Dude, I want that.
0:14:26 – Yeah.
0:14:28 – It’s actually not bad if you make it so that
0:14:30 I still have the subscriber to the sub-stack.
0:14:31 – You’re right.
0:14:32 – Yeah, I feel like it doesn’t exist, too.
0:14:33 I feel like I’ve seen,
0:14:35 I don’t know the name of the two off top of my head,
0:14:38 but I feel like I’ve seen something like that before.
0:14:41 – I know that, you know, I just say team kind of like
0:14:44 summarizes like the, it gives you a skiff it,
0:14:46 which is like kind of related.
0:14:50 But the idea of like, yeah, I also remember there was
0:14:52 something that like, we’ll create a podcast,
0:14:54 like a daily briefing out of your stuff
0:14:54 or something like that.
0:14:55 – Jelly pod.
0:14:57 There’s one called Jelly Pod that does that.
0:14:57 – It does that?
0:14:58 – Yeah.
0:14:59 – What does that do?
0:15:00 – So that one used to you,
0:15:01 they give you a specific email address.
0:15:04 You go and subscribe to newsletters with that email address.
0:15:06 And then it gives you a daily podcast
0:15:09 that sort of summarizes all of those newsletters
0:15:11 into a single audio.
0:15:12 Now there is one caveat.
0:15:15 They only let you subscribe, I think, to 10 newsletters.
0:15:18 And I subscribed to way more than 10 newsletters,
0:15:20 but if you can subscribe up to 10 newsletters on it
0:15:23 and every day it’ll like submit to your podcast feed.
0:15:25 So wherever you listen to podcasts,
0:15:27 it’ll, you know, it creates an RSS feed.
0:15:29 So you can actually listen to that podcast episode
0:15:32 and it breaks down everything that was in those 10 emails
0:15:34 in a little 10 minute briefing.
0:15:36 – That’s a great idea.
0:15:38 I literally have it open right now.
0:15:39 I’m gonna sign up for it.
0:15:42 It reminds me like, one of the tools are team built.
0:15:44 It’s a thing that just goes through
0:15:47 the last week’s worth of customer success calls
0:15:50 and it takes a transcript, summarizes it
0:15:53 and extracts insights.
0:15:56 And he turned it into a podcast using LebaLabs
0:15:58 with my voice as a deepfake.
0:16:00 So like every Monday you press play
0:16:02 and the likes of me tell you, you know what happened, Tork.
0:16:05 All the shit Tork was in your experience.
0:16:07 – That’s awesome.
0:16:09 For me, I think Feedly is another tool
0:16:11 that it’s like pretty underrated
0:16:12 that I don’t hear enough about,
0:16:16 but Feedly is a tool where you can subscribe to RSS feeds,
0:16:18 right, you can subscribe to your favorite blogs,
0:16:21 but it also gives you a custom email address.
0:16:23 So you can go and subscribe to newsletters
0:16:23 with Feedly.
0:16:26 So then every day you just open up your Feedly platform
0:16:29 and it’ll say, here’s all the newsletters that came across.
0:16:30 Here’s all that you should know
0:16:32 from all these various blogs.
0:16:35 So like, you know, I make a video every week of like,
0:16:37 here’s all of the AI news that came out
0:16:39 for this entire past week.
0:16:41 I pretty much just watch Feedly every day
0:16:42 to keep up with that stuff.
0:16:43 So I’m subscribed to Google’s blog,
0:16:47 open AI’s blog, Anthropics blog, stability AI’s blog.
0:16:49 You name it, I’m subscribed to their blog.
0:16:50 And then I’m also subscribed to like
0:16:53 every existing AI newsletter out there.
0:16:56 So every day I get sort of like, it’s not like a briefing,
0:16:57 I still have to kind of click through
0:16:58 each one one at a time,
0:17:01 but I have like a single point where I can go through
0:17:05 and like look at everything real quick and get caught up.
0:17:06 – Oh laser up.
0:17:07 – All right, so this is something that I think
0:17:09 is sort of inevitable,
0:17:12 but I’ve got these like frame glasses from Brilliant Labs.
0:17:14 I’m not sure if you guys have seen these before,
0:17:17 but they have like a little teeny tiny camera
0:17:18 right here on the front.
0:17:21 And they have like, you probably can’t tell on the camera,
0:17:23 but there’s like a little heads up display
0:17:25 on the right eye of it,
0:17:28 where like it will like scroll a little bit of text
0:17:29 across in front of your eyes.
0:17:31 So you can see text.
0:17:34 But one thing that I would, and this is open source too,
0:17:37 so anybody can develop with it or build on top of it,
0:17:39 however they want.
0:17:40 One thing I’d love to see,
0:17:42 first of all, better form factor.
0:17:43 These look like they’re straight out of Harry Potter,
0:17:46 but the second thing I’d love to see
0:17:50 is a face remembering app, right?
0:17:53 I wear these, I go meet somebody for the first time.
0:17:55 When I meet somebody, like there’s a code word,
0:17:58 if I say nice to meet you or something, right?
0:17:59 – Yeah.
0:18:00 – Snapshot of their face,
0:18:02 remember their face in the AI.
0:18:04 Then the next time I run into that person,
0:18:08 the little heads up display shows in my right eye,
0:18:09 oh, this is Siki Chin, right?
0:18:11 Like, so I walk up and I’m like,
0:18:13 hey, good to see you’re getting Siki, right?
0:18:17 Like, but I feel like you can build that with this thing here,
0:18:18 ’cause it’s got a little camera
0:18:21 and it’s got a little heads up display in one of your eyes.
0:18:25 So, you know, a little image recognition of people’s faces,
0:18:28 use, you know, maybe Google’s API that, you know,
0:18:31 it’s got the image recognition in it, you know?
0:18:34 Take pictures of people, remember their faces,
0:18:35 next time you run into them,
0:18:37 right across the little heads up display.
0:18:38 This is this person’s name,
0:18:40 so you never forget anybody’s names again.
0:18:41 I wanna see that being made.
0:18:43 And I feel like with these brilliant labs,
0:18:45 like open source tech,
0:18:47 somebody should be able to make that pretty easily.
0:18:49 I would imagine, I’m not a coder,
0:18:51 but I feel like it wouldn’t be too hard.
0:18:52 – I love it.
0:18:54 I guess the only question is like,
0:18:56 does Meta get there first with the Ray-Bans?
0:18:58 – Yeah, I’d be fine if Meta did it too.
0:18:59 I love the Ray-Bans.
0:19:00 (laughs)
0:19:03 It sounds like Meta’s next thing
0:19:05 that they’re gonna do with like the next iteration
0:19:08 of Ray-Bans is some more like augmented reality stuff.
0:19:11 They were going, they were gonna do like this giant,
0:19:13 this like new VR headset that was supposed to compete
0:19:14 with the Apple Vision Pro,
0:19:17 like a really high-end version of the Quest.
0:19:18 Well, they just scrapped that.
0:19:21 And it sounds like now they’re pushing,
0:19:23 because of how well sales have done on the Meta Ray-Bans,
0:19:25 they’re now pushing more into the Ray-Ban area.
0:19:28 And it sounds like they’re gonna start doing things like AR
0:19:30 and heads up display inside of the Ray-Bans
0:19:34 instead of making higher end virtual reality devices.
0:19:35 – I mean, that’s gonna be a huge opportunity
0:19:36 for some company to build.
0:19:37 – Yeah, that’s killer.
0:19:38 – Absolutely.
0:19:40 – I’ve always wanted that where like you could just see,
0:19:43 who they are, like if it’s good for your business or not,
0:19:44 like some kind of context there,
0:19:47 but it gets into like a really weird territory though, right?
0:19:49 It’s like almost like a black mirror where it’s like,
0:19:50 what’s their score?
0:19:52 Like, is this like a person I should talk to?
0:19:53 Or they’re like, totally irrelevant.
0:19:54 They’re like not worth it.
0:19:55 – Brothers, there’s just a lot of foreign out.
0:19:57 – Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
0:19:59 Not important, important, you know?
0:20:00 – Yeah.
0:20:03 – Can we be honest and say like the real reason why we want
0:20:06 that is like every other day we go out
0:20:08 and someone says hi and you’re like, I don’t know who it is.
0:20:09 – Yeah.
0:20:11 – Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
0:20:12 – Yeah.
0:20:14 Well, I mean, it can also save like additional data, right?
0:20:16 Like if you’re having a conversation,
0:20:18 but it does kind of get into that creepy area
0:20:21 of like how much is it recording and that kind of stuff,
0:20:23 but it could like remember kids’ names.
0:20:25 It can remember birthdays, remember, you know,
0:20:26 different stuff like that.
0:20:28 So when you’re having a conversation,
0:20:30 it all just sort of pops up on a little heads up display
0:20:33 for you so you can easily remember that stuff.
0:20:35 But I run into that all the time.
0:20:39 Like I go to like at least one conference a month
0:20:39 kind of thing.
0:20:41 Like I go to a lot of conferences
0:20:42 and I don’t know how many times I’ve gone to a conference
0:20:44 for somebody who’s like, hey, great to see you again.
0:20:46 And I’m like, yeah, you too.
0:20:47 And I have to look down at their name badge
0:20:49 and try to be discreet about it.
0:20:51 – Yeah.
0:20:52 – Do you wear the glasses in public
0:20:53 and do people get angry?
0:20:54 I’m wondering.
0:20:56 – I wear the Ray Bands in public all the time
0:20:58 because they just look like normal Ray Bands.
0:20:58 – Yeah.
0:21:01 – I wore Google Glass for like a month.
0:21:02 – Yeah.
0:21:03 – I mean, more and more devices are popping up
0:21:04 like that too, right?
0:21:06 Like there’s like earbuds coming out
0:21:07 that are going to like record you.
0:21:08 And they’ve got the-
0:21:09 – People just get used to it probably.
0:21:10 Like there’s not much use about it.
0:21:12 – Yeah, the pending and all that kind of stuff.
0:21:13 But yeah.
0:21:14 I mean, some of like, I don’t-
0:21:16 – Anyway, you know, you get used to the cell phone
0:21:17 when you’re out.
0:21:18 – Yeah, yeah.
0:21:19 – You’re out and you’re going to get in,
0:21:21 be in a picture of probably a bi-oxidant.
0:21:22 It sucks for you.
0:21:23 – I mean, literally everybody you see in public
0:21:25 has a device that can record your voice,
0:21:29 take pictures of you, take videos of you, everybody.
0:21:30 – I have another one.
0:21:31 I’m not going to go spicy yet.
0:21:32 I’m going to say that.
0:21:32 All right.
0:21:35 So this is a general category of products
0:21:37 I’m interested in,
0:21:42 which is like ways of exploring the lateness base of MenLM.
0:21:45 So WebSIN, you know, is like an example of that
0:21:47 where a hallucinator may see internet.
0:21:49 If you’re building really interesting things around that,
0:21:50 thought it was interesting.
0:21:51 Was this too far?
0:21:53 There’s a company that I recently invested in
0:21:56 called O1 Computer or Adaptive Computer.
0:21:58 And it’s kind of like a higher level Devon.
0:22:00 It can just make apps for you.
0:22:01 And one of the things you can build
0:22:06 just by asking it to build was a hallucinated Wikipedia.
0:22:07 So basically you can start with like anything
0:22:10 and it’ll create a Wikipedia Oracle and all the links work
0:22:14 and just keep on browsing it and say that.
0:22:16 I just think like generally those categories
0:22:17 of things are interesting.
0:22:20 Like being able to explore the lateness base
0:22:21 of a generative model, right?
0:22:22 You have an image.
0:22:25 I’m like, I want to go over there, right?
0:22:26 And this is where things are going
0:22:28 eventually become real time, right?
0:22:31 For example, there was a thing that I saw yesterday
0:22:35 where someone trained the future model on Doom one.
0:22:39 Like things get killed, you get fired a gun.
0:22:42 And we’re gonna go from like rendering pixels
0:22:44 just like losing the entire image, right?
0:22:45 On your computers.
0:22:48 I think that entire category of things is interesting.
0:22:51 I think someone making a generative Wikipedia
0:22:52 is also interesting.
0:22:54 There’s a few companies that are kind of like that
0:22:56 but not quite like that.
0:22:58 But I kind of like that idea quite a bit.
0:23:01 – Yeah, I mean, you can do something similar right now
0:23:02 with perplexity, right?
0:23:03 Like they’ve got their pages feature
0:23:05 where you could basically throw in any topic
0:23:07 and it essentially builds like a Wikipedia page.
0:23:09 But it’s not like hallucinating.
0:23:11 It is just going and finding the data
0:23:12 on the internet for you essentially.
0:23:13 – Yeah.
0:23:16 (upbeat music)
0:23:17 – We’ll be right back.
0:23:19 But first, I want to tell you about another great podcast
0:23:20 you’re gonna want to listen to.
0:23:24 It’s called Science of Scaling, hosted by Mark Roberge.
0:23:27 And it’s brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network,
0:23:30 the audio destination for business professionals.
0:23:32 Each week, host Mark Roberge,
0:23:34 founding chief revenue officer at HubSpot,
0:23:37 senior lecturer at Harvard Business School
0:23:39 and co-founder of Stage Two Capital,
0:23:42 sits down with the most successful sales leaders in tech
0:23:45 to learn the secrets, strategies and tactics
0:23:47 to scaling your company’s growth.
0:23:49 He recently did a great episode called,
0:23:52 how do you solve for a siloed marketing in sales?
0:23:54 And I personally learned a lot from it.
0:23:56 You’re going to want to check out the podcast,
0:23:58 listen to Science of Scaling,
0:24:00 wherever you get your podcasts.
0:24:03 (upbeat music)
0:24:04 – I think what fascinates me
0:24:06 is like more of the emotive interaction, right?
0:24:09 Like that still requires you to ask us something
0:24:12 and this idea of like just be able to click
0:24:16 or look around to browse a query interface
0:24:17 is like super interesting.
0:24:18 That’s what I’d like.
0:24:20 I think WebSend is the first thing
0:24:22 that I’ve seen that did this, right?
0:24:23 Well, I just made it a hyperlink
0:24:26 so that you click instead of having to type anything.
0:24:29 I just think there’s like a whole area
0:24:32 of unexplored product possibilities around this idea
0:24:35 of other ways to generate prompts
0:24:37 and explore the latent space.
0:24:39 – Yeah, the doom one’s so interesting.
0:24:41 It’s almost like you’re moving through a dream, right?
0:24:43 Like it’s like dreaming up everything in the world
0:24:44 as you’re moving through it.
0:24:46 It’s like that is so amazing.
0:24:47 We have nothing like that currently.
0:24:50 – Well, I mean, some people would argue
0:24:51 that’s what’s happening right now.
0:24:52 (all laughing)
0:24:53 – Right, right now?
0:24:55 Like right now.
0:24:57 – Yeah, the simulation we’re in, you mean?
0:24:59 (all laughing)
0:25:01 Yeah, there’s a wall in front of me right now.
0:25:03 I think I know it’s on the other side of the wall,
0:25:05 but I’m not on the other side of the wall.
0:25:06 So I don’t know.
0:25:08 – Don’t say simulation three times.
0:25:10 We may get exited out of it.
0:25:11 So I think it’s fine.
0:25:16 – Yeah, there’s an AI art tool.
0:25:18 I don’t think I’m allowed to say the name of it
0:25:20 ’cause I don’t think they publicly announced
0:25:21 that this is coming yet.
0:25:23 But there’s a tool that’s essentially
0:25:26 an exploration of like a diffusion model
0:25:28 where you enter a prompt into it.
0:25:29 And when you enter a prompt,
0:25:32 it will basically generate like an infinite number
0:25:34 of images with that prompt
0:25:36 that you can sort of infinitely scroll through.
0:25:40 So in real time, it’ll just keep on popping up new images
0:25:41 generated by that prompt.
0:25:43 And then if you click on one of the images,
0:25:46 it now uses that image that you just clicked on
0:25:48 as an image reference.
0:25:49 And then it starts a whole new page
0:25:51 with this is your image reference.
0:25:54 And then you can sort of infinitely scroll new images
0:25:56 based on this new image reference.
0:25:57 And you can sort of get lost in it for hours
0:25:59 just clicking, oh, I like this image.
0:26:02 And the idea being that eventually
0:26:05 you can find the absolute perfect ideal image
0:26:08 for what you were going for with that prompt
0:26:09 by just scrolling and clicking on the ones
0:26:12 that are closest to what you’re looking for.
0:26:13 And then once you find the one you’re looking for,
0:26:16 you now know the seed, the prompt, everything you need
0:26:19 to know to regenerate that image again and again.
0:26:20 I need that.
0:26:22 – Yeah, it’s coming, it’s coming.
0:26:24 – Dianne, we need the thing after the show.
0:26:25 I need to use it. – Yes, for sure.
0:26:27 – That’s hallucinating Pinterest, right?
0:26:29 And I think like in general,
0:26:32 like this idea of taking a known product
0:26:35 and product interaction and just hallucinating it,
0:26:39 whether it’s a browser, Wikipedia, Pinterest is amazing.
0:26:41 Yeah, I love the whole class of ideas.
0:26:43 – Yeah, that’s gonna be fun.
0:26:45 It’s also just going to be a new addiction
0:26:47 for a lot of people, I think.
0:26:48 All right, Nathan.
0:26:49 The next one to be, you know,
0:26:51 back in the day, Code Academy was really popular.
0:26:54 I don’t know if it maybe still is, I have no idea.
0:26:56 But it feels like that was an idea where it was a great idea.
0:26:58 You know, it basically was a site
0:26:59 that helped you learn how to code,
0:27:01 kind of walked you through everything, you know,
0:27:03 and really simplified down, learned code.
0:27:04 It was always a great idea,
0:27:07 but I feel like it never was fully properly executed on.
0:27:09 Like, I don’t think it reached its full potential,
0:27:10 like of the idea.
0:27:13 And it feels like now with AI you could, you know?
0:27:14 Like, I don’t know if you saw that video
0:27:15 from a few days ago,
0:27:19 with like the eight-year-old girl using a cursor to code
0:27:20 and making like a little Harry Potter website and stuff.
0:27:22 I was like, that is so cool.
0:27:24 And that girl must be very intelligent.
0:27:26 ‘Cause like it, ’cause even, you know, at age,
0:27:28 using cursor is still hard, I think.
0:27:30 For an eight-year-old, it’s very hard.
0:27:32 She’s definitely a very intelligent child.
0:27:34 And so it feels like there’s something for, you know,
0:27:36 a more mainstream audience where anyone like,
0:27:38 hey, you can actually code now.
0:27:40 Like it can actually help you and like,
0:27:41 kind of walk you through that
0:27:43 of making some simple product or simple website
0:27:45 and just showing you, you can do it.
0:27:46 And teaching you.
0:27:47 It feels like there’s some kind of opportunity there.
0:27:48 And yeah, I’m kind of surprised.
0:27:50 I haven’t seen anyone do that yet.
0:27:51 – Yeah, yeah.
0:27:52 And it would be like generative, right?
0:27:54 So like everybody who uses the program
0:27:56 is sort of developing something different.
0:27:57 As opposed to like Code Academy,
0:28:00 which Code Academy would walk you through, you know,
0:28:02 everybody’s basically building the same thing, right?
0:28:04 That’s just a set tutorial.
0:28:06 I feel like you can have something that’s generative
0:28:09 where everybody that goes through this program
0:28:10 builds something unique, right?
0:28:12 It’s something completely different every time.
0:28:14 You might even, at the end of the program,
0:28:18 have something that is, you know, launchable,
0:28:21 something that you can actually put out into the world.
0:28:23 – And you can have a community aspect too,
0:28:24 or maybe like you actually share what you built
0:28:26 and everyone can kind of see all that kind of stuff.
0:28:27 – I like it.
0:28:28 – It can be kind of cool.
0:28:29 – I’ve been trying to, you know,
0:28:33 do all kinds of things to get my older daughter
0:28:34 is 10 now into coding.
0:28:36 So we’re on Hof scotch.
0:28:37 We did Code Academy.
0:28:39 We have chat should be tea.
0:28:41 I gave her wigs to make a website.
0:28:45 And over Christmas, I was traveling with a friend
0:28:49 and they have a kid and they decided if his were in Japan,
0:28:52 they wanted to make a video game
0:28:54 that was a cross between Gundam and Transformers
0:28:56 called Transim.
0:28:58 So the youth team asked, all right,
0:29:00 how do we make a game or a role of the game?
0:29:02 What is a cross between Transformers
0:29:04 gonna look like that we generate an image?
0:29:07 They downloaded a, yeah, they downloaded Unity.
0:29:09 They downloaded Unity and started working on this game.
0:29:12 They not only got by far, but they got like way further
0:29:14 on their own than I think any a year old would have
0:29:17 without, you know, AI.
0:29:19 I think that’s great.
0:29:22 My fourth idea, I didn’t talk about his third,
0:29:23 but just picking off what you said,
0:29:28 I think this general class of almost like an AI nanny
0:29:31 where, you know, you have these tools are kind of passive,
0:29:33 but if you can have something that
0:29:35 Interactive’s board is like, hey,
0:29:38 let’s learn about X or what do you want to do, right?
0:29:40 And it’ll just like interact and talk with you
0:29:42 and like, it’ll let you hallucinate with the AI.
0:29:45 I think that’s also super interesting.
0:29:46 – Yeah, yeah.
0:29:47 I mean, something like that’s a lot better, I think,
0:29:49 than, you know, setting them down with an iPad
0:29:53 or a Nintendo Switch and just saying here, go play Roblox.
0:29:57 – I think there’s like some companies are doing dolls
0:29:59 that are all generated and more interactive,
0:30:01 but I’m very pro this idea.
0:30:04 Like inverting the chat GBT interaction pattern,
0:30:07 which is having to talk to you,
0:30:08 not waiting for you to talk to them.
0:30:10 I think there is so much on tap potential
0:30:11 and just boosting that.
0:30:13 – Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely.
0:30:14 – Yeah, I would love to have that for my son
0:30:17 and like have it where, okay, you can’t use your PC
0:30:19 until you’ve actually like done this.
0:30:21 Like you can’t like, here’s a little project, go do it.
0:30:23 Now you, now yeah, you can watch YouTube
0:30:24 for 30 minutes or whatever.
0:30:25 – There you go.
0:30:26 Yes, some sort of locking mechanism
0:30:31 where the games unlock once you finish your tasks.
0:30:32 – Yeah, I don’t know.
0:30:33 Oh, it’s good.
0:30:34 – Very cool.
0:30:37 Any other ideas we want to throw out there?
0:30:39 – I want to, we’re out.
0:30:40 – No time.
0:30:41 All right.
0:30:43 It’s actually not that spicy.
0:30:46 And it’s gonna sound stupid, but hear me out.
0:30:47 Okay.
0:30:47 – Okay.
0:30:48 – My girlfriend.
0:30:50 But, and I know it’s not new.
0:30:52 – I was gonna say yeah.
0:30:53 – Okay.
0:30:54 – Relax, relax.
0:30:55 Okay, that’s cool.
0:30:58 So there’s character AI and in friend,
0:31:00 all these things are like doing AI girlfriends, right?
0:31:05 So here’s a thing that I think is going to print money
0:31:06 if someone does this.
0:31:07 You sign up for your AI girlfriend,
0:31:11 but the interface and all the interactions look real.
0:31:15 So it’s not like character AI where you’re like,
0:31:17 I’m gonna create my ideal waifu
0:31:19 and this is what she’s gonna look like.
0:31:22 And I’m gonna generate some images and some personalities.
0:31:25 Instead, it looks exactly like Tinder
0:31:26 and you’re suddenly left and right.
0:31:29 And very similar to your idea,
0:31:31 the other product where you’re finding
0:31:34 the exact right image is that, but for your waifu.
0:31:36 – Yeah, yeah.
0:31:39 – And then like you’re selecting and slapping right
0:31:41 and based on the slapping left and right,
0:31:44 it’s learning what about what your ideal waifu looks like
0:31:46 and is like, because it’s a generated personality.
0:31:50 It’s a generated image, generated location, everything.
0:31:52 And then once you start right, you match
0:31:54 and then you have to have some conversation with them.
0:31:57 And then in the background,
0:32:01 the system will create a generated Instagram profile,
0:32:03 trade an ID, or WhatsApp account,
0:32:08 and then it will actually text you as this person.
0:32:10 It’ll DM you over Instagram as this person.
0:32:12 And now you have a virtual girlfriend,
0:32:16 but it feels real in every virtual channel that you have.
0:32:17 – Yeah, yeah.
0:32:19 – It can even, over time, you can have a Zoom call
0:32:21 and what happens when you call, who knows?
0:32:26 But like, you can real time generate all this stuff
0:32:28 and not have it just be like this weird bot thing
0:32:30 that you’re making and it feels pretty real.
0:32:33 – Yeah, I feel like all of the technology exists right now
0:32:34 to make that happen.
0:32:36 It’s just combining all the parts.
0:32:38 – Yeah, exactly, it’s surely a front and front.
0:32:41 – Yeah, yeah, ’cause you’ve got like render net, right?
0:32:43 Where you can upload like some images of a face
0:32:46 and it’ll make sure that character stays consistent
0:32:48 every time and you’ve got the tools
0:32:49 that can turn them into videos
0:32:51 and you’ve got the tools that can do the voice.
0:32:53 I feel like it’s just a matter of somebody
0:32:56 mashing all the tools together to get that thing.
0:32:57 – Yeah, it’s like Instagram, right?
0:33:00 You’re browsing Instagram and all the attractive people
0:33:01 are attracted to you.
0:33:03 That’s basically it.
0:33:04 – Oh, I like it.
0:33:07 Yeah, I mean, it does bring up some additional questions
0:33:11 of like, where does that take humanity
0:33:14 if like everybody just gets their ideal digital girlfriend
0:33:17 because then, you know, reproduction could potentially.
0:33:22 – I mean, I do think my sense about my mental model
0:33:26 of how value is created in that PoE to say a world,
0:33:29 I think humanity is gonna adapt like pretty quickly.
0:33:34 Like, we have infinite adult videos online, right?
0:33:39 And I think in that world, we are bio biologically,
0:33:42 we’re just evolved to play status games.
0:33:45 And I think it’s very hard to override biology
0:33:47 even with the best of tools.
0:33:49 And I think we’re just gonna value things that are real more.
0:33:50 – Yeah, yeah, yeah.
0:33:53 – I actually don’t think it’s gonna be like
0:33:54 as bad as people think, you know, people are like,
0:33:56 “Oh, we have VR headsets, who are doing the media VR?”
0:33:57 And looking at her wife, it was like,
0:33:58 “No, if you weren’t doing that.”
0:33:59 – Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
0:34:00 – There are probably things too
0:34:03 that I use AI to actually help connect people too.
0:34:04 Like, I think that’ll probably be a thing like,
0:34:06 probably in the future, the governments be like,
0:34:07 “Oh, shit, this is like a big problem.
0:34:09 We need to like have huge incentives
0:34:11 for getting married and having kids.”
0:34:12 They’ll probably make huge incentives.
0:34:14 And then there’ll probably be AI apps that like help you,
0:34:16 like, “Here’s your personality type.”
0:34:19 And here, go chat with this virtual version of this,
0:34:21 you know, girl who’s like a real girl, real person,
0:34:23 and you’re a good match.
0:34:24 And then maybe you should actually meet them.
0:34:26 I think we’ll have stuff like that too.
0:34:28 So maybe that’ll kind of counterbalance all of this.
0:34:29 – Yeah, AI waifus.
0:34:31 – It could be like a net positive for humanity too,
0:34:33 ’cause when you think of like the adult film industry,
0:34:35 there’s a lot of exploitation,
0:34:36 a lot of human trafficking,
0:34:37 a lot of that kind of stuff, right?
0:34:40 So, I mean, maybe it does turn out to be
0:34:42 a net positive in that sense.
0:34:44 I mean, you look at adult websites,
0:34:45 nobody ever looks at them.
0:34:47 Yes, somehow, Pornhub’s always in the top 10
0:34:48 of all most visited sites.
0:34:50 – That’s so weird.
0:34:52 – So weird how that happens when nobody uses it.
0:34:55 – You have these videos, it’s crazy.
0:34:57 – Well, I think these are all great ideas.
0:35:00 And I think anybody listening to this episode,
0:35:01 if you go and invent any of these,
0:35:04 I think Zicky’s gonna invest, that’s what I’m hearing.
0:35:06 – Yeah, I actually would.
0:35:07 – That was the agreement, so that’s why he’s here.
0:35:09 – That’s a good priority now.
0:35:12 ‘Cause like, I just like, I talk to founders,
0:35:13 I talk to founders like, maybe you should,
0:35:16 like, this is like a much better idea
0:35:17 than what you’re doing.
0:35:19 – Before we do wrap it up though,
0:35:22 is there anywhere you want people to go check you out?
0:35:24 I mean, is X the best place to follow you?
0:35:27 LinkedIn, like, where should people go after hearing about?
0:35:28 – One out of that.
0:35:30 All of my LinkedIn content is ghost written,
0:35:33 so probably you won’t follow me on X instead.
0:35:36 – And what’s your X profile?
0:35:39 – I’m Blader, B-L-A-D-E-R,
0:35:42 and my company is Runway.com, not OneWayML.com,
0:35:44 Runway.com. – The Runway, yeah.
0:35:48 – Yeah, so if you’re a mid-sized, larger company,
0:35:50 and you want to have better view of finances,
0:35:52 we run the finance departments,
0:35:55 the finance models of Superhuman
0:35:57 and Sable the Fusion, actually,
0:36:00 and Angelist and Lambda AI and Superhuman
0:36:02 and a bunch of other companies like that, so.
0:36:03 – Very cool, very cool.
0:36:06 Well, check those out, everybody who’s listening in,
0:36:07 and yeah, I really, really appreciate you
0:36:09 spending the time with us.
0:36:10 If you are tuning into this episode
0:36:13 and you want to hear more conversations like this
0:36:16 and hear more business ideas and AI use cases
0:36:16 and all that fun stuff,
0:36:19 make sure you subscribe over on the YouTubes
0:36:21 or wherever you listen to podcasts.
0:36:22 And Ziggy, thanks again.
0:36:25 (upbeat music)
0:36:27 (upbeat music)
0:36:30 (upbeat music)
0:36:32 (upbeat music)
0:36:35 (upbeat music)
0:36:38 (upbeat music)
0:36:40 (upbeat music)
0:36:42 you
0:00:06 – Hey, welcome to the Next Wave Podcast.
0:00:06 I’m Matt Wolf.
0:00:08 I’m here with Nathan Lanz.
0:00:11 And once again, we’ve got an amazing episode for you.
0:00:12 In this episode, we’re gonna break down
0:00:15 some business ideas that leverage AI
0:00:18 that we wish existed that don’t exist yet.
0:00:21 So ideally, people listening to this episode
0:00:24 will go and maybe build some of these things
0:00:25 ’cause these are ideas that we think
0:00:27 there’s some money behind.
0:00:29 – Today we have a Siki Chin on.
0:00:30 He originally was in the game industry,
0:00:32 so he created a startup called Serious Business
0:00:37 that he sold to Zynga for a ton of money back in the day.
0:00:39 And since then, he’s been one of the most prominent
0:00:41 angel investors in Silicon Valley.
0:00:44 He’s now running Runway.com, which is a great startup.
0:00:46 – Yeah, so this is legitimately
0:00:48 one of the most fun conversations I think we’ve had
0:00:50 on this show where me, Nathan, and Siki,
0:00:53 we just sort of bounce ideas off each other for businesses.
0:00:56 And as we share ideas, the ideas just ramp up more
0:00:59 and more and more and get spicier and spicier
0:01:01 to the last one, which I think is gonna blow
0:01:02 some people’s minds.
0:01:04 I mean, I know it scared me a little bit
0:01:06 when he gave the idea.
0:01:08 We get into some crazier and crazier ideas
0:01:10 as this episode goes on.
0:01:12 So check this episode out.
0:01:14 It’s probably gonna give you some ideas
0:01:17 for spin-off businesses or ways that you can use AI
0:01:19 at your business that you’re not thinking of
0:01:22 or businesses that you can potentially go build.
0:01:25 But it is a fun episode, a fascinating episode.
0:01:26 I think you’re really gonna enjoy it.
0:01:28 So let’s dive in with Siki Chen.
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0:02:09 and make your campaign results hotter than ever.
0:02:12 Visit hubspot.com/marketers to learn more.
0:02:15 (upbeat music)
0:02:18 – Hey Siki, thanks for coming on today.
0:02:20 – Hey Nathan, thanks for having me.
0:02:21 – Yeah, I guess first it’d be good to give people
0:02:23 some context of like why you’re here,
0:02:24 how you got on the show,
0:02:27 and you know a little bit about how we know each other.
0:02:29 – Yeah, funnily enough, I thought I was here
0:02:31 because I tweet about AI,
0:02:34 and I’d have, you know, people would follow me
0:02:35 on Twitter or whatever.
0:02:36 – Yeah.
0:02:37 – But as it turns out, I was just reminded
0:02:39 that the reason why I’m here is,
0:02:41 you announced you had a podcast.
0:02:42 That’s why I’m here.
0:02:43 I invited myself.
0:02:46 (laughing)
0:02:49 – So cool, so I mean, we were thinking the day
0:02:50 we really want to try something new.
0:02:53 Just like share AI business ideas,
0:02:54 you know, some of them may be great,
0:02:55 some of them may suck.
0:02:56 – Sounds good, I keep prepared.
0:02:57 – Awesome.
0:02:59 Let’s go ahead and talk about some of these business ideas.
0:03:01 I think we should start with Nathan,
0:03:02 ’cause I know Nathan’s got three lined up,
0:03:04 and again, if they suck,
0:03:06 the comments section will let us know.
0:03:08 – Yeah, so my first idea was just, you know,
0:03:09 it actually comes back,
0:03:11 I think the last time we met Siki was in Hong Kong,
0:03:13 is that the last time we met in person?
0:03:14 And that was back when I was,
0:03:16 when I was partying with Barry Osborn,
0:03:18 you know, the producer of Lord of the Rings, The Matrix,
0:03:19 I was trying to create this crazy
0:03:21 crypto-funded movie studio,
0:03:23 and you know, we were going out to New Zealand,
0:03:25 Hollywood a lot together, like me and Barry,
0:03:28 and I got this tour of Weta when I was out in New Zealand,
0:03:29 and it was amazing.
0:03:30 I was blown away by it.
0:03:34 You know, I got to hold Aragorn Sword, Weta Workshop,
0:03:35 and also like seeing their business,
0:03:36 like how much money they make,
0:03:37 just making all the special effects
0:03:39 and stuff for movie studios.
0:03:41 It’s like, that’s a great business.
0:03:43 And now that you’ve got AI video,
0:03:44 it feels like there’s an opportunity
0:03:46 for like almost like a Weta for like AI video, right?
0:03:48 We’re all the, you know,
0:03:51 whether it’s in movies or TV or games
0:03:52 to go out there and be like the shop
0:03:57 that specializes in creating AI videos for films.
0:03:58 But yeah, I don’t have much to say about it beyond that,
0:03:59 but that’s the idea.
0:04:01 So good, interesting, sucks.
0:04:04 – Oh, I don’t know.
0:04:05 I’m not sure how much I could say.
0:04:08 There isn’t much, but I think it’s a great idea.
0:04:08 – Yeah.
0:04:11 – I am aware of some new companies
0:04:13 that I’m not allowed to disclose doing this
0:04:15 with very credible people.
0:04:18 But a thing I can talk about though is related,
0:04:21 which is there’s a company called NIN video
0:04:26 and it started by this guy, Yuri, who ran Superdow
0:04:29 and very credible founder, raised a lot of money.
0:04:33 And the entire idea is the state of the arch
0:04:36 for generative models is going to be open source.
0:04:40 And so you’re going to need professional grade workflow tools
0:04:42 to orchestrate all of these.
0:04:44 So, you know, you want something more fine-grained
0:04:47 than what runway ML alone can provide you.
0:04:50 And he’s getting started with that.
0:04:51 It’s got a bunch of traders on a platform.
0:04:54 So this idea of professionalizing in general,
0:04:58 a AI tools and special effects, I think it’s huge.
0:05:01 – I guess my question though is like,
0:05:05 how close are we to not necessarily needing an agency
0:05:07 where you’re just enter the prompt of like,
0:05:09 here’s the video I need.
0:05:11 And it gives it back to you that, you know,
0:05:13 the agency is just like a middleman
0:05:15 that people don’t need anymore.
0:05:16 – There’s a very related question,
0:05:19 how we think about AI and our own product at runway.
0:05:23 So we build like this finance platform and, you know,
0:05:27 there’s a lot of people who use AI to make finance better,
0:05:29 whether it’s like planning or modeling.
0:05:31 And our very particular philosophy on this
0:05:36 is that the best use of AI in this curriculum is today.
0:05:37 And I think also in the future,
0:05:40 it as a tool for a spot rather than a tool
0:05:42 that does the thinking for you.
0:05:44 And I think when I think about like anything creative,
0:05:47 I think apparently most things that you do are creative,
0:05:50 whether it’s like finance business or like creating a movie.
0:05:53 Like you would rather have something
0:05:55 that helps you offload your intent,
0:05:57 your creative intent faster.
0:06:00 And that’s like, I think what AI can do at its best.
0:06:03 I’m a little bit less bullish on the AI
0:06:05 is just gonna do it all for you.
0:06:08 Until, you know, when ASI happens,
0:06:09 like I think we can live in that world.
0:06:11 But until that point, tools for thought
0:06:14 is my bet on good AI products.
0:06:15 – Yeah, yeah.
0:06:15 And I mean–
0:06:16 – Yeah, and if ASI happens,
0:06:17 we probably don’t have to worry about
0:06:19 having an agency or money anyways, right?
0:06:19 So it’s like–
0:06:21 (laughing)
0:06:23 – Yeah, and I mean, like right now you’ve got AI art tools,
0:06:25 you’ve got AI video tools, you got runway,
0:06:26 you got gen three.
0:06:28 There’s some people who somehow managed
0:06:30 to get really amazing stuff out of it.
0:06:32 And then a lot of people who,
0:06:33 no matter what they do, can’t get anything good.
0:06:35 So I mean, even using AI,
0:06:37 there seems to be some level of skill
0:06:40 to get really good stuff out of them, you know?
0:06:42 – I should clarify this, you mentioned runway.
0:06:45 I am the founder of runway ML, which is the one
0:06:48 that makes the videos.
0:06:50 Again, I run a company called runway.com
0:06:52 and we’re forming this platform.
0:06:53 – The real runway.
0:06:54 – You’ve got the better domain name.
0:06:56 (laughing)
0:06:58 – Yeah, people get the two COVID-19 issues all the time.
0:06:59 It’s actually really wild.
0:07:05 – So I guess I’ll share my first business idea.
0:07:06 It’s actually the second on my list,
0:07:09 but it’s related to video, so I’ll share this one first.
0:07:11 And it’s something that I wish I had,
0:07:12 and it may exist.
0:07:14 So if it does exist, feel free to share.
0:07:18 But I want a tool where I can take
0:07:19 like video footage out in the wild.
0:07:22 Let’s say I’m like going on vacation with the family
0:07:24 and I take video with the family
0:07:27 and I record like a roll of me talking to my camera
0:07:31 or I find stock footage on a website.
0:07:32 And I just wanna be able to take
0:07:34 all of this video footage that I have
0:07:36 loaded into some sort of platform,
0:07:40 have AI like scan all of the content for me
0:07:43 and then give it tags, give it descriptions.
0:07:46 And right now it’s easy to do if there’s like talking, right?
0:07:49 It can obviously transcribe the audio
0:07:50 and then figure out tags and stuff.
0:07:53 But I want something where I can throw videos
0:07:56 of just like me filming the Eiffel Tower
0:07:59 or me filming my family running on the beach.
0:08:01 And I throw it in there and it watches the video
0:08:05 and organizes with tags and descriptions
0:08:07 based on the content of the video.
0:08:09 That way when I’m going to like make my YouTube videos,
0:08:11 I can go in and say my family on the beach
0:08:14 and you’re like find that video for me and surface it.
0:08:17 And it feels like something that should exist,
0:08:19 but I haven’t found it yet.
0:08:22 And that’s something I really, really want to see exist.
0:08:24 It’s just something that I could just dump
0:08:28 tons of video content in and have it sort, organize, tag
0:08:30 and just make searchable for me.
0:08:32 – A few things come to mind.
0:08:34 I saw where we were going is you just want a bunch of clips
0:08:36 that haven’t just edited the video for you.
0:08:38 – No, I actually like the editing process.
0:08:40 For me, that’s like where the creativity lies
0:08:41 that I enjoy doing.
0:08:44 But I have a hard time when I shoot like hours and hours
0:08:46 and hours of footage while I’m at an event
0:08:48 and then come home and then look for the specific clips
0:08:50 that I need to pull my video together.
0:08:54 – So I don’t know of specific products that do exactly that.
0:08:57 The closest thing I didn’t think of though is Google Photos.
0:08:57 – Yeah, I was gonna say that.
0:08:59 I think Google will do this, right?
0:09:01 ‘Cause Google does it for photos already, so.
0:09:03 – It does work for video too already.
0:09:04 – Oh, does it?
0:09:07 – So you can search for like sushi, text, beach.
0:09:10 – I have not tried Google Photos for that.
0:09:11 So maybe.
0:09:13 So it could be a horrible business idea
0:09:14 if Google’s already doing it.
0:09:19 – I mean, I do think the idea of like generally
0:09:21 you have a bunch of close and will make stuff for you
0:09:23 or help you tag it as a great one.
0:09:26 I know Captions is, you know, the most,
0:09:27 there’s a closest company to that.
0:09:30 I’m not sure how much it does of organizing
0:09:33 or treating for you, but the tools it has like really good
0:09:34 and it’s doable on your phone.
0:09:35 – Yeah.
0:09:36 – That’s the first one I would think about.
0:09:38 – Captions may have even been the company,
0:09:40 ’cause I actually put this idea on Twitter.
0:09:41 – I don’t know.
0:09:43 – It’s been several months and a company jumped in
0:09:45 and said, “Oh, we’re working on this wink, wink.”
0:09:48 And I feel like it might have actually been Captions.
0:09:48 – Yeah.
0:09:50 I’d be surprised if they weren’t.
0:09:52 That sounds like right up there.
0:09:53 Yeah, Ali.
0:09:54 – Yeah, yeah.
0:09:54 Cool.
0:09:55 Siki, your turn.
0:09:56 – Okay.
0:10:00 So not so I see one, but very practical.
0:10:03 I use a service called Stainbox
0:10:06 and it’s an email prioritizer filter
0:10:07 and it’s really good.
0:10:10 I just apply a label to my emails
0:10:12 and it’ll know, okay, if this type of email
0:10:15 is in the subperson, I’m gonna put it later
0:10:17 or I’m gonna black hole it, never see it again.
0:10:19 Or I can create a custom label.
0:10:21 It’s just really good at what it does.
0:10:23 It’s been around for like 15 years,
0:10:25 got all kinds of like little features.
0:10:28 What I love about it is a primary interface is Gino,
0:10:31 because you don’t actually interact with the website really.
0:10:33 You just set it up once and then you just apply labels
0:10:34 and then just automatically learn.
0:10:37 And it’ll pick up like, and you’re training it, right?
0:10:38 And the way you untrain it,
0:10:40 just like we still can’t get your box.
0:10:41 And I was like, oh, this is actually cool.
0:10:45 So what I want, and I wanted this so bad,
0:10:48 I actually built a crappier version of this myself
0:10:52 using Zapier, is I wanted to be able to categorize my emails
0:10:54 automatically in unstructured ways.
0:10:58 So I wanna say, hey, all of the really intellectual
0:11:01 smart substacks should go here.
0:11:04 And everything related to my kids should go this folder
0:11:07 and my kids’ school stuff and homework should go here.
0:11:10 And everything from our investors should go there.
0:11:11 And I don’t want to, you know,
0:11:14 you don’t want to maintain like a running list
0:11:15 of this stuff.
0:11:17 You just wanna say, this is my intent.
0:11:20 So I have a Zap that does this.
0:11:24 It reads every single email and I have a giant prompt
0:11:25 that describes all the labels
0:11:28 and all of the descriptions of the labels
0:11:31 and it’ll actually go and apply the labels.
0:11:31 It’s not great.
0:11:33 The thing that is missing is,
0:11:35 and it’s not much you do to work on this,
0:11:37 but I just wish someone would build this for me,
0:11:42 which is I want to learn and rag it
0:11:45 as I’m changing the labels, right?
0:11:46 So if it gets something wrong,
0:11:47 I want it to just say, oh, well, this is,
0:11:49 I got this wrong, I’m gonna update the prompts.
0:11:51 I think that’ll just be super useful
0:11:54 instead of supporting emails by like domain or person,
0:11:58 I could just ascribe the vibes of the email I want
0:12:00 and I’ll know what to show me, where to put it.
0:12:04 And that’s my not spicy idea as the one is not.
0:12:06 – Yeah, that’s a, actually I tweet about something similar
0:12:10 that a few months back and then somebody responded to me
0:12:11 saying, oh, I’m building that.
0:12:13 And I guess they like raised a little bit of money,
0:12:15 but then it’s already kind of like it didn’t work out
0:12:17 or something, I’m not sure.
0:12:18 I’ve also been wondering like,
0:12:20 why is super human not done this?
0:12:22 Maybe it’s just too different from their existing product,
0:12:24 but it feels like they should be doing that.
0:12:25 I don’t know.
0:12:26 – Yeah, you would say.
0:12:28 – Yeah, I can see that being super, super useful.
0:12:29 I mean, I run into the same kind of stuff, right?
0:12:32 Like I use the same email address for almost all of my stuff.
0:12:34 So I get emails from my kid’s school.
0:12:37 And also it’d be great if it worked across multiple inboxes,
0:12:37 right?
0:12:39 Like one of the things that I like about super human
0:12:41 is that I could just kind of quickly switch between tabs
0:12:43 of all my email accounts.
0:12:44 So it’d be cool if it was just like,
0:12:48 these are all my email addresses sort of across all those.
0:12:51 – Yeah, so the thing that works
0:12:55 and it’s already like pretty valuable is I can say,
0:12:58 and I do say, if it’s a cold inbound sales email,
0:13:00 put it in a folder and RPEB it.
0:13:01 – Yeah.
0:13:04 – Like that’s just something you can’t do, right?
0:13:06 Like you have to read it like,
0:13:07 oh, is this selling cold inbound sales email?
0:13:08 Yeah.
0:13:10 But if it’s a friend that I know and it’s working,
0:13:12 then like puts it in an inbox.
0:13:14 That’s a level of intent I want to offload, right?
0:13:16 And right now, even with same box,
0:13:17 you have to train it over time and says,
0:13:20 well, these are the specific important email addresses.
0:13:24 And it can’t really figure out if it’s cold, cold email.
0:13:27 It sort of does, but it’s not always super reliable.
0:13:29 And then you actually read an email
0:13:30 and do a pretty good trial of telling.
0:13:32 – So if anybody’s listening to this
0:13:34 and they’ve tried to cold email you with a pitch
0:13:36 and you never got back, now you know why.
0:13:38 (laughing)
0:13:40 – Just pretend like you’re his friend.
0:13:41 Just like, yeah.
0:13:42 – Don’t be mad, don’t be mad.
0:13:44 I do read, I do read kitchen emails.
0:13:44 – Oh, got you, got you.
0:13:45 Yeah, yeah, yeah.
0:13:46 (laughing)
0:13:48 – Well, damn, so my next one’s like very similar.
0:13:50 (laughing)
0:13:51 My next one’s basically like custom newsletter
0:13:53 where like, you know, you take different sources,
0:13:55 you’re getting an inbox, whether it’s newsletters
0:13:57 or other thing, you know, new podcast episodes
0:14:00 or whatever and kind of consolidating all that
0:14:01 into a single newsletter.
0:14:03 Now, I don’t know what the business model would be there,
0:14:04 ’cause like you’re kind of,
0:14:05 I guess you’re screwing over the newsletters
0:14:06 and you know, I have a newsletter,
0:14:09 Matt has a newsletter, so we probably (laughing)
0:14:10 don’t necessarily like this idea personally.
0:14:13 But as a, you know, as a business owner,
0:14:14 I don’t like it as an individual.
0:14:16 I would love to have something where I can just like,
0:14:18 here’s all the stuff that I actually care to learn from.
0:14:20 You know, the sub-stacks and different newsletters
0:14:23 and just give me a summary in one email every day
0:14:24 or every week or whatever I decide.
0:14:25 – Dude, I want that.
0:14:26 – Yeah.
0:14:28 – It’s actually not bad if you make it so that
0:14:30 I still have the subscriber to the sub-stack.
0:14:31 – You’re right.
0:14:32 – Yeah, I feel like it doesn’t exist, too.
0:14:33 I feel like I’ve seen,
0:14:35 I don’t know the name of the two off top of my head,
0:14:38 but I feel like I’ve seen something like that before.
0:14:41 – I know that, you know, I just say team kind of like
0:14:44 summarizes like the, it gives you a skiff it,
0:14:46 which is like kind of related.
0:14:50 But the idea of like, yeah, I also remember there was
0:14:52 something that like, we’ll create a podcast,
0:14:54 like a daily briefing out of your stuff
0:14:54 or something like that.
0:14:55 – Jelly pod.
0:14:57 There’s one called Jelly Pod that does that.
0:14:57 – It does that?
0:14:58 – Yeah.
0:14:59 – What does that do?
0:15:00 – So that one used to you,
0:15:01 they give you a specific email address.
0:15:04 You go and subscribe to newsletters with that email address.
0:15:06 And then it gives you a daily podcast
0:15:09 that sort of summarizes all of those newsletters
0:15:11 into a single audio.
0:15:12 Now there is one caveat.
0:15:15 They only let you subscribe, I think, to 10 newsletters.
0:15:18 And I subscribed to way more than 10 newsletters,
0:15:20 but if you can subscribe up to 10 newsletters on it
0:15:23 and every day it’ll like submit to your podcast feed.
0:15:25 So wherever you listen to podcasts,
0:15:27 it’ll, you know, it creates an RSS feed.
0:15:29 So you can actually listen to that podcast episode
0:15:32 and it breaks down everything that was in those 10 emails
0:15:34 in a little 10 minute briefing.
0:15:36 – That’s a great idea.
0:15:38 I literally have it open right now.
0:15:39 I’m gonna sign up for it.
0:15:42 It reminds me like, one of the tools are team built.
0:15:44 It’s a thing that just goes through
0:15:47 the last week’s worth of customer success calls
0:15:50 and it takes a transcript, summarizes it
0:15:53 and extracts insights.
0:15:56 And he turned it into a podcast using LebaLabs
0:15:58 with my voice as a deepfake.
0:16:00 So like every Monday you press play
0:16:02 and the likes of me tell you, you know what happened, Tork.
0:16:05 All the shit Tork was in your experience.
0:16:07 – That’s awesome.
0:16:09 For me, I think Feedly is another tool
0:16:11 that it’s like pretty underrated
0:16:12 that I don’t hear enough about,
0:16:16 but Feedly is a tool where you can subscribe to RSS feeds,
0:16:18 right, you can subscribe to your favorite blogs,
0:16:21 but it also gives you a custom email address.
0:16:23 So you can go and subscribe to newsletters
0:16:23 with Feedly.
0:16:26 So then every day you just open up your Feedly platform
0:16:29 and it’ll say, here’s all the newsletters that came across.
0:16:30 Here’s all that you should know
0:16:32 from all these various blogs.
0:16:35 So like, you know, I make a video every week of like,
0:16:37 here’s all of the AI news that came out
0:16:39 for this entire past week.
0:16:41 I pretty much just watch Feedly every day
0:16:42 to keep up with that stuff.
0:16:43 So I’m subscribed to Google’s blog,
0:16:47 open AI’s blog, Anthropics blog, stability AI’s blog.
0:16:49 You name it, I’m subscribed to their blog.
0:16:50 And then I’m also subscribed to like
0:16:53 every existing AI newsletter out there.
0:16:56 So every day I get sort of like, it’s not like a briefing,
0:16:57 I still have to kind of click through
0:16:58 each one one at a time,
0:17:01 but I have like a single point where I can go through
0:17:05 and like look at everything real quick and get caught up.
0:17:06 – Oh laser up.
0:17:07 – All right, so this is something that I think
0:17:09 is sort of inevitable,
0:17:12 but I’ve got these like frame glasses from Brilliant Labs.
0:17:14 I’m not sure if you guys have seen these before,
0:17:17 but they have like a little teeny tiny camera
0:17:18 right here on the front.
0:17:21 And they have like, you probably can’t tell on the camera,
0:17:23 but there’s like a little heads up display
0:17:25 on the right eye of it,
0:17:28 where like it will like scroll a little bit of text
0:17:29 across in front of your eyes.
0:17:31 So you can see text.
0:17:34 But one thing that I would, and this is open source too,
0:17:37 so anybody can develop with it or build on top of it,
0:17:39 however they want.
0:17:40 One thing I’d love to see,
0:17:42 first of all, better form factor.
0:17:43 These look like they’re straight out of Harry Potter,
0:17:46 but the second thing I’d love to see
0:17:50 is a face remembering app, right?
0:17:53 I wear these, I go meet somebody for the first time.
0:17:55 When I meet somebody, like there’s a code word,
0:17:58 if I say nice to meet you or something, right?
0:17:59 – Yeah.
0:18:00 – Snapshot of their face,
0:18:02 remember their face in the AI.
0:18:04 Then the next time I run into that person,
0:18:08 the little heads up display shows in my right eye,
0:18:09 oh, this is Siki Chin, right?
0:18:11 Like, so I walk up and I’m like,
0:18:13 hey, good to see you’re getting Siki, right?
0:18:17 Like, but I feel like you can build that with this thing here,
0:18:18 ’cause it’s got a little camera
0:18:21 and it’s got a little heads up display in one of your eyes.
0:18:25 So, you know, a little image recognition of people’s faces,
0:18:28 use, you know, maybe Google’s API that, you know,
0:18:31 it’s got the image recognition in it, you know?
0:18:34 Take pictures of people, remember their faces,
0:18:35 next time you run into them,
0:18:37 right across the little heads up display.
0:18:38 This is this person’s name,
0:18:40 so you never forget anybody’s names again.
0:18:41 I wanna see that being made.
0:18:43 And I feel like with these brilliant labs,
0:18:45 like open source tech,
0:18:47 somebody should be able to make that pretty easily.
0:18:49 I would imagine, I’m not a coder,
0:18:51 but I feel like it wouldn’t be too hard.
0:18:52 – I love it.
0:18:54 I guess the only question is like,
0:18:56 does Meta get there first with the Ray-Bans?
0:18:58 – Yeah, I’d be fine if Meta did it too.
0:18:59 I love the Ray-Bans.
0:19:00 (laughs)
0:19:03 It sounds like Meta’s next thing
0:19:05 that they’re gonna do with like the next iteration
0:19:08 of Ray-Bans is some more like augmented reality stuff.
0:19:11 They were going, they were gonna do like this giant,
0:19:13 this like new VR headset that was supposed to compete
0:19:14 with the Apple Vision Pro,
0:19:17 like a really high-end version of the Quest.
0:19:18 Well, they just scrapped that.
0:19:21 And it sounds like now they’re pushing,
0:19:23 because of how well sales have done on the Meta Ray-Bans,
0:19:25 they’re now pushing more into the Ray-Ban area.
0:19:28 And it sounds like they’re gonna start doing things like AR
0:19:30 and heads up display inside of the Ray-Bans
0:19:34 instead of making higher end virtual reality devices.
0:19:35 – I mean, that’s gonna be a huge opportunity
0:19:36 for some company to build.
0:19:37 – Yeah, that’s killer.
0:19:38 – Absolutely.
0:19:40 – I’ve always wanted that where like you could just see,
0:19:43 who they are, like if it’s good for your business or not,
0:19:44 like some kind of context there,
0:19:47 but it gets into like a really weird territory though, right?
0:19:49 It’s like almost like a black mirror where it’s like,
0:19:50 what’s their score?
0:19:52 Like, is this like a person I should talk to?
0:19:53 Or they’re like, totally irrelevant.
0:19:54 They’re like not worth it.
0:19:55 – Brothers, there’s just a lot of foreign out.
0:19:57 – Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
0:19:59 Not important, important, you know?
0:20:00 – Yeah.
0:20:03 – Can we be honest and say like the real reason why we want
0:20:06 that is like every other day we go out
0:20:08 and someone says hi and you’re like, I don’t know who it is.
0:20:09 – Yeah.
0:20:11 – Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
0:20:12 – Yeah.
0:20:14 Well, I mean, it can also save like additional data, right?
0:20:16 Like if you’re having a conversation,
0:20:18 but it does kind of get into that creepy area
0:20:21 of like how much is it recording and that kind of stuff,
0:20:23 but it could like remember kids’ names.
0:20:25 It can remember birthdays, remember, you know,
0:20:26 different stuff like that.
0:20:28 So when you’re having a conversation,
0:20:30 it all just sort of pops up on a little heads up display
0:20:33 for you so you can easily remember that stuff.
0:20:35 But I run into that all the time.
0:20:39 Like I go to like at least one conference a month
0:20:39 kind of thing.
0:20:41 Like I go to a lot of conferences
0:20:42 and I don’t know how many times I’ve gone to a conference
0:20:44 for somebody who’s like, hey, great to see you again.
0:20:46 And I’m like, yeah, you too.
0:20:47 And I have to look down at their name badge
0:20:49 and try to be discreet about it.
0:20:51 – Yeah.
0:20:52 – Do you wear the glasses in public
0:20:53 and do people get angry?
0:20:54 I’m wondering.
0:20:56 – I wear the Ray Bands in public all the time
0:20:58 because they just look like normal Ray Bands.
0:20:58 – Yeah.
0:21:01 – I wore Google Glass for like a month.
0:21:02 – Yeah.
0:21:03 – I mean, more and more devices are popping up
0:21:04 like that too, right?
0:21:06 Like there’s like earbuds coming out
0:21:07 that are going to like record you.
0:21:08 And they’ve got the-
0:21:09 – People just get used to it probably.
0:21:10 Like there’s not much use about it.
0:21:12 – Yeah, the pending and all that kind of stuff.
0:21:13 But yeah.
0:21:14 I mean, some of like, I don’t-
0:21:16 – Anyway, you know, you get used to the cell phone
0:21:17 when you’re out.
0:21:18 – Yeah, yeah.
0:21:19 – You’re out and you’re going to get in,
0:21:21 be in a picture of probably a bi-oxidant.
0:21:22 It sucks for you.
0:21:23 – I mean, literally everybody you see in public
0:21:25 has a device that can record your voice,
0:21:29 take pictures of you, take videos of you, everybody.
0:21:30 – I have another one.
0:21:31 I’m not going to go spicy yet.
0:21:32 I’m going to say that.
0:21:32 All right.
0:21:35 So this is a general category of products
0:21:37 I’m interested in,
0:21:42 which is like ways of exploring the lateness base of MenLM.
0:21:45 So WebSIN, you know, is like an example of that
0:21:47 where a hallucinator may see internet.
0:21:49 If you’re building really interesting things around that,
0:21:50 thought it was interesting.
0:21:51 Was this too far?
0:21:53 There’s a company that I recently invested in
0:21:56 called O1 Computer or Adaptive Computer.
0:21:58 And it’s kind of like a higher level Devon.
0:22:00 It can just make apps for you.
0:22:01 And one of the things you can build
0:22:06 just by asking it to build was a hallucinated Wikipedia.
0:22:07 So basically you can start with like anything
0:22:10 and it’ll create a Wikipedia Oracle and all the links work
0:22:14 and just keep on browsing it and say that.
0:22:16 I just think like generally those categories
0:22:17 of things are interesting.
0:22:20 Like being able to explore the lateness base
0:22:21 of a generative model, right?
0:22:22 You have an image.
0:22:25 I’m like, I want to go over there, right?
0:22:26 And this is where things are going
0:22:28 eventually become real time, right?
0:22:31 For example, there was a thing that I saw yesterday
0:22:35 where someone trained the future model on Doom one.
0:22:39 Like things get killed, you get fired a gun.
0:22:42 And we’re gonna go from like rendering pixels
0:22:44 just like losing the entire image, right?
0:22:45 On your computers.
0:22:48 I think that entire category of things is interesting.
0:22:51 I think someone making a generative Wikipedia
0:22:52 is also interesting.
0:22:54 There’s a few companies that are kind of like that
0:22:56 but not quite like that.
0:22:58 But I kind of like that idea quite a bit.
0:23:01 – Yeah, I mean, you can do something similar right now
0:23:02 with perplexity, right?
0:23:03 Like they’ve got their pages feature
0:23:05 where you could basically throw in any topic
0:23:07 and it essentially builds like a Wikipedia page.
0:23:09 But it’s not like hallucinating.
0:23:11 It is just going and finding the data
0:23:12 on the internet for you essentially.
0:23:13 – Yeah.
0:23:16 (upbeat music)
0:23:17 – We’ll be right back.
0:23:19 But first, I want to tell you about another great podcast
0:23:20 you’re gonna want to listen to.
0:23:24 It’s called Science of Scaling, hosted by Mark Roberge.
0:23:27 And it’s brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network,
0:23:30 the audio destination for business professionals.
0:23:32 Each week, host Mark Roberge,
0:23:34 founding chief revenue officer at HubSpot,
0:23:37 senior lecturer at Harvard Business School
0:23:39 and co-founder of Stage Two Capital,
0:23:42 sits down with the most successful sales leaders in tech
0:23:45 to learn the secrets, strategies and tactics
0:23:47 to scaling your company’s growth.
0:23:49 He recently did a great episode called,
0:23:52 how do you solve for a siloed marketing in sales?
0:23:54 And I personally learned a lot from it.
0:23:56 You’re going to want to check out the podcast,
0:23:58 listen to Science of Scaling,
0:24:00 wherever you get your podcasts.
0:24:03 (upbeat music)
0:24:04 – I think what fascinates me
0:24:06 is like more of the emotive interaction, right?
0:24:09 Like that still requires you to ask us something
0:24:12 and this idea of like just be able to click
0:24:16 or look around to browse a query interface
0:24:17 is like super interesting.
0:24:18 That’s what I’d like.
0:24:20 I think WebSend is the first thing
0:24:22 that I’ve seen that did this, right?
0:24:23 Well, I just made it a hyperlink
0:24:26 so that you click instead of having to type anything.
0:24:29 I just think there’s like a whole area
0:24:32 of unexplored product possibilities around this idea
0:24:35 of other ways to generate prompts
0:24:37 and explore the latent space.
0:24:39 – Yeah, the doom one’s so interesting.
0:24:41 It’s almost like you’re moving through a dream, right?
0:24:43 Like it’s like dreaming up everything in the world
0:24:44 as you’re moving through it.
0:24:46 It’s like that is so amazing.
0:24:47 We have nothing like that currently.
0:24:50 – Well, I mean, some people would argue
0:24:51 that’s what’s happening right now.
0:24:52 (all laughing)
0:24:53 – Right, right now?
0:24:55 Like right now.
0:24:57 – Yeah, the simulation we’re in, you mean?
0:24:59 (all laughing)
0:25:01 Yeah, there’s a wall in front of me right now.
0:25:03 I think I know it’s on the other side of the wall,
0:25:05 but I’m not on the other side of the wall.
0:25:06 So I don’t know.
0:25:08 – Don’t say simulation three times.
0:25:10 We may get exited out of it.
0:25:11 So I think it’s fine.
0:25:16 – Yeah, there’s an AI art tool.
0:25:18 I don’t think I’m allowed to say the name of it
0:25:20 ’cause I don’t think they publicly announced
0:25:21 that this is coming yet.
0:25:23 But there’s a tool that’s essentially
0:25:26 an exploration of like a diffusion model
0:25:28 where you enter a prompt into it.
0:25:29 And when you enter a prompt,
0:25:32 it will basically generate like an infinite number
0:25:34 of images with that prompt
0:25:36 that you can sort of infinitely scroll through.
0:25:40 So in real time, it’ll just keep on popping up new images
0:25:41 generated by that prompt.
0:25:43 And then if you click on one of the images,
0:25:46 it now uses that image that you just clicked on
0:25:48 as an image reference.
0:25:49 And then it starts a whole new page
0:25:51 with this is your image reference.
0:25:54 And then you can sort of infinitely scroll new images
0:25:56 based on this new image reference.
0:25:57 And you can sort of get lost in it for hours
0:25:59 just clicking, oh, I like this image.
0:26:02 And the idea being that eventually
0:26:05 you can find the absolute perfect ideal image
0:26:08 for what you were going for with that prompt
0:26:09 by just scrolling and clicking on the ones
0:26:12 that are closest to what you’re looking for.
0:26:13 And then once you find the one you’re looking for,
0:26:16 you now know the seed, the prompt, everything you need
0:26:19 to know to regenerate that image again and again.
0:26:20 I need that.
0:26:22 – Yeah, it’s coming, it’s coming.
0:26:24 – Dianne, we need the thing after the show.
0:26:25 I need to use it. – Yes, for sure.
0:26:27 – That’s hallucinating Pinterest, right?
0:26:29 And I think like in general,
0:26:32 like this idea of taking a known product
0:26:35 and product interaction and just hallucinating it,
0:26:39 whether it’s a browser, Wikipedia, Pinterest is amazing.
0:26:41 Yeah, I love the whole class of ideas.
0:26:43 – Yeah, that’s gonna be fun.
0:26:45 It’s also just going to be a new addiction
0:26:47 for a lot of people, I think.
0:26:48 All right, Nathan.
0:26:49 The next one to be, you know,
0:26:51 back in the day, Code Academy was really popular.
0:26:54 I don’t know if it maybe still is, I have no idea.
0:26:56 But it feels like that was an idea where it was a great idea.
0:26:58 You know, it basically was a site
0:26:59 that helped you learn how to code,
0:27:01 kind of walked you through everything, you know,
0:27:03 and really simplified down, learned code.
0:27:04 It was always a great idea,
0:27:07 but I feel like it never was fully properly executed on.
0:27:09 Like, I don’t think it reached its full potential,
0:27:10 like of the idea.
0:27:13 And it feels like now with AI you could, you know?
0:27:14 Like, I don’t know if you saw that video
0:27:15 from a few days ago,
0:27:19 with like the eight-year-old girl using a cursor to code
0:27:20 and making like a little Harry Potter website and stuff.
0:27:22 I was like, that is so cool.
0:27:24 And that girl must be very intelligent.
0:27:26 ‘Cause like it, ’cause even, you know, at age,
0:27:28 using cursor is still hard, I think.
0:27:30 For an eight-year-old, it’s very hard.
0:27:32 She’s definitely a very intelligent child.
0:27:34 And so it feels like there’s something for, you know,
0:27:36 a more mainstream audience where anyone like,
0:27:38 hey, you can actually code now.
0:27:40 Like it can actually help you and like,
0:27:41 kind of walk you through that
0:27:43 of making some simple product or simple website
0:27:45 and just showing you, you can do it.
0:27:46 And teaching you.
0:27:47 It feels like there’s some kind of opportunity there.
0:27:48 And yeah, I’m kind of surprised.
0:27:50 I haven’t seen anyone do that yet.
0:27:51 – Yeah, yeah.
0:27:52 And it would be like generative, right?
0:27:54 So like everybody who uses the program
0:27:56 is sort of developing something different.
0:27:57 As opposed to like Code Academy,
0:28:00 which Code Academy would walk you through, you know,
0:28:02 everybody’s basically building the same thing, right?
0:28:04 That’s just a set tutorial.
0:28:06 I feel like you can have something that’s generative
0:28:09 where everybody that goes through this program
0:28:10 builds something unique, right?
0:28:12 It’s something completely different every time.
0:28:14 You might even, at the end of the program,
0:28:18 have something that is, you know, launchable,
0:28:21 something that you can actually put out into the world.
0:28:23 – And you can have a community aspect too,
0:28:24 or maybe like you actually share what you built
0:28:26 and everyone can kind of see all that kind of stuff.
0:28:27 – I like it.
0:28:28 – It can be kind of cool.
0:28:29 – I’ve been trying to, you know,
0:28:33 do all kinds of things to get my older daughter
0:28:34 is 10 now into coding.
0:28:36 So we’re on Hof scotch.
0:28:37 We did Code Academy.
0:28:39 We have chat should be tea.
0:28:41 I gave her wigs to make a website.
0:28:45 And over Christmas, I was traveling with a friend
0:28:49 and they have a kid and they decided if his were in Japan,
0:28:52 they wanted to make a video game
0:28:54 that was a cross between Gundam and Transformers
0:28:56 called Transim.
0:28:58 So the youth team asked, all right,
0:29:00 how do we make a game or a role of the game?
0:29:02 What is a cross between Transformers
0:29:04 gonna look like that we generate an image?
0:29:07 They downloaded a, yeah, they downloaded Unity.
0:29:09 They downloaded Unity and started working on this game.
0:29:12 They not only got by far, but they got like way further
0:29:14 on their own than I think any a year old would have
0:29:17 without, you know, AI.
0:29:19 I think that’s great.
0:29:22 My fourth idea, I didn’t talk about his third,
0:29:23 but just picking off what you said,
0:29:28 I think this general class of almost like an AI nanny
0:29:31 where, you know, you have these tools are kind of passive,
0:29:33 but if you can have something that
0:29:35 Interactive’s board is like, hey,
0:29:38 let’s learn about X or what do you want to do, right?
0:29:40 And it’ll just like interact and talk with you
0:29:42 and like, it’ll let you hallucinate with the AI.
0:29:45 I think that’s also super interesting.
0:29:46 – Yeah, yeah.
0:29:47 I mean, something like that’s a lot better, I think,
0:29:49 than, you know, setting them down with an iPad
0:29:53 or a Nintendo Switch and just saying here, go play Roblox.
0:29:57 – I think there’s like some companies are doing dolls
0:29:59 that are all generated and more interactive,
0:30:01 but I’m very pro this idea.
0:30:04 Like inverting the chat GBT interaction pattern,
0:30:07 which is having to talk to you,
0:30:08 not waiting for you to talk to them.
0:30:10 I think there is so much on tap potential
0:30:11 and just boosting that.
0:30:13 – Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely.
0:30:14 – Yeah, I would love to have that for my son
0:30:17 and like have it where, okay, you can’t use your PC
0:30:19 until you’ve actually like done this.
0:30:21 Like you can’t like, here’s a little project, go do it.
0:30:23 Now you, now yeah, you can watch YouTube
0:30:24 for 30 minutes or whatever.
0:30:25 – There you go.
0:30:26 Yes, some sort of locking mechanism
0:30:31 where the games unlock once you finish your tasks.
0:30:32 – Yeah, I don’t know.
0:30:33 Oh, it’s good.
0:30:34 – Very cool.
0:30:37 Any other ideas we want to throw out there?
0:30:39 – I want to, we’re out.
0:30:40 – No time.
0:30:41 All right.
0:30:43 It’s actually not that spicy.
0:30:46 And it’s gonna sound stupid, but hear me out.
0:30:47 Okay.
0:30:47 – Okay.
0:30:48 – My girlfriend.
0:30:50 But, and I know it’s not new.
0:30:52 – I was gonna say yeah.
0:30:53 – Okay.
0:30:54 – Relax, relax.
0:30:55 Okay, that’s cool.
0:30:58 So there’s character AI and in friend,
0:31:00 all these things are like doing AI girlfriends, right?
0:31:05 So here’s a thing that I think is going to print money
0:31:06 if someone does this.
0:31:07 You sign up for your AI girlfriend,
0:31:11 but the interface and all the interactions look real.
0:31:15 So it’s not like character AI where you’re like,
0:31:17 I’m gonna create my ideal waifu
0:31:19 and this is what she’s gonna look like.
0:31:22 And I’m gonna generate some images and some personalities.
0:31:25 Instead, it looks exactly like Tinder
0:31:26 and you’re suddenly left and right.
0:31:29 And very similar to your idea,
0:31:31 the other product where you’re finding
0:31:34 the exact right image is that, but for your waifu.
0:31:36 – Yeah, yeah.
0:31:39 – And then like you’re selecting and slapping right
0:31:41 and based on the slapping left and right,
0:31:44 it’s learning what about what your ideal waifu looks like
0:31:46 and is like, because it’s a generated personality.
0:31:50 It’s a generated image, generated location, everything.
0:31:52 And then once you start right, you match
0:31:54 and then you have to have some conversation with them.
0:31:57 And then in the background,
0:32:01 the system will create a generated Instagram profile,
0:32:03 trade an ID, or WhatsApp account,
0:32:08 and then it will actually text you as this person.
0:32:10 It’ll DM you over Instagram as this person.
0:32:12 And now you have a virtual girlfriend,
0:32:16 but it feels real in every virtual channel that you have.
0:32:17 – Yeah, yeah.
0:32:19 – It can even, over time, you can have a Zoom call
0:32:21 and what happens when you call, who knows?
0:32:26 But like, you can real time generate all this stuff
0:32:28 and not have it just be like this weird bot thing
0:32:30 that you’re making and it feels pretty real.
0:32:33 – Yeah, I feel like all of the technology exists right now
0:32:34 to make that happen.
0:32:36 It’s just combining all the parts.
0:32:38 – Yeah, exactly, it’s surely a front and front.
0:32:41 – Yeah, yeah, ’cause you’ve got like render net, right?
0:32:43 Where you can upload like some images of a face
0:32:46 and it’ll make sure that character stays consistent
0:32:48 every time and you’ve got the tools
0:32:49 that can turn them into videos
0:32:51 and you’ve got the tools that can do the voice.
0:32:53 I feel like it’s just a matter of somebody
0:32:56 mashing all the tools together to get that thing.
0:32:57 – Yeah, it’s like Instagram, right?
0:33:00 You’re browsing Instagram and all the attractive people
0:33:01 are attracted to you.
0:33:03 That’s basically it.
0:33:04 – Oh, I like it.
0:33:07 Yeah, I mean, it does bring up some additional questions
0:33:11 of like, where does that take humanity
0:33:14 if like everybody just gets their ideal digital girlfriend
0:33:17 because then, you know, reproduction could potentially.
0:33:22 – I mean, I do think my sense about my mental model
0:33:26 of how value is created in that PoE to say a world,
0:33:29 I think humanity is gonna adapt like pretty quickly.
0:33:34 Like, we have infinite adult videos online, right?
0:33:39 And I think in that world, we are bio biologically,
0:33:42 we’re just evolved to play status games.
0:33:45 And I think it’s very hard to override biology
0:33:47 even with the best of tools.
0:33:49 And I think we’re just gonna value things that are real more.
0:33:50 – Yeah, yeah, yeah.
0:33:53 – I actually don’t think it’s gonna be like
0:33:54 as bad as people think, you know, people are like,
0:33:56 “Oh, we have VR headsets, who are doing the media VR?”
0:33:57 And looking at her wife, it was like,
0:33:58 “No, if you weren’t doing that.”
0:33:59 – Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
0:34:00 – There are probably things too
0:34:03 that I use AI to actually help connect people too.
0:34:04 Like, I think that’ll probably be a thing like,
0:34:06 probably in the future, the governments be like,
0:34:07 “Oh, shit, this is like a big problem.
0:34:09 We need to like have huge incentives
0:34:11 for getting married and having kids.”
0:34:12 They’ll probably make huge incentives.
0:34:14 And then there’ll probably be AI apps that like help you,
0:34:16 like, “Here’s your personality type.”
0:34:19 And here, go chat with this virtual version of this,
0:34:21 you know, girl who’s like a real girl, real person,
0:34:23 and you’re a good match.
0:34:24 And then maybe you should actually meet them.
0:34:26 I think we’ll have stuff like that too.
0:34:28 So maybe that’ll kind of counterbalance all of this.
0:34:29 – Yeah, AI waifus.
0:34:31 – It could be like a net positive for humanity too,
0:34:33 ’cause when you think of like the adult film industry,
0:34:35 there’s a lot of exploitation,
0:34:36 a lot of human trafficking,
0:34:37 a lot of that kind of stuff, right?
0:34:40 So, I mean, maybe it does turn out to be
0:34:42 a net positive in that sense.
0:34:44 I mean, you look at adult websites,
0:34:45 nobody ever looks at them.
0:34:47 Yes, somehow, Pornhub’s always in the top 10
0:34:48 of all most visited sites.
0:34:50 – That’s so weird.
0:34:52 – So weird how that happens when nobody uses it.
0:34:55 – You have these videos, it’s crazy.
0:34:57 – Well, I think these are all great ideas.
0:35:00 And I think anybody listening to this episode,
0:35:01 if you go and invent any of these,
0:35:04 I think Zicky’s gonna invest, that’s what I’m hearing.
0:35:06 – Yeah, I actually would.
0:35:07 – That was the agreement, so that’s why he’s here.
0:35:09 – That’s a good priority now.
0:35:12 ‘Cause like, I just like, I talk to founders,
0:35:13 I talk to founders like, maybe you should,
0:35:16 like, this is like a much better idea
0:35:17 than what you’re doing.
0:35:19 – Before we do wrap it up though,
0:35:22 is there anywhere you want people to go check you out?
0:35:24 I mean, is X the best place to follow you?
0:35:27 LinkedIn, like, where should people go after hearing about?
0:35:28 – One out of that.
0:35:30 All of my LinkedIn content is ghost written,
0:35:33 so probably you won’t follow me on X instead.
0:35:36 – And what’s your X profile?
0:35:39 – I’m Blader, B-L-A-D-E-R,
0:35:42 and my company is Runway.com, not OneWayML.com,
0:35:44 Runway.com. – The Runway, yeah.
0:35:48 – Yeah, so if you’re a mid-sized, larger company,
0:35:50 and you want to have better view of finances,
0:35:52 we run the finance departments,
0:35:55 the finance models of Superhuman
0:35:57 and Sable the Fusion, actually,
0:36:00 and Angelist and Lambda AI and Superhuman
0:36:02 and a bunch of other companies like that, so.
0:36:03 – Very cool, very cool.
0:36:06 Well, check those out, everybody who’s listening in,
0:36:07 and yeah, I really, really appreciate you
0:36:09 spending the time with us.
0:36:10 If you are tuning into this episode
0:36:13 and you want to hear more conversations like this
0:36:16 and hear more business ideas and AI use cases
0:36:16 and all that fun stuff,
0:36:19 make sure you subscribe over on the YouTubes
0:36:21 or wherever you listen to podcasts.
0:36:22 And Ziggy, thanks again.
0:36:25 (upbeat music)
0:36:27 (upbeat music)
0:36:30 (upbeat music)
0:36:32 (upbeat music)
0:36:35 (upbeat music)
0:36:38 (upbeat music)
0:36:40 (upbeat music)
0:36:42 you
Episode 22: How can AI revolutionize business ideas in 2024? Matt Wolfe (https://x.com/mreflow) and Nathan Lands (https://x.com/NathanLands) are joined by Siqi Chen (https://x.com/blader), CEO of Runway.com and a seasoned entrepreneur and investor in AI-related ventures.
This episode delves into innovative AI business ideas that entrepreneurs can pursue in 2024. Siqi shares his insights on professional-grade AI tools for video production, the use of generative models, the impact of augmented reality, the potential ethical concerns, and unique concepts like AI email categorization systems. The discussion is light and conversational, touching on practical applications and futuristic ideas alike.
Check out The Next Wave YouTube Channel if you want to see Matt and Nathan on screen: https://lnk.to/thenextwavepd
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Show Notes:
- (00:00)Entertaining conversation about business ideas and creativity.
- (04:27) AI as a tool for thought, not doing.
- (09:50) Automatically categorizing emails based on specific criteria.
- (12:59) Custom newsletter curates content from various sources.
- (16:18) Brilliant Labs offers camera glasses with display.
- (17:08) Remember people’s faces with AI image recognition.
- (21:12) Create hallucinated Wikipedia through generative model.
- (23:36) AI art tool generates infinite images from prompts.
- (29:18) Creating AI girlfriends through realistic interaction tech.
- (32:23) AI connecting people through incentives and apps.
- (34:25) Encouraging audience to subscribe and tune in.
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Mentions:
- Get the free ChatGPT Bundle here https://clickhubspot.com/chatgpt
- Siqi Chen: https://www.linkedin.com/in/siqic/
- Runway: https://runway.com/
- Sanebox: https://www.sanebox.com/
- Superhuman: https://superhuman.com/
- Feedly: https://feedly.com/
- Jellypod: https://jellypod.ai/
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Check Out Matt’s Stuff:
• Future Tools – https://futuretools.beehiiv.com/
• Blog – https://www.mattwolfe.com/
• YouTube- https://www.youtube.com/@mreflow
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Check Out Nathan’s Stuff:
- Newsletter: https://news.lore.com/
- Blog – https://lore.com/
The Next Wave is a HubSpot Original Podcast // Brought to you by The HubSpot Podcast Network // Production by Darren Clarke // Editing by Ezra Bakker Trupiano