AI transcript
0:00:03 [MUSIC PLAYING]
0:00:07 There are three systems in your head, keeping it very simple.
0:00:10 It’s much more complex than that, but simplifying it.
0:00:13 One of the systems will help you think very logically,
0:00:15 and I call that the human system.
0:00:18 It thinks logically, but it’s very slow,
0:00:21 which means if you operate with a human,
0:00:24 your body and your reflexes will slow down,
0:00:26 because you’re analyzing as you go along,
0:00:29 and it slows the system so you’re more pensive.
0:00:31 If he goes into the second system,
0:00:34 which we’ll probably come back to, the chimp system,
0:00:37 this is a primitive system which thinks.
0:00:39 It’s more than just a reaction and impulsive system.
0:00:40 It thinks.
0:00:43 When it moves, it can move at speed,
0:00:45 but it thinks emotionally.
0:00:48 Finally, the third system is a computer.
0:00:49 It just needs programming.
0:00:52 The key to the computer, particularly in sport,
0:00:56 is it moves so fast, it’s approximately 20 times
0:00:59 quicker than the human system to execute,
0:01:02 and it’s about four times quicker than the chimp system.
0:01:03 Habits.
0:01:07 A lot of people are thinking about habits, it’s January.
0:01:11 I made a video on habits a couple of weeks ago.
0:01:13 In a path through the jungle,
0:01:19 you talk about how our habits are influenced by our self-image.
0:01:21 That was a curious sentence to read,
0:01:23 and not something I’d heard before.
0:01:24 What do you mean by that?
0:01:27 Okay, there’s lots of ways we form habits,
0:01:30 whether they’re helpful or destructive.
0:01:32 I’m giving examples, so that’s one you picked out.
0:01:34 It’s quite powerful if you grasp it.
0:01:37 For example, I’ll take the simple example,
0:01:40 which I may have put in the book, I don’t remember.
0:01:42 If I wrote down, I’d say to someone,
0:01:44 “Do you see yourself as someone who,
0:01:46 “as a tidy person, who gets on with things immediately,
0:01:48 “or do you see yourself as someone who procrastinates,
0:01:49 “and it’s pretty untidy?”
0:01:50 I’m untidy.
0:01:53 Right, so if you’ve got that self-image,
0:01:55 and you go home and your room is untidy,
0:01:56 and being very black and white here,
0:01:58 then there’s no feelings at all,
0:02:00 ’cause that’s who you are, you’re untidy.
0:02:00 That’s true.
0:02:01 So, if you don’t do anything.
0:02:02 That’s true.
0:02:04 Whereas if you say, right, change your image,
0:02:06 and say, actually, my chimp being untidy,
0:02:07 I’m a tidy person.
0:02:12 In some cases, you’re now programming the computer,
0:02:14 you now go home and say, wow, this isn’t me,
0:02:16 and that can change.
0:02:19 So, if your self-image is, I’m not my chimp,
0:02:20 that’s an untidy little beggar,
0:02:22 I am actually a tidy person.
0:02:24 How do I change that self-image then?
0:02:26 Well, you’ve got to sit down and reflect on this.
0:02:28 I mean, a lot of the things in the book,
0:02:30 I’ve done as a young doctor,
0:02:32 when I became a psychiatrist, I decided,
0:02:33 I didn’t want to be a psychiatrist,
0:02:35 who didn’t actually manage themself,
0:02:37 and that’s no detriment to psychs who struggle,
0:02:40 because it’s not an easy career, or any therapist,
0:02:42 it’s a tough career.
0:02:44 But I decided, look, I’m gonna work on me,
0:02:46 because I can’t keep doing this,
0:02:47 which is where the chimp model came from.
0:02:49 And it was one of my light bulb moments,
0:02:53 many, many years ago, where I would be procrastinating,
0:02:55 and then I suddenly thought, you know what,
0:02:58 that isn’t who I want to be.
0:03:00 So I thought, that isn’t me,
0:03:02 I’m actually someone who gets on with things,
0:03:04 and they used to get in, and I’d just go, right,
0:03:05 get on with it.
0:03:06 And it’s never left me, I just thought,
0:03:09 no, that is who I am, so I’ve become uncomfortable now.
0:03:11 If things weren’t tidy, I’d agitate,
0:03:14 and say, no, get it tidied up.
0:03:17 So I start perceiving myself as this energized guy,
0:03:18 who’s gonna get up and do stuff.
0:03:20 So if you define yourself image,
0:03:22 you’re actually programming your computer to say,
0:03:25 this is normal, anything else isn’t,
0:03:28 and that will actually help your chimp to agitate,
0:03:31 which will then join forces and tidy the room.
0:03:33 So instead of your chimp going, oh, I can’t be bothered,
0:03:37 suddenly it’s saying, wow, I’m being told we’re not untidy,
0:03:39 so this is an acceptable, not normal.
0:03:41 And that’s what I did,
0:03:43 and I found that very powerful in my life.
0:03:45 – The other thing I found really curious in this section
0:03:48 about habits in chapter, in stage four of the book is,
0:03:50 when people think about habit loops,
0:03:53 they often have a reward at the end of it.
0:03:55 You referenced suffering.
0:03:57 Now, there’s this quote I heard many years ago,
0:03:59 I think it was just over 10 years ago,
0:04:01 it must have been, God, I’m getting old.
0:04:03 Where I heard this YouTuber say,
0:04:05 change happens when the pain of staying the same
0:04:08 becomes greater than the pain of making a change.
0:04:09 And when I’m thinking about friends
0:04:11 that I have in my life, all myself,
0:04:13 where there’s habits or there’s behavior patterns
0:04:14 that I wanna break,
0:04:17 sometimes I’m thinking about one particular person
0:04:20 who’s a musician,
0:04:23 sometimes they have to get to that rock bottom place
0:04:25 before you see change happen.
0:04:26 Is that because of that?
0:04:27 Is that because sometimes the suffering has to-
0:04:30 – Yeah, I mean, it’s sort of self-evident.
0:04:32 If you’re, for example, in a bad relationship
0:04:34 and it’s really not doing any favors
0:04:36 and it’s not doing them any favors,
0:04:38 but it’s not bad enough,
0:04:40 then you struggle along and struggle along.
0:04:41 But if suddenly something happens
0:04:44 where it becomes untenable and it’s painful now,
0:04:47 then you move, you think stop the relationship.
0:04:49 And then you look back thinking, why didn’t I move earlier?
0:04:53 And the answer was because it wasn’t painful enough.
0:04:55 And the same with like untidiness.
0:04:56 You leave it and leave it and leave it.
0:04:59 And then somebody comes in and says-
0:05:00 – A partner. – Yeah.
0:05:02 Lie me, I can’t live with this.
0:05:06 And suddenly you think, wow, suddenly it’s painful.
0:05:07 – Is there a way to get there
0:05:09 without the person needing to point it out?
0:05:10 – Yeah, there is.
0:05:13 I mean, when I talk about relationships are critical to us.
0:05:16 And I say to people, the way we move is we’ve got to,
0:05:18 I have the triangle of change,
0:05:21 which is really the three key things that cause us to move.
0:05:22 And with the one you’ve highlighted
0:05:25 is either it’s got a massive reward
0:05:27 or there’s going to be massive pain and suffering.
0:05:30 So if you’re trying to, you’re courting someone,
0:05:31 you want to form a permanent relationship.
0:05:33 When they say, I can’t stand untidiness,
0:05:36 you’ll guarantee your flat’s perfect when they come in, right?
0:05:37 Because you’re thinking, if I don’t,
0:05:38 I’m going to lose this person.
0:05:40 So the reward is so big.
0:05:42 However, then they marry you.
0:05:44 And for some reason we tip them for granted
0:05:46 and we forget that bit now.
0:05:48 And then the flat becomes untidy.
0:05:50 And then she starts saying to you,
0:05:52 I’m struggling with this, I’m struggling,
0:05:53 but there’s no threat yet.
0:05:55 So now it’s not painful enough.
0:05:56 So she’s struggling with it.
0:06:00 I love the guy, but this is now what I do.
0:06:02 So I say, let’s increase the pain.
0:06:05 I want you to sit down and imagine she can’t cope.
0:06:08 And she’s had a bad day and someone at work says,
0:06:10 I’ll come over and chat.
0:06:13 And this young man has a tidy flat naturally.
0:06:15 And she goes, oh, wow.
0:06:17 And I warn people, how are you going to feel if she walks?
0:06:20 Because once they’ve gone, they very, very come back.
0:06:23 And if you don’t look after them, someone else will.
0:06:25 If you reflect on that,
0:06:29 that can suddenly make reality come to life to say,
0:06:32 I’m not there yet, but blame me, this would be painful.
0:06:34 So I’m suddenly going to stop and think,
0:06:35 let me look after them.
0:06:37 Because if I don’t, somebody will.
0:06:40 So you can increase the concept of suffering
0:06:41 by reflecting and thinking,
0:06:44 what would like be like if she left?
0:06:47 There’s the devil’s in the detail.
0:06:49 Let’s say that you go home and you really make an effort.
0:06:51 You tidy the house and you really clean it up.
0:06:54 And she comes home and she doesn’t notice.
0:06:55 And there’s a danger now.
0:06:58 And I do advocate that sometimes you say to them,
0:07:00 because your chimp needs to get that accolade.
0:07:02 So it’s no good not helping it.
0:07:04 You don’t need that, but your chimp does.
0:07:05 So it’s worth saying, can I just say,
0:07:07 because I love you, I’ve tidied the flat.
0:07:09 Because then your chimp goes, right, good.
0:07:10 I get the accolade now.
0:07:13 So I’m not saying you should not rub the chimp out.
0:07:16 I’m saying you should be getting the chimp so it feels good.
0:07:19 And then hopefully she’ll say, wow, I love you too.
0:07:20 And I appreciate that.
0:07:22 And then that’s nicely rounded up.
0:07:25 But you do get circumcised where I’ll work with people.
0:07:26 I tidied the flat.
0:07:27 I did everything she doesn’t even recognise it.
0:07:28 I cancelled it from my diary.
0:07:30 She didn’t recognise it.
0:07:33 And I think, well, you know, I’m not saying I’m a goodie-goody,
0:07:35 but I’m saying, let them know because your chimp’s saying,
0:07:39 please make sure they know and they’ve recognised it.
0:07:40 And again, I don’t know.
0:07:41 There may be couples where they say,
0:07:42 if I say that, she’ll lose it.
0:07:44 So I say, well, don’t do it then.
0:07:47 Tell me, and I as a therapist will say to you, well done.
0:07:48 And that might be enough for your chimp.
0:07:51 So again, it’s that thing which I keep saying to Steve,
0:07:53 I’ve got to work with the person in front of me
0:07:56 and even potentially their partner or family
0:08:00 and say, well, what would they do before we make a plan?
0:08:02 – That was step one in your triangle.
0:08:04 – Yeah, one of the points.
0:08:07 The other two, for people to shift,
0:08:09 they’ve got to have psychological mindedness,
0:08:11 which means they’ve got to understand
0:08:13 that it’s not about what happens to us in life,
0:08:15 it’s how we deal with it.
0:08:16 That’s basically what we mean.
0:08:19 So we understand that just because you’ve got certain emotions
0:08:23 doesn’t mean you can’t change them and things have to change,
0:08:25 or people have to change for you to change.
0:08:28 It’s within your power to be responsible
0:08:30 for the things you believe and change.
0:08:32 So psychological mindedness means you get up
0:08:34 and start working on this.
0:08:35 It’s within your power to shift things.
0:08:37 – That’s that personal responsibility.
0:08:39 – Yes, and also if you can’t shift them.
0:08:43 Say, go back, let’s say life hadn’t been great for you
0:08:45 and I’m sure you worked hard to get your way you’ve got,
0:08:48 but let’s say you’re still in that poverty situation,
0:08:50 you thought, I didn’t have the skill to do what I’m doing.
0:08:53 I didn’t use that skill because it was never there.
0:08:55 So a lot of people are trapped
0:08:57 and they say, well, I’m still living in a pretty bad place
0:08:59 and I’m struggling financially and that’s a lot of people.
0:09:02 It’s painful, but again, psychological mindedness,
0:09:05 tough as it is, is to say, well, let me deal with that.
0:09:10 I can’t change it, but I can change my approach to it.
0:09:11 And that’s not easy.
0:09:12 I’m not saying that’s easy.
0:09:14 And then you have to work at, how do you do that?
0:09:16 And it’ll be different for different people.
0:09:20 So psychological mindedness means take responsibility,
0:09:22 accept what’s in front of you and then move forward.
0:09:26 So other than that, what you do non-psychological mindedness
0:09:29 where you blame everybody else or blame circumstances
0:09:30 or say this happened to me in childhood
0:09:35 or these may all be genuine, but they’re not actually helpful.
0:09:36 – Disempowering, right?
0:09:38 – Yeah, you’re using them as an excuse
0:09:40 not to take responsibility and turn them over.
0:09:41 And whatever it is–
0:09:42 – You’re just giving your power to something else, right?
0:09:44 – Yes.
0:09:45 And you’ve got to get the power back
0:09:47 and say it’s within my power.
0:09:48 – Why do people like doing that?
0:09:50 – Why do people like making excuses?
0:09:53 – Including me, I have to say.
0:09:54 – Again, it’s really difficult.
0:09:58 So I mean, a lot of people, when they’re in not a great place,
0:10:01 it find it very easy to be the victim.
0:10:03 They don’t want to be a victim, but they find it easy.
0:10:07 So they’ll use an illness, as an example,
0:10:09 so that it gives them that remit,
0:10:10 say, “Well, I’m not well, I’m not well.”
0:10:13 When the reality is they don’t know how to move forward,
0:10:15 so it’s easier to just go, “I’m not well,”
0:10:17 and people then go, “Well, I’m not well.”
0:10:19 And there’ll be some truth in it,
0:10:21 but actually not fully the truth.
0:10:24 So people often use, as a defense mechanism,
0:10:25 the victim role.
0:10:28 Sometimes there have been a victim
0:10:30 and then they need to work through that and process it,
0:10:33 but there’s a danger you start to use it.
0:10:34 Or you start blaming circumstance,
0:10:36 like you might have said to me,
0:10:39 “I didn’t make it because my parents never helped me.”
0:10:40 Well, you know, there are people whose parents
0:10:42 don’t help them, but they do make it.
0:10:44 So you have to say, “Well, hang on, don’t use that
0:10:46 “because it’ll keep you in this not great place.”
0:10:48 There will be truth in it, potentially.
0:10:50 And then I would give the TLC and the recognition
0:10:52 that that didn’t help,
0:10:54 but on the other hand, let’s look at what you can do,
0:10:55 regardless of the background.
0:10:57 – And then that last point in the triangle.
0:10:59 – Right. – The habit triangle commitment.
0:11:01 – Yeah, what I’m saying with this is, again,
0:11:03 teasing out the newer science,
0:11:05 if we go on motivation,
0:11:08 and again, if people use it, great, all right,
0:11:10 but the evidence is that it doesn’t really help,
0:11:11 it doesn’t really work.
0:11:13 It’s very hard to maintain.
0:11:15 Whereas if that’s the chimp system,
0:11:17 so it can work if your chimp is motivated
0:11:19 because the reward is so big,
0:11:21 then motivation will follow that and be high.
0:11:23 But we all know that I get a lot of talks,
0:11:24 “Can you help motivate?”
0:11:27 And I say, “No, not at all, I don’t want to do that,”
0:11:29 because you’re constantly propping it up.
0:11:33 My approach, which is not, as everyone will agree,
0:11:35 is if you look at the newer science,
0:11:37 if you use commitment,
0:11:39 that means I remove my emotion,
0:11:42 and I plan on what I have to do, and I get on with it.
0:11:44 So commitment, there’s a lot of evidence
0:11:46 that that makes us succeed.
0:11:48 So for example, if I’ve got to go and weed the garden,
0:11:50 it’s not my favourite pastime,
0:11:53 but I think, right, the neighbours might complain.
0:11:55 I don’t have any neighbours, but they might.
0:11:57 And my chimp’s gonna leave it.
0:12:00 Who cares? There’s only weeds, and it’s gonna kill you back in it.
0:12:02 But I would then say, which I will,
0:12:05 right, you stay in here, I’m going out,
0:12:08 and if you want to join me, great, but I’m doing the garden.
0:12:11 I remove emotion, and I say what has to be done
0:12:12 is getting done, and is getting done now.
0:12:15 We’re not discussing it, and I will start.
0:12:17 Motivation will follow commitment,
0:12:19 and that means the chimp room will then get behind me,
0:12:21 ’cause by the time we’ve done half the garden,
0:12:24 it’ll say, “I can’t believe we’ve left it this long.”
0:12:26 That’s a typical approach by the chimp,
0:12:28 and then it tries to make me finish,
0:12:31 and I might have to stop and say, “Let’s respect my back now.
0:12:32 “We’ll stop now.”
0:12:35 So I manage my emotions by using commitment,
0:12:38 and if they don’t marry, I move them to one side.
0:12:40 So I don’t really work with emotion
0:12:42 to drive me to do something.
0:12:44 I think if people can use that and use motivation,
0:12:45 that’s great.
0:12:48 My experience has been it doesn’t actually hold.
0:12:50 – One of the things this podcast has taught me
0:12:52 from speaking to all these people across multiple fields
0:12:56 is that sometimes we can feel like our body,
0:12:58 our wiring is against us,
0:13:00 especially as it relates to health, right?
0:13:03 So we know sugar is bad.
0:13:05 So why does our brain send us these cravings
0:13:06 to go and eat sugar?
0:13:08 And in the case of distractions
0:13:11 and sort of behavioral psychology,
0:13:16 I know instinctively and intuitively that distractions,
0:13:20 like hanging out on TikTok for an hour, is bad.
0:13:24 But my brain is doing it.
0:13:26 What does that tell us about how we should
0:13:28 go about adopting behavior change?
0:13:30 – Yeah, so that’s why it’s really about this holistic model.
0:13:33 So that’s what took me the most time to figure out
0:13:36 was what are the four mandatory components
0:13:38 of living without regret,
0:13:40 of doing what you say you’re going to do.
0:13:42 So the first step is mastering these internal triggers,
0:13:44 figuring out why you feel this way, right?
0:13:45 What is that underlying sensation?
0:13:48 So if you’re trying to avoid that chocolate bar,
0:13:51 one might be hunger, or it might not be hunger, right?
0:13:53 So I used to be clinically obese.
0:13:54 And I’ll tell you what,
0:13:58 I did not eat to excess because I was hungry.
0:14:00 I was eating to excess because I was lonely.
0:14:02 I was eating to excess because I was bored.
0:14:05 I was eating to excess because I felt guilty
0:14:06 about how much I had just eaten.
0:14:08 It wasn’t just about the hunger, right?
0:14:11 Very few people who are obese
0:14:12 are just hungry all the time.
0:14:13 That’s not what’s going on.
0:14:15 It’s because we’re eating our feelings.
0:14:16 That’s what’s happening.
0:14:17 So that’s the first step.
0:14:19 We have to understand the deeper reason.
0:14:21 – I’m really compelled by, really interested in,
0:14:23 how you figured out the thing you were trying to escape from
0:14:25 because I think that’s the starting point,
0:14:27 which is a very difficult starting point for most people.
0:14:29 They can see the sort of compulsive behavior
0:14:32 that’s maybe making them live outside of their values
0:14:33 or causing them to excessively eat
0:14:36 or excessively watch porn or whatever it might be.
0:14:39 But diagnosing the root cause of that
0:14:41 is a difficult thing to do.
0:14:43 Most of us don’t know what we don’t know.
0:14:45 – It isn’t, it isn’t.
0:14:48 I mean, I’m not, you don’t have to go to therapy.
0:14:49 No, there’s anything wrong with it.
0:14:50 If it’s helpful, please do it.
0:14:51 But that’s not a requirement.
0:14:53 Something as simple as, you know,
0:14:57 so whenever I work, I have on my desk,
0:15:00 I have a little post-it note and a pen handy.
0:15:03 And when I get distracted,
0:15:05 or when I even feel the sense of distraction,
0:15:08 just noting down that sensation,
0:15:10 just writing down what is it that I felt
0:15:12 right before the distraction.
0:15:14 So I write every day.
0:15:16 And all I wanna do when I write, you know this, right?
0:15:19 When you write, all you wanna do is go Google something
0:15:21 or do some research or go check email for a quick sec.
0:15:23 Or let me just find that one thing that might be,
0:15:25 and they’re all distractions.
0:15:28 They’re all taking you away from the core thing you need to do,
0:15:30 which you said you would do, which is right.
0:15:33 And so if I can just pause for a second
0:15:36 and reflect on what was that sensation
0:15:37 that I was feeling right before.
0:15:38 It was boredom.
0:15:38 It was anxiety.
0:15:39 It was fearfulness.
0:15:41 It was uncertainty.
0:15:44 Just writing it down is an incredible first step
0:15:47 towards gaining power over that discomfort
0:15:48 because then you can start to identify it.
0:15:50 And so what I’ll do many times is just pause
0:15:53 to reflect on, wait a minute, what’s going on there?
0:15:54 What is that sensation?
0:15:56 Because then you can begin to do
0:15:58 what’s called reframing the trigger.
0:16:00 So now when I feel the sensation
0:16:01 of wanting to get distracted,
0:16:03 I say, you know what, what’s going on here?
0:16:07 Okay, I’m feeling the sensation because I’m stressed.
0:16:08 Why am I stressed?
0:16:10 Because this is really important to me.
0:16:13 I wanna get this right for my readers and for myself.
0:16:15 And so reframing it as not a negative,
0:16:17 but something that happens not to me,
0:16:20 but for me, that that sensation is a sign
0:16:21 that I can listen to.
0:16:24 I think most of us, we think when we feel this discomfort,
0:16:26 that’s happening to us, right?
0:16:28 But it’s not, it’s happening for us.
0:16:29 It’s a signal for us to listen to.
0:16:32 Now how we interpret it is up to us.
0:16:34 And that’s where the magic happens.
0:16:36 If you interpret it as something that is harmful,
0:16:38 is dangerous, that you need to escape, right?
0:16:41 You don’t wanna feel that uncomfortable sensation.
0:16:43 You look for distraction.
0:16:47 But what we find is that high performers across every field,
0:16:48 when you think about the arts,
0:16:50 when you think about sports, business,
0:16:53 high performers, when they feel those internal triggers,
0:16:54 they experience the same internal triggers
0:16:55 the rest of us do.
0:16:57 They experience loneliness and stress and anxiety,
0:16:58 just like everyone else does.
0:17:02 But they deal with it by using it as rocket fuel
0:17:03 to push them towards traction.
0:17:05 Whereas distractible people,
0:17:06 as soon as they feel that discomfort,
0:17:08 they try and escape it with distraction.
0:17:09 That’s the big difference.
0:17:11 – And then that second step.
0:17:13 So now I’m clear.
0:17:15 I’m trying not to do this book
0:17:17 because this particular chapter,
0:17:19 I just don’t feel that competent on.
0:17:20 I don’t feel like I’ve researched it.
0:17:24 It’s making my brain feel a bit hot thinking about it.
0:17:27 I reframe it and go, okay, so I’ve understood it now.
0:17:28 Then what do I do?
0:17:30 – Yeah, so step one is-
0:17:30 – Understand it.
0:17:34 – Yeah, is master those internal triggers,
0:17:35 or they become your master.
0:17:36 That’s step number one.
0:17:37 There’s a bunch of techniques.
0:17:38 We’re just covering the surfaces
0:17:40 over a dozen different techniques that you can use
0:17:41 to help you master those internal triggers.
0:17:44 Now, the second step is to make time for traction.
0:17:48 So when you have those doubts,
0:17:50 one of these techniques that is really life changing
0:17:54 is scheduling time for worry.
0:17:56 Scheduling time for worry.
0:17:58 That what happens is in the moment,
0:18:01 we feel these feelings, we think these thoughts,
0:18:04 and a distractible person will say,
0:18:06 well, I gotta deal with that sensation right now.
0:18:08 I have to work through whatever it is
0:18:09 that I’m feeling right now.
0:18:11 And they stop everything to do that.
0:18:12 And that’s not the right method.
0:18:14 The right method is to write down that sensation
0:18:17 and get back to the task at hand as quickly as possible.
0:18:20 We’re using these four strategies.
0:18:23 Then later on, right now that you’ve written down
0:18:25 what that sensation is,
0:18:27 you’re going to make time in your calendar
0:18:30 to think about that sensation.
0:18:31 Start processing it.
0:18:32 – Using the book example.
0:18:34 I’ve hit chapter 12 and I just,
0:18:35 I’m struggling with this chapter.
0:18:36 – Right.
0:18:38 – So you, step number one, you have these tools.
0:18:40 Like maybe I can digress for a second.
0:18:43 I’ll tell you my favorite tool for mastering internal triggers.
0:18:44 It’s called the 10 minute rule.
0:18:46 This comes from acceptance and commitment therapy.
0:18:49 And the 10 minute rule says that you can give in
0:18:52 to any distraction, any distraction.
0:18:54 Maybe it’s smoking that cigarette if you’re trying to quit.
0:18:55 Maybe it’s eating that piece of chocolate cake
0:18:56 if you’re on a diet.
0:18:59 Maybe it’s checking social media, whatever it is,
0:19:02 whatever distraction you can give into that distraction,
0:19:03 but not right now.
0:19:06 You can give in in 10 minutes.
0:19:07 Don’t misunderstand, not for 10 minutes.
0:19:08 Sometimes people get it wrong.
0:19:10 It’s in 10 minutes, okay?
0:19:11 So what does that do?
0:19:13 What that does is we talked about
0:19:14 psychological reactants earlier and you asked,
0:19:17 how do you, what do you do about psychological reactants?
0:19:20 You’re allowing yourself to acknowledge
0:19:22 that you are in control, that you decide.
0:19:25 What many people do is they have strict abstinence, right?
0:19:28 Strict abstinence says, no, I will not do it, right?
0:19:29 I won’t eat sugar.
0:19:31 I won’t get distracted.
0:19:32 I will do this, I will do that.
0:19:34 As opposed to saying, hey, I’m an adult.
0:19:36 I can do whatever I want.
0:19:40 I choose not to go off track for the next 10 minutes.
0:19:41 That’s it.
0:19:43 In 10 minutes, I can give in to whatever I want.
0:19:44 So now I’m in control.
0:19:46 You know, the whole just say no technique.
0:19:48 Turns out, makes you ruminate and think about
0:19:51 and have more discomfort around the thing you want,
0:19:53 increasing these internal triggers.
0:19:55 And that actually is what makes you give in to that distraction.
0:19:56 We know that with smoking, actually,
0:19:57 it’s very interesting.
0:20:00 We’re finding that nicotine is less and less part of the,
0:20:02 the reason people get addicted to cigarettes.
0:20:04 It’s more about the rumination around,
0:20:06 I want to smoke, but I can’t.
0:20:07 I want to smoke, but I shouldn’t.
0:20:09 I want to smoke, I want to smoke, I want to smoke, fine.
0:20:10 I’ll finally smoke.
0:20:12 Now I get relief.
0:20:13 How do we know this?
0:20:15 You ask smokers, why do they smoke?
0:20:17 The number one reason, it’s relaxing.
0:20:18 That makes no sense.
0:20:20 Nicotine is a stimulant.
0:20:22 Makes no sense, right?
0:20:22 Why would it be relaxing?
0:20:25 It’s relaxing because finally I can stop telling myself,
0:20:26 I don’t have to do it anymore.
0:20:28 I don’t have to fight with myself anymore.
0:20:31 And that eases that psychological reactance.
0:20:32 I can finally give in.
0:20:34 So when you use this 10 minute rule
0:20:36 and say, okay, I can give into that distraction
0:20:38 in 10 minutes from now,
0:20:41 what you’re doing is you’re establishing agency, right?
0:20:43 Now you’re in control
0:20:44 and we can do anything for 10 minutes.
0:20:46 And if 10 minutes feels like too long,
0:20:47 try the five minute rule.
0:20:50 The idea is that you’re building that ability over time.
0:20:52 So the 10 minute rule becomes a 12 minute rule,
0:20:53 becomes a 15 minute rule.
0:20:54 And you’re learning, wait a minute,
0:20:56 I can actually delay gratification.
0:20:58 Remember, all these problems of distraction
0:21:00 are an impulse control issue.
0:21:02 So when you teach yourself, wait a minute, okay,
0:21:05 I can delay for five, 10 minutes, that’s no big deal.
0:21:05 You’re proving to yourself,
0:21:08 hey, I’m not addicted to these things.
0:21:09 I’m not powerless.
0:21:10 My brain isn’t being hijacked.
0:21:14 I do have control as long as I use these practices, right?
0:21:16 So the 10 minute rule is a very, very effective technique.
0:21:17 – So what happens then?
0:21:18 So I’ve compartmentalized it.
0:21:20 I’m writing my book on my chapter 12.
0:21:22 I’ve got a bunch of worries popping.
0:21:24 I’m scheduling that for later.
0:21:25 Step three.
0:21:27 – So step three is hacking back the external triggers.
0:21:29 So this is when we do talk about the usual suspects,
0:21:31 the pings, the dings, the rings.
0:21:34 That’s where we very systematically go through
0:21:36 what a lot of people complain about,
0:21:38 but it’s really only 10% of the problem,
0:21:40 because 90% of our distractions begin from within.
0:21:42 But people do have these issues.
0:21:45 We talk about the phone, the computer.
0:21:48 What turns out to be a much bigger problem
0:21:49 is not the technology,
0:21:53 it’s what the technology is attached to, right?
0:21:54 So what if it’s your boss?
0:21:55 That’s the distraction.
0:21:57 What if it’s your kids that are distraction?
0:21:58 We love them to death, right?
0:21:59 Our kids are great,
0:22:01 but they can be a huge source of distraction.
0:22:04 Meetings, oh my God, how many stupid meetings
0:22:06 do we have to attend that are nothing but a distraction,
0:22:08 especially now that Zoom makes it accessible
0:22:10 so that wherever you are,
0:22:13 people can call meetings.
0:22:14 Those are huge distractions.
0:22:16 Of course, Slack channels,
0:22:18 and that’s what we get into more in the book
0:22:19 in terms of, okay, systematically,
0:22:22 what do you do about these various external triggers?
0:22:25 – So we’re in step three of the four steps.
0:22:26 What’s step number four?
0:22:29 – So step four is preventing distraction with PACs.
0:22:33 So PACs are these what’s called a pre-commitment device.
0:22:36 So this is what you do after the first three steps.
0:22:38 So you master the internal triggers,
0:22:39 you make time for traction,
0:22:41 you hack back the external triggers.
0:22:43 As the last line of defense,
0:22:45 as the firewall against distraction,
0:22:46 you’re going to prevent distraction with a PAC.
0:22:47 Now what are PACs?
0:22:49 It’s when you decide in advance
0:22:52 what you will do to keep yourself in that task.
0:22:54 And there’s three types of PACs.
0:22:57 We have what we call effort PACs, price PACs,
0:22:58 and identity PACs.
0:23:01 An effort PAC is when there’s some bit of friction
0:23:04 in between you and the thing you don’t want to do.
0:23:07 So it’s just us and your millions of viewers here.
0:23:10 So I’ll get a little personal, okay?
0:23:11 A few years ago, my wife and I,
0:23:13 and again, we’ve been married for 22 years now.
0:23:15 A few years ago, before I was writing this book,
0:23:19 we noticed that our sex life was suffering.
0:23:21 That every night we were going to bed
0:23:23 and I was fondling my iPhone
0:23:25 and she was caressing her iPad, right?
0:23:27 And we were going to bed later and later.
0:23:30 And not only were we not getting proper sleep,
0:23:32 we all know how important rest is,
0:23:33 our sex life was suffering.
0:23:35 So when I started this research,
0:23:40 I came across this research around
0:23:42 the importance of these effort PACs.
0:23:44 And I went to the hardware store
0:23:48 and I bought us this $10 outlet timer.
0:23:50 Now this outlet timer, you plug it into the wall
0:23:53 and whatever you plug into that outlet timer
0:23:56 will turn on or off at any time of day and night.
0:23:57 So what did we do with that?
0:24:02 We plugged in our internet router into this timer.
0:24:05 So every night in our household at 10 p.m.,
0:24:07 the internet shuts off.
0:24:09 Now, could I turn it back on?
0:24:11 Of course I could, but I’d have to go under my desk,
0:24:14 unplug this timer, reset it and plug it back in.
0:24:15 That would take effort.
0:24:18 So I put some friction in between myself
0:24:20 and the distraction, okay?
0:24:22 And lo and behold, every night we all knew,
0:24:24 okay, the internet’s gonna shut down at 10 p.m.,
0:24:25 finish up whatever you need to do
0:24:27 and it gave me that bit of mindfulness to say,
0:24:30 okay, do I really need to still check email
0:24:32 or social media or whatever silly thing I was doing?
0:24:34 Or is it time to do what I said I was going to do,
0:24:36 which is get some rest, go to bed
0:24:39 and maybe be intimate with my wife.
0:24:39 – Someone’s also gonna say,
0:24:41 listen, you’ve got 4G internet on your phone.
0:24:44 You’ve got cellular internet, so you can just go on.
0:24:47 – True, again, but now it’s effort, right?
0:24:49 If I really wanted to lie to myself, of course I could.
0:24:51 That’s not the point, right?
0:24:52 That there’s always a way.
0:24:55 The point is it adds a bit of friction, right?
0:24:57 It’s that bit of effort that now I have to take.
0:24:59 – And more than anything, it’s a statement
0:25:02 you’re making to you and everyone in your social environment
0:25:03 that at 10 p.m. is a shut off time.
0:25:05 Whether people are dear to that, as you say,
0:25:07 there’s ways to circumnavigate that,
0:25:09 but it’s the statement of having that shut off time.
0:25:11 – Exactly, and now by the way,
0:25:12 it actually wouldn’t even matter
0:25:15 because we all know the internet’s gonna shut off at 10.
0:25:16 We all need to start getting ready
0:25:18 to stop doing whatever we’re doing
0:25:21 because it’s gonna, now we don’t even need it anymore.
0:25:24 It’s become part of our nightly ritual, right?
0:25:25 And by the way, what I wanna illustrate
0:25:28 is the concept, not the practice, right?
0:25:31 Tactics are what you do, strategy is why you do it.
0:25:32 That’s more important.
0:25:34 I think a lot of these books around similar topics,
0:25:39 around dealing with focus and productivity,
0:25:41 it’s a lot of life hacks, right?
0:25:44 But what I wanted was more the strategy,
0:25:47 the psychological principles around why we get distracted
0:25:50 and then I’ll let people come up with their own tactics.
0:25:53 – Willpower is not enough.
0:25:54 This is maybe the most fascinating study I read
0:25:56 of all of them because it really made me ponder
0:25:59 and it kind of disrupted my thinking on willpower
0:26:03 and strength and mental strength and motivation.
0:26:06 And it’s probably a huge reason
0:26:10 why 91% of people don’t stick to their resolutions.
0:26:12 Dozens of studies show that willpower
0:26:16 is the single most important habit for individual success.
0:26:21 And this is true, but for a long time,
0:26:23 people thought that willpower is a skill
0:26:24 that you could develop
0:26:27 and that therefore remains constant forever
0:26:31 until Mark Murravan, a PhD scientist,
0:26:34 argued that if willpower is a skill,
0:26:36 then why does it not remain constant
0:26:37 throughout the whole day?
0:26:38 Or even throughout the whole week,
0:26:42 why does willpower seem to fluctuate?
0:26:44 He conducted an experiment to prove that willpower,
0:26:46 like all of the muscles in our body,
0:26:50 gets exhausted the more we use it throughout the day.
0:26:53 In his lab, he did a fairly simple thing.
0:26:56 He set up one bowl of freshly baked cookies
0:26:59 and then he set up another bowl of radishes.
0:27:01 And listen, everybody hates radishes, including me.
0:27:03 Well, you know, chop them up, put them in a salad.
0:27:05 Maybe I don’t hate them, they’re good for you.
0:27:06 But anyway, in this example,
0:27:08 most people would prefer hot, delicious cookies
0:27:10 than radishes, right?
0:27:11 And the participants in the study
0:27:13 were divided into two groups.
0:27:16 One group was instructed to eat the delicious cookies
0:27:17 and ignore the radishes.
0:27:20 The other group was instructed to ignore
0:27:22 the delicious cookies and to eat the radishes.
0:27:25 I know which group I would have rather been in.
0:27:28 After five minutes into that experiment,
0:27:29 the researchers re-entered the room
0:27:33 and gave both groups of people a puzzle.
0:27:36 But the thing is, the puzzle was impossible to complete.
0:27:38 And here’s what happened.
0:27:40 The people that had eaten the cookie
0:27:43 with their unused reservoir of willpower,
0:27:45 because they hadn’t had to use their willpower,
0:27:47 they hadn’t had to use their restraint,
0:27:48 looked way more relaxed
0:27:51 when they were trying to solve that impossible puzzle
0:27:53 and they would continue to try and solve it
0:27:55 over and over and over again.
0:27:58 Some worked for more than half an hour
0:28:00 before the researcher told them to stop.
0:28:03 On average, the cookie eaters spent almost 19 minutes
0:28:04 trying to solve that puzzle
0:28:06 before they eventually quit, on average.
0:28:09 Now, in the case of the radish eaters
0:28:10 with their depleted willpower,
0:28:13 because they had to practice restraint,
0:28:15 they acted completely differently.
0:28:17 It was a completely opposite story.
0:28:21 They vented as they worked to try and solve that puzzle.
0:28:22 They got frustrated.
0:28:25 One even complained that the whole experiment
0:28:27 was a waste of time.
0:28:29 Some of them put their heads on the table,
0:28:31 closed their eyes, and one of them even snapped
0:28:34 at the researcher when she came back in.
0:28:35 On average, the radish eaters worked
0:28:39 for roughly eight minutes, 60% less.
0:28:41 They tried to solve the problem of the puzzle,
0:28:44 the impossible puzzle, for 60% less time
0:28:47 than the cookie eaters before quitting.
0:28:48 And when I read this study, I was shocked,
0:28:49 but I’m a skeptic.
0:28:51 So I tried to think of why this might be.
0:28:52 I tried to think of other factors.
0:28:54 And I thought of, maybe it’s the sugar.
0:28:56 Maybe the sugar in the cookies
0:28:57 are causing them to work harder.
0:28:58 But when you look at other studies
0:29:00 where there isn’t sugar,
0:29:02 anytime someone’s practicing restraint,
0:29:04 the same effects are seen.
0:29:07 Willpower isn’t just a skill, it’s a muscle.
0:29:10 Like the muscles in your arms or your legs.
0:29:11 And it gets tired.
0:29:14 And it gets tired as it’s forced to work harder.
0:29:17 So there’s less power left over for all of the other things.
0:29:18 And since that cookie study was published,
0:29:22 I think in 1998, numerous studies have built a case
0:29:23 for the exact same thing.
0:29:25 They call it the willpower depletion theory.
0:29:29 In one incredible example, which is almost hard to believe,
0:29:31 volunteers who were asked to suppress their feelings
0:29:33 as they watched an emotional movie
0:29:37 gave up sooner on a test that they did after
0:29:41 of physical stamina than volunteers who watched the film
0:29:44 and were allowed to react in whatever way they wanted to.
0:29:46 So if you were asked to restrain yourself
0:29:48 when you then did a physical exercise,
0:29:51 people gave up sooner in the physical exercise.
0:29:53 In a similar study, which pointed at the exact same
0:29:56 conclusion, people who were asked to suppress
0:29:59 certain thoughts were less able to stifle laughter
0:30:02 in a follow-up test, which was designed to make them giggle.
0:30:06 So if the science here is correct, which I suspect it is,
0:30:09 and willpower is a limited resource,
0:30:12 it’s really obvious that the more pressure
0:30:16 and restrictions and strain you put on yourself
0:30:19 when you’re trying to make a new habit and break old ones,
0:30:21 the less the chance you have of achieving them,
0:30:24 the more chance you have of rebounding and relapsing.
0:30:28 This is why unsustainable crash diets just don’t work.
0:30:31 This is why anytime you feel like you’re depriving yourself
0:30:33 of something that you really want,
0:30:36 you nearly always end up failing and falling into relapse.
0:30:40 This is why in a 2014 study, almost 40% of people,
0:30:42 so they failed on their New Year’s resolutions
0:30:46 because the goal was too unsustainable or unrealistic
0:30:50 and 10% said they failed because they had too many goals.
0:30:52 This is why it’s so important
0:30:54 as you think about what goals you’re setting
0:30:55 to make sure that they’re small enough
0:30:59 and achievable enough to become sustainable
0:31:01 without the need for major sacrifice
0:31:03 which will deplete your willpower reserves.
0:31:06 And that for me was a real revelation
0:31:08 because I think about all the habits I’ve tried to set.
0:31:11 You know, when I talked about trying to get a six pack
0:31:12 for summer, think about what I said.
0:31:14 I obsessively ate healthy food.
0:31:17 I went to the gym every day for six months.
0:31:20 My willpower eventually became depleted and I rebounded.
0:31:23 Rebounded like a yo-yo like you’ve never seen before.
0:31:25 And this is why you shouldn’t try and give up
0:31:27 every bad habit that you have at the same time.
0:31:30 This is why less goals increase the chance
0:31:31 of completing all of your goals
0:31:33 because with too many big unrealistic
0:31:35 sacrifice-centric goals,
0:31:37 your willpower will be under tremendous
0:31:39 unsustainable strain.
0:31:40 It will run out.
0:31:43 You will fail and it will rebound.
0:31:46 And this is also why so many psychologists and scientists
0:31:47 have found that the best way to create a new habit
0:31:51 isn’t by depriving yourself of all rewards.
0:31:53 That is totally counterproductive according to the science.
0:31:57 It’s by finding new rewards, healthier rewards,
0:31:58 less addictive rewards,
0:32:00 but nonetheless making sure
0:32:05 that you still reward yourself in some way
0:32:07 every day along the way.
0:32:10 (upbeat music)
0:32:12 (upbeat music)
0:32:15 (upbeat music)
0:32:25 [BLANK_AUDIO]
0:00:07 There are three systems in your head, keeping it very simple.
0:00:10 It’s much more complex than that, but simplifying it.
0:00:13 One of the systems will help you think very logically,
0:00:15 and I call that the human system.
0:00:18 It thinks logically, but it’s very slow,
0:00:21 which means if you operate with a human,
0:00:24 your body and your reflexes will slow down,
0:00:26 because you’re analyzing as you go along,
0:00:29 and it slows the system so you’re more pensive.
0:00:31 If he goes into the second system,
0:00:34 which we’ll probably come back to, the chimp system,
0:00:37 this is a primitive system which thinks.
0:00:39 It’s more than just a reaction and impulsive system.
0:00:40 It thinks.
0:00:43 When it moves, it can move at speed,
0:00:45 but it thinks emotionally.
0:00:48 Finally, the third system is a computer.
0:00:49 It just needs programming.
0:00:52 The key to the computer, particularly in sport,
0:00:56 is it moves so fast, it’s approximately 20 times
0:00:59 quicker than the human system to execute,
0:01:02 and it’s about four times quicker than the chimp system.
0:01:03 Habits.
0:01:07 A lot of people are thinking about habits, it’s January.
0:01:11 I made a video on habits a couple of weeks ago.
0:01:13 In a path through the jungle,
0:01:19 you talk about how our habits are influenced by our self-image.
0:01:21 That was a curious sentence to read,
0:01:23 and not something I’d heard before.
0:01:24 What do you mean by that?
0:01:27 Okay, there’s lots of ways we form habits,
0:01:30 whether they’re helpful or destructive.
0:01:32 I’m giving examples, so that’s one you picked out.
0:01:34 It’s quite powerful if you grasp it.
0:01:37 For example, I’ll take the simple example,
0:01:40 which I may have put in the book, I don’t remember.
0:01:42 If I wrote down, I’d say to someone,
0:01:44 “Do you see yourself as someone who,
0:01:46 “as a tidy person, who gets on with things immediately,
0:01:48 “or do you see yourself as someone who procrastinates,
0:01:49 “and it’s pretty untidy?”
0:01:50 I’m untidy.
0:01:53 Right, so if you’ve got that self-image,
0:01:55 and you go home and your room is untidy,
0:01:56 and being very black and white here,
0:01:58 then there’s no feelings at all,
0:02:00 ’cause that’s who you are, you’re untidy.
0:02:00 That’s true.
0:02:01 So, if you don’t do anything.
0:02:02 That’s true.
0:02:04 Whereas if you say, right, change your image,
0:02:06 and say, actually, my chimp being untidy,
0:02:07 I’m a tidy person.
0:02:12 In some cases, you’re now programming the computer,
0:02:14 you now go home and say, wow, this isn’t me,
0:02:16 and that can change.
0:02:19 So, if your self-image is, I’m not my chimp,
0:02:20 that’s an untidy little beggar,
0:02:22 I am actually a tidy person.
0:02:24 How do I change that self-image then?
0:02:26 Well, you’ve got to sit down and reflect on this.
0:02:28 I mean, a lot of the things in the book,
0:02:30 I’ve done as a young doctor,
0:02:32 when I became a psychiatrist, I decided,
0:02:33 I didn’t want to be a psychiatrist,
0:02:35 who didn’t actually manage themself,
0:02:37 and that’s no detriment to psychs who struggle,
0:02:40 because it’s not an easy career, or any therapist,
0:02:42 it’s a tough career.
0:02:44 But I decided, look, I’m gonna work on me,
0:02:46 because I can’t keep doing this,
0:02:47 which is where the chimp model came from.
0:02:49 And it was one of my light bulb moments,
0:02:53 many, many years ago, where I would be procrastinating,
0:02:55 and then I suddenly thought, you know what,
0:02:58 that isn’t who I want to be.
0:03:00 So I thought, that isn’t me,
0:03:02 I’m actually someone who gets on with things,
0:03:04 and they used to get in, and I’d just go, right,
0:03:05 get on with it.
0:03:06 And it’s never left me, I just thought,
0:03:09 no, that is who I am, so I’ve become uncomfortable now.
0:03:11 If things weren’t tidy, I’d agitate,
0:03:14 and say, no, get it tidied up.
0:03:17 So I start perceiving myself as this energized guy,
0:03:18 who’s gonna get up and do stuff.
0:03:20 So if you define yourself image,
0:03:22 you’re actually programming your computer to say,
0:03:25 this is normal, anything else isn’t,
0:03:28 and that will actually help your chimp to agitate,
0:03:31 which will then join forces and tidy the room.
0:03:33 So instead of your chimp going, oh, I can’t be bothered,
0:03:37 suddenly it’s saying, wow, I’m being told we’re not untidy,
0:03:39 so this is an acceptable, not normal.
0:03:41 And that’s what I did,
0:03:43 and I found that very powerful in my life.
0:03:45 – The other thing I found really curious in this section
0:03:48 about habits in chapter, in stage four of the book is,
0:03:50 when people think about habit loops,
0:03:53 they often have a reward at the end of it.
0:03:55 You referenced suffering.
0:03:57 Now, there’s this quote I heard many years ago,
0:03:59 I think it was just over 10 years ago,
0:04:01 it must have been, God, I’m getting old.
0:04:03 Where I heard this YouTuber say,
0:04:05 change happens when the pain of staying the same
0:04:08 becomes greater than the pain of making a change.
0:04:09 And when I’m thinking about friends
0:04:11 that I have in my life, all myself,
0:04:13 where there’s habits or there’s behavior patterns
0:04:14 that I wanna break,
0:04:17 sometimes I’m thinking about one particular person
0:04:20 who’s a musician,
0:04:23 sometimes they have to get to that rock bottom place
0:04:25 before you see change happen.
0:04:26 Is that because of that?
0:04:27 Is that because sometimes the suffering has to-
0:04:30 – Yeah, I mean, it’s sort of self-evident.
0:04:32 If you’re, for example, in a bad relationship
0:04:34 and it’s really not doing any favors
0:04:36 and it’s not doing them any favors,
0:04:38 but it’s not bad enough,
0:04:40 then you struggle along and struggle along.
0:04:41 But if suddenly something happens
0:04:44 where it becomes untenable and it’s painful now,
0:04:47 then you move, you think stop the relationship.
0:04:49 And then you look back thinking, why didn’t I move earlier?
0:04:53 And the answer was because it wasn’t painful enough.
0:04:55 And the same with like untidiness.
0:04:56 You leave it and leave it and leave it.
0:04:59 And then somebody comes in and says-
0:05:00 – A partner. – Yeah.
0:05:02 Lie me, I can’t live with this.
0:05:06 And suddenly you think, wow, suddenly it’s painful.
0:05:07 – Is there a way to get there
0:05:09 without the person needing to point it out?
0:05:10 – Yeah, there is.
0:05:13 I mean, when I talk about relationships are critical to us.
0:05:16 And I say to people, the way we move is we’ve got to,
0:05:18 I have the triangle of change,
0:05:21 which is really the three key things that cause us to move.
0:05:22 And with the one you’ve highlighted
0:05:25 is either it’s got a massive reward
0:05:27 or there’s going to be massive pain and suffering.
0:05:30 So if you’re trying to, you’re courting someone,
0:05:31 you want to form a permanent relationship.
0:05:33 When they say, I can’t stand untidiness,
0:05:36 you’ll guarantee your flat’s perfect when they come in, right?
0:05:37 Because you’re thinking, if I don’t,
0:05:38 I’m going to lose this person.
0:05:40 So the reward is so big.
0:05:42 However, then they marry you.
0:05:44 And for some reason we tip them for granted
0:05:46 and we forget that bit now.
0:05:48 And then the flat becomes untidy.
0:05:50 And then she starts saying to you,
0:05:52 I’m struggling with this, I’m struggling,
0:05:53 but there’s no threat yet.
0:05:55 So now it’s not painful enough.
0:05:56 So she’s struggling with it.
0:06:00 I love the guy, but this is now what I do.
0:06:02 So I say, let’s increase the pain.
0:06:05 I want you to sit down and imagine she can’t cope.
0:06:08 And she’s had a bad day and someone at work says,
0:06:10 I’ll come over and chat.
0:06:13 And this young man has a tidy flat naturally.
0:06:15 And she goes, oh, wow.
0:06:17 And I warn people, how are you going to feel if she walks?
0:06:20 Because once they’ve gone, they very, very come back.
0:06:23 And if you don’t look after them, someone else will.
0:06:25 If you reflect on that,
0:06:29 that can suddenly make reality come to life to say,
0:06:32 I’m not there yet, but blame me, this would be painful.
0:06:34 So I’m suddenly going to stop and think,
0:06:35 let me look after them.
0:06:37 Because if I don’t, somebody will.
0:06:40 So you can increase the concept of suffering
0:06:41 by reflecting and thinking,
0:06:44 what would like be like if she left?
0:06:47 There’s the devil’s in the detail.
0:06:49 Let’s say that you go home and you really make an effort.
0:06:51 You tidy the house and you really clean it up.
0:06:54 And she comes home and she doesn’t notice.
0:06:55 And there’s a danger now.
0:06:58 And I do advocate that sometimes you say to them,
0:07:00 because your chimp needs to get that accolade.
0:07:02 So it’s no good not helping it.
0:07:04 You don’t need that, but your chimp does.
0:07:05 So it’s worth saying, can I just say,
0:07:07 because I love you, I’ve tidied the flat.
0:07:09 Because then your chimp goes, right, good.
0:07:10 I get the accolade now.
0:07:13 So I’m not saying you should not rub the chimp out.
0:07:16 I’m saying you should be getting the chimp so it feels good.
0:07:19 And then hopefully she’ll say, wow, I love you too.
0:07:20 And I appreciate that.
0:07:22 And then that’s nicely rounded up.
0:07:25 But you do get circumcised where I’ll work with people.
0:07:26 I tidied the flat.
0:07:27 I did everything she doesn’t even recognise it.
0:07:28 I cancelled it from my diary.
0:07:30 She didn’t recognise it.
0:07:33 And I think, well, you know, I’m not saying I’m a goodie-goody,
0:07:35 but I’m saying, let them know because your chimp’s saying,
0:07:39 please make sure they know and they’ve recognised it.
0:07:40 And again, I don’t know.
0:07:41 There may be couples where they say,
0:07:42 if I say that, she’ll lose it.
0:07:44 So I say, well, don’t do it then.
0:07:47 Tell me, and I as a therapist will say to you, well done.
0:07:48 And that might be enough for your chimp.
0:07:51 So again, it’s that thing which I keep saying to Steve,
0:07:53 I’ve got to work with the person in front of me
0:07:56 and even potentially their partner or family
0:08:00 and say, well, what would they do before we make a plan?
0:08:02 – That was step one in your triangle.
0:08:04 – Yeah, one of the points.
0:08:07 The other two, for people to shift,
0:08:09 they’ve got to have psychological mindedness,
0:08:11 which means they’ve got to understand
0:08:13 that it’s not about what happens to us in life,
0:08:15 it’s how we deal with it.
0:08:16 That’s basically what we mean.
0:08:19 So we understand that just because you’ve got certain emotions
0:08:23 doesn’t mean you can’t change them and things have to change,
0:08:25 or people have to change for you to change.
0:08:28 It’s within your power to be responsible
0:08:30 for the things you believe and change.
0:08:32 So psychological mindedness means you get up
0:08:34 and start working on this.
0:08:35 It’s within your power to shift things.
0:08:37 – That’s that personal responsibility.
0:08:39 – Yes, and also if you can’t shift them.
0:08:43 Say, go back, let’s say life hadn’t been great for you
0:08:45 and I’m sure you worked hard to get your way you’ve got,
0:08:48 but let’s say you’re still in that poverty situation,
0:08:50 you thought, I didn’t have the skill to do what I’m doing.
0:08:53 I didn’t use that skill because it was never there.
0:08:55 So a lot of people are trapped
0:08:57 and they say, well, I’m still living in a pretty bad place
0:08:59 and I’m struggling financially and that’s a lot of people.
0:09:02 It’s painful, but again, psychological mindedness,
0:09:05 tough as it is, is to say, well, let me deal with that.
0:09:10 I can’t change it, but I can change my approach to it.
0:09:11 And that’s not easy.
0:09:12 I’m not saying that’s easy.
0:09:14 And then you have to work at, how do you do that?
0:09:16 And it’ll be different for different people.
0:09:20 So psychological mindedness means take responsibility,
0:09:22 accept what’s in front of you and then move forward.
0:09:26 So other than that, what you do non-psychological mindedness
0:09:29 where you blame everybody else or blame circumstances
0:09:30 or say this happened to me in childhood
0:09:35 or these may all be genuine, but they’re not actually helpful.
0:09:36 – Disempowering, right?
0:09:38 – Yeah, you’re using them as an excuse
0:09:40 not to take responsibility and turn them over.
0:09:41 And whatever it is–
0:09:42 – You’re just giving your power to something else, right?
0:09:44 – Yes.
0:09:45 And you’ve got to get the power back
0:09:47 and say it’s within my power.
0:09:48 – Why do people like doing that?
0:09:50 – Why do people like making excuses?
0:09:53 – Including me, I have to say.
0:09:54 – Again, it’s really difficult.
0:09:58 So I mean, a lot of people, when they’re in not a great place,
0:10:01 it find it very easy to be the victim.
0:10:03 They don’t want to be a victim, but they find it easy.
0:10:07 So they’ll use an illness, as an example,
0:10:09 so that it gives them that remit,
0:10:10 say, “Well, I’m not well, I’m not well.”
0:10:13 When the reality is they don’t know how to move forward,
0:10:15 so it’s easier to just go, “I’m not well,”
0:10:17 and people then go, “Well, I’m not well.”
0:10:19 And there’ll be some truth in it,
0:10:21 but actually not fully the truth.
0:10:24 So people often use, as a defense mechanism,
0:10:25 the victim role.
0:10:28 Sometimes there have been a victim
0:10:30 and then they need to work through that and process it,
0:10:33 but there’s a danger you start to use it.
0:10:34 Or you start blaming circumstance,
0:10:36 like you might have said to me,
0:10:39 “I didn’t make it because my parents never helped me.”
0:10:40 Well, you know, there are people whose parents
0:10:42 don’t help them, but they do make it.
0:10:44 So you have to say, “Well, hang on, don’t use that
0:10:46 “because it’ll keep you in this not great place.”
0:10:48 There will be truth in it, potentially.
0:10:50 And then I would give the TLC and the recognition
0:10:52 that that didn’t help,
0:10:54 but on the other hand, let’s look at what you can do,
0:10:55 regardless of the background.
0:10:57 – And then that last point in the triangle.
0:10:59 – Right. – The habit triangle commitment.
0:11:01 – Yeah, what I’m saying with this is, again,
0:11:03 teasing out the newer science,
0:11:05 if we go on motivation,
0:11:08 and again, if people use it, great, all right,
0:11:10 but the evidence is that it doesn’t really help,
0:11:11 it doesn’t really work.
0:11:13 It’s very hard to maintain.
0:11:15 Whereas if that’s the chimp system,
0:11:17 so it can work if your chimp is motivated
0:11:19 because the reward is so big,
0:11:21 then motivation will follow that and be high.
0:11:23 But we all know that I get a lot of talks,
0:11:24 “Can you help motivate?”
0:11:27 And I say, “No, not at all, I don’t want to do that,”
0:11:29 because you’re constantly propping it up.
0:11:33 My approach, which is not, as everyone will agree,
0:11:35 is if you look at the newer science,
0:11:37 if you use commitment,
0:11:39 that means I remove my emotion,
0:11:42 and I plan on what I have to do, and I get on with it.
0:11:44 So commitment, there’s a lot of evidence
0:11:46 that that makes us succeed.
0:11:48 So for example, if I’ve got to go and weed the garden,
0:11:50 it’s not my favourite pastime,
0:11:53 but I think, right, the neighbours might complain.
0:11:55 I don’t have any neighbours, but they might.
0:11:57 And my chimp’s gonna leave it.
0:12:00 Who cares? There’s only weeds, and it’s gonna kill you back in it.
0:12:02 But I would then say, which I will,
0:12:05 right, you stay in here, I’m going out,
0:12:08 and if you want to join me, great, but I’m doing the garden.
0:12:11 I remove emotion, and I say what has to be done
0:12:12 is getting done, and is getting done now.
0:12:15 We’re not discussing it, and I will start.
0:12:17 Motivation will follow commitment,
0:12:19 and that means the chimp room will then get behind me,
0:12:21 ’cause by the time we’ve done half the garden,
0:12:24 it’ll say, “I can’t believe we’ve left it this long.”
0:12:26 That’s a typical approach by the chimp,
0:12:28 and then it tries to make me finish,
0:12:31 and I might have to stop and say, “Let’s respect my back now.
0:12:32 “We’ll stop now.”
0:12:35 So I manage my emotions by using commitment,
0:12:38 and if they don’t marry, I move them to one side.
0:12:40 So I don’t really work with emotion
0:12:42 to drive me to do something.
0:12:44 I think if people can use that and use motivation,
0:12:45 that’s great.
0:12:48 My experience has been it doesn’t actually hold.
0:12:50 – One of the things this podcast has taught me
0:12:52 from speaking to all these people across multiple fields
0:12:56 is that sometimes we can feel like our body,
0:12:58 our wiring is against us,
0:13:00 especially as it relates to health, right?
0:13:03 So we know sugar is bad.
0:13:05 So why does our brain send us these cravings
0:13:06 to go and eat sugar?
0:13:08 And in the case of distractions
0:13:11 and sort of behavioral psychology,
0:13:16 I know instinctively and intuitively that distractions,
0:13:20 like hanging out on TikTok for an hour, is bad.
0:13:24 But my brain is doing it.
0:13:26 What does that tell us about how we should
0:13:28 go about adopting behavior change?
0:13:30 – Yeah, so that’s why it’s really about this holistic model.
0:13:33 So that’s what took me the most time to figure out
0:13:36 was what are the four mandatory components
0:13:38 of living without regret,
0:13:40 of doing what you say you’re going to do.
0:13:42 So the first step is mastering these internal triggers,
0:13:44 figuring out why you feel this way, right?
0:13:45 What is that underlying sensation?
0:13:48 So if you’re trying to avoid that chocolate bar,
0:13:51 one might be hunger, or it might not be hunger, right?
0:13:53 So I used to be clinically obese.
0:13:54 And I’ll tell you what,
0:13:58 I did not eat to excess because I was hungry.
0:14:00 I was eating to excess because I was lonely.
0:14:02 I was eating to excess because I was bored.
0:14:05 I was eating to excess because I felt guilty
0:14:06 about how much I had just eaten.
0:14:08 It wasn’t just about the hunger, right?
0:14:11 Very few people who are obese
0:14:12 are just hungry all the time.
0:14:13 That’s not what’s going on.
0:14:15 It’s because we’re eating our feelings.
0:14:16 That’s what’s happening.
0:14:17 So that’s the first step.
0:14:19 We have to understand the deeper reason.
0:14:21 – I’m really compelled by, really interested in,
0:14:23 how you figured out the thing you were trying to escape from
0:14:25 because I think that’s the starting point,
0:14:27 which is a very difficult starting point for most people.
0:14:29 They can see the sort of compulsive behavior
0:14:32 that’s maybe making them live outside of their values
0:14:33 or causing them to excessively eat
0:14:36 or excessively watch porn or whatever it might be.
0:14:39 But diagnosing the root cause of that
0:14:41 is a difficult thing to do.
0:14:43 Most of us don’t know what we don’t know.
0:14:45 – It isn’t, it isn’t.
0:14:48 I mean, I’m not, you don’t have to go to therapy.
0:14:49 No, there’s anything wrong with it.
0:14:50 If it’s helpful, please do it.
0:14:51 But that’s not a requirement.
0:14:53 Something as simple as, you know,
0:14:57 so whenever I work, I have on my desk,
0:15:00 I have a little post-it note and a pen handy.
0:15:03 And when I get distracted,
0:15:05 or when I even feel the sense of distraction,
0:15:08 just noting down that sensation,
0:15:10 just writing down what is it that I felt
0:15:12 right before the distraction.
0:15:14 So I write every day.
0:15:16 And all I wanna do when I write, you know this, right?
0:15:19 When you write, all you wanna do is go Google something
0:15:21 or do some research or go check email for a quick sec.
0:15:23 Or let me just find that one thing that might be,
0:15:25 and they’re all distractions.
0:15:28 They’re all taking you away from the core thing you need to do,
0:15:30 which you said you would do, which is right.
0:15:33 And so if I can just pause for a second
0:15:36 and reflect on what was that sensation
0:15:37 that I was feeling right before.
0:15:38 It was boredom.
0:15:38 It was anxiety.
0:15:39 It was fearfulness.
0:15:41 It was uncertainty.
0:15:44 Just writing it down is an incredible first step
0:15:47 towards gaining power over that discomfort
0:15:48 because then you can start to identify it.
0:15:50 And so what I’ll do many times is just pause
0:15:53 to reflect on, wait a minute, what’s going on there?
0:15:54 What is that sensation?
0:15:56 Because then you can begin to do
0:15:58 what’s called reframing the trigger.
0:16:00 So now when I feel the sensation
0:16:01 of wanting to get distracted,
0:16:03 I say, you know what, what’s going on here?
0:16:07 Okay, I’m feeling the sensation because I’m stressed.
0:16:08 Why am I stressed?
0:16:10 Because this is really important to me.
0:16:13 I wanna get this right for my readers and for myself.
0:16:15 And so reframing it as not a negative,
0:16:17 but something that happens not to me,
0:16:20 but for me, that that sensation is a sign
0:16:21 that I can listen to.
0:16:24 I think most of us, we think when we feel this discomfort,
0:16:26 that’s happening to us, right?
0:16:28 But it’s not, it’s happening for us.
0:16:29 It’s a signal for us to listen to.
0:16:32 Now how we interpret it is up to us.
0:16:34 And that’s where the magic happens.
0:16:36 If you interpret it as something that is harmful,
0:16:38 is dangerous, that you need to escape, right?
0:16:41 You don’t wanna feel that uncomfortable sensation.
0:16:43 You look for distraction.
0:16:47 But what we find is that high performers across every field,
0:16:48 when you think about the arts,
0:16:50 when you think about sports, business,
0:16:53 high performers, when they feel those internal triggers,
0:16:54 they experience the same internal triggers
0:16:55 the rest of us do.
0:16:57 They experience loneliness and stress and anxiety,
0:16:58 just like everyone else does.
0:17:02 But they deal with it by using it as rocket fuel
0:17:03 to push them towards traction.
0:17:05 Whereas distractible people,
0:17:06 as soon as they feel that discomfort,
0:17:08 they try and escape it with distraction.
0:17:09 That’s the big difference.
0:17:11 – And then that second step.
0:17:13 So now I’m clear.
0:17:15 I’m trying not to do this book
0:17:17 because this particular chapter,
0:17:19 I just don’t feel that competent on.
0:17:20 I don’t feel like I’ve researched it.
0:17:24 It’s making my brain feel a bit hot thinking about it.
0:17:27 I reframe it and go, okay, so I’ve understood it now.
0:17:28 Then what do I do?
0:17:30 – Yeah, so step one is-
0:17:30 – Understand it.
0:17:34 – Yeah, is master those internal triggers,
0:17:35 or they become your master.
0:17:36 That’s step number one.
0:17:37 There’s a bunch of techniques.
0:17:38 We’re just covering the surfaces
0:17:40 over a dozen different techniques that you can use
0:17:41 to help you master those internal triggers.
0:17:44 Now, the second step is to make time for traction.
0:17:48 So when you have those doubts,
0:17:50 one of these techniques that is really life changing
0:17:54 is scheduling time for worry.
0:17:56 Scheduling time for worry.
0:17:58 That what happens is in the moment,
0:18:01 we feel these feelings, we think these thoughts,
0:18:04 and a distractible person will say,
0:18:06 well, I gotta deal with that sensation right now.
0:18:08 I have to work through whatever it is
0:18:09 that I’m feeling right now.
0:18:11 And they stop everything to do that.
0:18:12 And that’s not the right method.
0:18:14 The right method is to write down that sensation
0:18:17 and get back to the task at hand as quickly as possible.
0:18:20 We’re using these four strategies.
0:18:23 Then later on, right now that you’ve written down
0:18:25 what that sensation is,
0:18:27 you’re going to make time in your calendar
0:18:30 to think about that sensation.
0:18:31 Start processing it.
0:18:32 – Using the book example.
0:18:34 I’ve hit chapter 12 and I just,
0:18:35 I’m struggling with this chapter.
0:18:36 – Right.
0:18:38 – So you, step number one, you have these tools.
0:18:40 Like maybe I can digress for a second.
0:18:43 I’ll tell you my favorite tool for mastering internal triggers.
0:18:44 It’s called the 10 minute rule.
0:18:46 This comes from acceptance and commitment therapy.
0:18:49 And the 10 minute rule says that you can give in
0:18:52 to any distraction, any distraction.
0:18:54 Maybe it’s smoking that cigarette if you’re trying to quit.
0:18:55 Maybe it’s eating that piece of chocolate cake
0:18:56 if you’re on a diet.
0:18:59 Maybe it’s checking social media, whatever it is,
0:19:02 whatever distraction you can give into that distraction,
0:19:03 but not right now.
0:19:06 You can give in in 10 minutes.
0:19:07 Don’t misunderstand, not for 10 minutes.
0:19:08 Sometimes people get it wrong.
0:19:10 It’s in 10 minutes, okay?
0:19:11 So what does that do?
0:19:13 What that does is we talked about
0:19:14 psychological reactants earlier and you asked,
0:19:17 how do you, what do you do about psychological reactants?
0:19:20 You’re allowing yourself to acknowledge
0:19:22 that you are in control, that you decide.
0:19:25 What many people do is they have strict abstinence, right?
0:19:28 Strict abstinence says, no, I will not do it, right?
0:19:29 I won’t eat sugar.
0:19:31 I won’t get distracted.
0:19:32 I will do this, I will do that.
0:19:34 As opposed to saying, hey, I’m an adult.
0:19:36 I can do whatever I want.
0:19:40 I choose not to go off track for the next 10 minutes.
0:19:41 That’s it.
0:19:43 In 10 minutes, I can give in to whatever I want.
0:19:44 So now I’m in control.
0:19:46 You know, the whole just say no technique.
0:19:48 Turns out, makes you ruminate and think about
0:19:51 and have more discomfort around the thing you want,
0:19:53 increasing these internal triggers.
0:19:55 And that actually is what makes you give in to that distraction.
0:19:56 We know that with smoking, actually,
0:19:57 it’s very interesting.
0:20:00 We’re finding that nicotine is less and less part of the,
0:20:02 the reason people get addicted to cigarettes.
0:20:04 It’s more about the rumination around,
0:20:06 I want to smoke, but I can’t.
0:20:07 I want to smoke, but I shouldn’t.
0:20:09 I want to smoke, I want to smoke, I want to smoke, fine.
0:20:10 I’ll finally smoke.
0:20:12 Now I get relief.
0:20:13 How do we know this?
0:20:15 You ask smokers, why do they smoke?
0:20:17 The number one reason, it’s relaxing.
0:20:18 That makes no sense.
0:20:20 Nicotine is a stimulant.
0:20:22 Makes no sense, right?
0:20:22 Why would it be relaxing?
0:20:25 It’s relaxing because finally I can stop telling myself,
0:20:26 I don’t have to do it anymore.
0:20:28 I don’t have to fight with myself anymore.
0:20:31 And that eases that psychological reactance.
0:20:32 I can finally give in.
0:20:34 So when you use this 10 minute rule
0:20:36 and say, okay, I can give into that distraction
0:20:38 in 10 minutes from now,
0:20:41 what you’re doing is you’re establishing agency, right?
0:20:43 Now you’re in control
0:20:44 and we can do anything for 10 minutes.
0:20:46 And if 10 minutes feels like too long,
0:20:47 try the five minute rule.
0:20:50 The idea is that you’re building that ability over time.
0:20:52 So the 10 minute rule becomes a 12 minute rule,
0:20:53 becomes a 15 minute rule.
0:20:54 And you’re learning, wait a minute,
0:20:56 I can actually delay gratification.
0:20:58 Remember, all these problems of distraction
0:21:00 are an impulse control issue.
0:21:02 So when you teach yourself, wait a minute, okay,
0:21:05 I can delay for five, 10 minutes, that’s no big deal.
0:21:05 You’re proving to yourself,
0:21:08 hey, I’m not addicted to these things.
0:21:09 I’m not powerless.
0:21:10 My brain isn’t being hijacked.
0:21:14 I do have control as long as I use these practices, right?
0:21:16 So the 10 minute rule is a very, very effective technique.
0:21:17 – So what happens then?
0:21:18 So I’ve compartmentalized it.
0:21:20 I’m writing my book on my chapter 12.
0:21:22 I’ve got a bunch of worries popping.
0:21:24 I’m scheduling that for later.
0:21:25 Step three.
0:21:27 – So step three is hacking back the external triggers.
0:21:29 So this is when we do talk about the usual suspects,
0:21:31 the pings, the dings, the rings.
0:21:34 That’s where we very systematically go through
0:21:36 what a lot of people complain about,
0:21:38 but it’s really only 10% of the problem,
0:21:40 because 90% of our distractions begin from within.
0:21:42 But people do have these issues.
0:21:45 We talk about the phone, the computer.
0:21:48 What turns out to be a much bigger problem
0:21:49 is not the technology,
0:21:53 it’s what the technology is attached to, right?
0:21:54 So what if it’s your boss?
0:21:55 That’s the distraction.
0:21:57 What if it’s your kids that are distraction?
0:21:58 We love them to death, right?
0:21:59 Our kids are great,
0:22:01 but they can be a huge source of distraction.
0:22:04 Meetings, oh my God, how many stupid meetings
0:22:06 do we have to attend that are nothing but a distraction,
0:22:08 especially now that Zoom makes it accessible
0:22:10 so that wherever you are,
0:22:13 people can call meetings.
0:22:14 Those are huge distractions.
0:22:16 Of course, Slack channels,
0:22:18 and that’s what we get into more in the book
0:22:19 in terms of, okay, systematically,
0:22:22 what do you do about these various external triggers?
0:22:25 – So we’re in step three of the four steps.
0:22:26 What’s step number four?
0:22:29 – So step four is preventing distraction with PACs.
0:22:33 So PACs are these what’s called a pre-commitment device.
0:22:36 So this is what you do after the first three steps.
0:22:38 So you master the internal triggers,
0:22:39 you make time for traction,
0:22:41 you hack back the external triggers.
0:22:43 As the last line of defense,
0:22:45 as the firewall against distraction,
0:22:46 you’re going to prevent distraction with a PAC.
0:22:47 Now what are PACs?
0:22:49 It’s when you decide in advance
0:22:52 what you will do to keep yourself in that task.
0:22:54 And there’s three types of PACs.
0:22:57 We have what we call effort PACs, price PACs,
0:22:58 and identity PACs.
0:23:01 An effort PAC is when there’s some bit of friction
0:23:04 in between you and the thing you don’t want to do.
0:23:07 So it’s just us and your millions of viewers here.
0:23:10 So I’ll get a little personal, okay?
0:23:11 A few years ago, my wife and I,
0:23:13 and again, we’ve been married for 22 years now.
0:23:15 A few years ago, before I was writing this book,
0:23:19 we noticed that our sex life was suffering.
0:23:21 That every night we were going to bed
0:23:23 and I was fondling my iPhone
0:23:25 and she was caressing her iPad, right?
0:23:27 And we were going to bed later and later.
0:23:30 And not only were we not getting proper sleep,
0:23:32 we all know how important rest is,
0:23:33 our sex life was suffering.
0:23:35 So when I started this research,
0:23:40 I came across this research around
0:23:42 the importance of these effort PACs.
0:23:44 And I went to the hardware store
0:23:48 and I bought us this $10 outlet timer.
0:23:50 Now this outlet timer, you plug it into the wall
0:23:53 and whatever you plug into that outlet timer
0:23:56 will turn on or off at any time of day and night.
0:23:57 So what did we do with that?
0:24:02 We plugged in our internet router into this timer.
0:24:05 So every night in our household at 10 p.m.,
0:24:07 the internet shuts off.
0:24:09 Now, could I turn it back on?
0:24:11 Of course I could, but I’d have to go under my desk,
0:24:14 unplug this timer, reset it and plug it back in.
0:24:15 That would take effort.
0:24:18 So I put some friction in between myself
0:24:20 and the distraction, okay?
0:24:22 And lo and behold, every night we all knew,
0:24:24 okay, the internet’s gonna shut down at 10 p.m.,
0:24:25 finish up whatever you need to do
0:24:27 and it gave me that bit of mindfulness to say,
0:24:30 okay, do I really need to still check email
0:24:32 or social media or whatever silly thing I was doing?
0:24:34 Or is it time to do what I said I was going to do,
0:24:36 which is get some rest, go to bed
0:24:39 and maybe be intimate with my wife.
0:24:39 – Someone’s also gonna say,
0:24:41 listen, you’ve got 4G internet on your phone.
0:24:44 You’ve got cellular internet, so you can just go on.
0:24:47 – True, again, but now it’s effort, right?
0:24:49 If I really wanted to lie to myself, of course I could.
0:24:51 That’s not the point, right?
0:24:52 That there’s always a way.
0:24:55 The point is it adds a bit of friction, right?
0:24:57 It’s that bit of effort that now I have to take.
0:24:59 – And more than anything, it’s a statement
0:25:02 you’re making to you and everyone in your social environment
0:25:03 that at 10 p.m. is a shut off time.
0:25:05 Whether people are dear to that, as you say,
0:25:07 there’s ways to circumnavigate that,
0:25:09 but it’s the statement of having that shut off time.
0:25:11 – Exactly, and now by the way,
0:25:12 it actually wouldn’t even matter
0:25:15 because we all know the internet’s gonna shut off at 10.
0:25:16 We all need to start getting ready
0:25:18 to stop doing whatever we’re doing
0:25:21 because it’s gonna, now we don’t even need it anymore.
0:25:24 It’s become part of our nightly ritual, right?
0:25:25 And by the way, what I wanna illustrate
0:25:28 is the concept, not the practice, right?
0:25:31 Tactics are what you do, strategy is why you do it.
0:25:32 That’s more important.
0:25:34 I think a lot of these books around similar topics,
0:25:39 around dealing with focus and productivity,
0:25:41 it’s a lot of life hacks, right?
0:25:44 But what I wanted was more the strategy,
0:25:47 the psychological principles around why we get distracted
0:25:50 and then I’ll let people come up with their own tactics.
0:25:53 – Willpower is not enough.
0:25:54 This is maybe the most fascinating study I read
0:25:56 of all of them because it really made me ponder
0:25:59 and it kind of disrupted my thinking on willpower
0:26:03 and strength and mental strength and motivation.
0:26:06 And it’s probably a huge reason
0:26:10 why 91% of people don’t stick to their resolutions.
0:26:12 Dozens of studies show that willpower
0:26:16 is the single most important habit for individual success.
0:26:21 And this is true, but for a long time,
0:26:23 people thought that willpower is a skill
0:26:24 that you could develop
0:26:27 and that therefore remains constant forever
0:26:31 until Mark Murravan, a PhD scientist,
0:26:34 argued that if willpower is a skill,
0:26:36 then why does it not remain constant
0:26:37 throughout the whole day?
0:26:38 Or even throughout the whole week,
0:26:42 why does willpower seem to fluctuate?
0:26:44 He conducted an experiment to prove that willpower,
0:26:46 like all of the muscles in our body,
0:26:50 gets exhausted the more we use it throughout the day.
0:26:53 In his lab, he did a fairly simple thing.
0:26:56 He set up one bowl of freshly baked cookies
0:26:59 and then he set up another bowl of radishes.
0:27:01 And listen, everybody hates radishes, including me.
0:27:03 Well, you know, chop them up, put them in a salad.
0:27:05 Maybe I don’t hate them, they’re good for you.
0:27:06 But anyway, in this example,
0:27:08 most people would prefer hot, delicious cookies
0:27:10 than radishes, right?
0:27:11 And the participants in the study
0:27:13 were divided into two groups.
0:27:16 One group was instructed to eat the delicious cookies
0:27:17 and ignore the radishes.
0:27:20 The other group was instructed to ignore
0:27:22 the delicious cookies and to eat the radishes.
0:27:25 I know which group I would have rather been in.
0:27:28 After five minutes into that experiment,
0:27:29 the researchers re-entered the room
0:27:33 and gave both groups of people a puzzle.
0:27:36 But the thing is, the puzzle was impossible to complete.
0:27:38 And here’s what happened.
0:27:40 The people that had eaten the cookie
0:27:43 with their unused reservoir of willpower,
0:27:45 because they hadn’t had to use their willpower,
0:27:47 they hadn’t had to use their restraint,
0:27:48 looked way more relaxed
0:27:51 when they were trying to solve that impossible puzzle
0:27:53 and they would continue to try and solve it
0:27:55 over and over and over again.
0:27:58 Some worked for more than half an hour
0:28:00 before the researcher told them to stop.
0:28:03 On average, the cookie eaters spent almost 19 minutes
0:28:04 trying to solve that puzzle
0:28:06 before they eventually quit, on average.
0:28:09 Now, in the case of the radish eaters
0:28:10 with their depleted willpower,
0:28:13 because they had to practice restraint,
0:28:15 they acted completely differently.
0:28:17 It was a completely opposite story.
0:28:21 They vented as they worked to try and solve that puzzle.
0:28:22 They got frustrated.
0:28:25 One even complained that the whole experiment
0:28:27 was a waste of time.
0:28:29 Some of them put their heads on the table,
0:28:31 closed their eyes, and one of them even snapped
0:28:34 at the researcher when she came back in.
0:28:35 On average, the radish eaters worked
0:28:39 for roughly eight minutes, 60% less.
0:28:41 They tried to solve the problem of the puzzle,
0:28:44 the impossible puzzle, for 60% less time
0:28:47 than the cookie eaters before quitting.
0:28:48 And when I read this study, I was shocked,
0:28:49 but I’m a skeptic.
0:28:51 So I tried to think of why this might be.
0:28:52 I tried to think of other factors.
0:28:54 And I thought of, maybe it’s the sugar.
0:28:56 Maybe the sugar in the cookies
0:28:57 are causing them to work harder.
0:28:58 But when you look at other studies
0:29:00 where there isn’t sugar,
0:29:02 anytime someone’s practicing restraint,
0:29:04 the same effects are seen.
0:29:07 Willpower isn’t just a skill, it’s a muscle.
0:29:10 Like the muscles in your arms or your legs.
0:29:11 And it gets tired.
0:29:14 And it gets tired as it’s forced to work harder.
0:29:17 So there’s less power left over for all of the other things.
0:29:18 And since that cookie study was published,
0:29:22 I think in 1998, numerous studies have built a case
0:29:23 for the exact same thing.
0:29:25 They call it the willpower depletion theory.
0:29:29 In one incredible example, which is almost hard to believe,
0:29:31 volunteers who were asked to suppress their feelings
0:29:33 as they watched an emotional movie
0:29:37 gave up sooner on a test that they did after
0:29:41 of physical stamina than volunteers who watched the film
0:29:44 and were allowed to react in whatever way they wanted to.
0:29:46 So if you were asked to restrain yourself
0:29:48 when you then did a physical exercise,
0:29:51 people gave up sooner in the physical exercise.
0:29:53 In a similar study, which pointed at the exact same
0:29:56 conclusion, people who were asked to suppress
0:29:59 certain thoughts were less able to stifle laughter
0:30:02 in a follow-up test, which was designed to make them giggle.
0:30:06 So if the science here is correct, which I suspect it is,
0:30:09 and willpower is a limited resource,
0:30:12 it’s really obvious that the more pressure
0:30:16 and restrictions and strain you put on yourself
0:30:19 when you’re trying to make a new habit and break old ones,
0:30:21 the less the chance you have of achieving them,
0:30:24 the more chance you have of rebounding and relapsing.
0:30:28 This is why unsustainable crash diets just don’t work.
0:30:31 This is why anytime you feel like you’re depriving yourself
0:30:33 of something that you really want,
0:30:36 you nearly always end up failing and falling into relapse.
0:30:40 This is why in a 2014 study, almost 40% of people,
0:30:42 so they failed on their New Year’s resolutions
0:30:46 because the goal was too unsustainable or unrealistic
0:30:50 and 10% said they failed because they had too many goals.
0:30:52 This is why it’s so important
0:30:54 as you think about what goals you’re setting
0:30:55 to make sure that they’re small enough
0:30:59 and achievable enough to become sustainable
0:31:01 without the need for major sacrifice
0:31:03 which will deplete your willpower reserves.
0:31:06 And that for me was a real revelation
0:31:08 because I think about all the habits I’ve tried to set.
0:31:11 You know, when I talked about trying to get a six pack
0:31:12 for summer, think about what I said.
0:31:14 I obsessively ate healthy food.
0:31:17 I went to the gym every day for six months.
0:31:20 My willpower eventually became depleted and I rebounded.
0:31:23 Rebounded like a yo-yo like you’ve never seen before.
0:31:25 And this is why you shouldn’t try and give up
0:31:27 every bad habit that you have at the same time.
0:31:30 This is why less goals increase the chance
0:31:31 of completing all of your goals
0:31:33 because with too many big unrealistic
0:31:35 sacrifice-centric goals,
0:31:37 your willpower will be under tremendous
0:31:39 unsustainable strain.
0:31:40 It will run out.
0:31:43 You will fail and it will rebound.
0:31:46 And this is also why so many psychologists and scientists
0:31:47 have found that the best way to create a new habit
0:31:51 isn’t by depriving yourself of all rewards.
0:31:53 That is totally counterproductive according to the science.
0:31:57 It’s by finding new rewards, healthier rewards,
0:31:58 less addictive rewards,
0:32:00 but nonetheless making sure
0:32:05 that you still reward yourself in some way
0:32:07 every day along the way.
0:32:10 (upbeat music)
0:32:12 (upbeat music)
0:32:15 (upbeat music)
0:32:25 [BLANK_AUDIO]
In this episode we discover the science behind habits, how they’re formed, how they can be broken, and the fascinating role self-perception plays in the process. We explore the power of reframing uncomfortable tasks, how habits are influenced by our self-image, and why pushing yourself too hard can backfire. You’ll also learn why willpower is a limited resource, how to use discomfort as a tool for growth, and why small, achievable goals are the key to lasting change.
Professor Steve Peters Episode – https://bit.ly/4jqZSGK
Nir Eyal’s Episode – https://bit.ly/3WuY05U
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