AI transcript
0:00:15 I’m Guy Kawasaki and this is Remarkable People. Aloha! We are joined today by the remarkable
0:00:22 Jerry Lopez. He’s known as Mr. Pipeline. He was born in Honolulu, Hawaii and his early
0:00:28 surfing career started at the Alamoana Balls. This paved his way for a spectacular surfing
0:00:35 career. He won the title of Hawaii State Champion at just 14. His evolution continued
0:00:41 at Oahu’s North Shore, where he mastered the Banzai Pipeline. He scored victories at
0:00:50 the Pipeline Masters in 1972 and 1973. His influence extends beyond riding waves to also
0:00:55 surfboard manufacturing. He co-founded the Lightning Bolt Surfboard Company, where he
0:01:02 pioneered high-performance shortboards. He’s also somewhat of a movie star. He had great
0:01:07 roles in North Shore and Conan the Barbarian. He’s the source of one of my favorite movie
0:01:14 lines of all time. He’s so Howley, he doesn’t even know he’s Howley. I’ll explain that
0:01:21 to you. Howley is a somewhat negative term used in Hawaii for white people. So when this
0:01:27 mainland Howley came to Hawaii and started surfing on the North Shore, he had to break
0:01:33 into a group of locals. And let’s just say that locals are not always initially welcoming
0:01:40 to strangers. Basically, Jerry is saying that the mainland Howley is so dumb, he doesn’t
0:01:48 even know he’s dumb. What can I say? You had to be there. Jerry is truly a legend. He exemplifies
0:01:54 passion, innovation, and inspiration. You’ll also find out in this episode about the relationship
0:02:00 of yoga and surfing, as well as whether I should fix a board that he made for me that
0:02:08 was damaged in a very funny incident. I’m Guy Kawasaki. This is Remarkable People. Join
0:02:14 me in celebrating the remarkable life of Mr. Pipeline, Jerry Lopez.
0:02:21 Quote, he’s so Howley, he doesn’t even know he’s Howley. That’s you in North Shore, right?
0:02:26 Yeah, that was a fun project we did. That was a while ago. I was in the early 80s. When
0:02:32 I read the script, I thought, wow, this is a pretty good script. This is believable.
0:02:41 And today, now with the whole wave pool thing, it’s really becoming like a very real possibility
0:02:47 that there may be some very near future world champion that learns how to surf in a wave
0:02:54 pool. And who came up with that line? Because whoever came up with the line truly understood
0:03:00 Howley. When I read the script, obviously, there was a lot of whoever, the guys that
0:03:05 wrote the script were a little bit Howley, but they wanted to use pigeon in a lot of
0:03:11 the things that I was saying and the who we guys were saying. But their pigeon wasn’t
0:03:20 very authentic. I ended up actually becoming one of the technical advisors. You mean putting
0:03:27 most of the pigeon lines in that movie. So you’re a linguist as well as a surfer, just
0:03:32 like you. We grew up with pigeon. Probably your parents were just like mine. They wouldn’t
0:03:39 let us talk pigeon in the house. But when we were with all our friends, it’s funny because
0:03:46 I’m 69 years old and I went to college in the mainland and I have been trying to lose
0:03:53 my pigeon for 40, 50 years. But people still come up to me and say, I heard you just talk.
0:03:59 Are you from Hawaii? And I’m like, what the hell? What’s giving this away? And then a
0:04:04 few months ago, I interviewed this linguist on this show and she said you should stop
0:04:11 being ashamed of your accent. It’s part of you. Don’t try to clean it up. Just be you.
0:04:18 It’s always there. And when us locals hear each other speak, even if we don’t know each
0:04:27 other, just look at them and go, so I’m local. So has anybody ever pointed out the irony
0:04:35 that someone from Punahou was playing a North Shore Moke? I mean, there is some irony there,
0:04:46 right, Jerry? I guess there is, right? Okay, let’s take us back to your first wave at Queens.
0:04:51 What was the feeling? That’s a feeling that never leaves. I don’t think any surfer. They
0:04:58 always remember that first wave. And what they remember is that gliding, just that the waves
0:05:04 doing all the work and you’re just gliding along like riding down a hill on a bicycle
0:05:15 with no hands, just sailing along. And I think it just touches everyone somewhere deep inside.
0:05:22 And that’s the reason, you know, surfing is like it is. And surfers are like they are
0:05:30 that all they want to do is go surf and recapture that feeling again. But it’s always the first
0:05:37 one that makes the biggest impression. Yeah, I started surfing at 60. And if I had surfed
0:05:43 as a kid, I would not be where I am today. There’s no way. I’d be making coffee at Alamona
0:05:50 Center for somebody right now. I know surfing doesn’t take some of your time, it takes all
0:05:57 of it. Yeah, I take a break from surfing to work now. There’s a story in your book about
0:06:04 how you got arrested on Kauai for trespassing on the Robinson land. And I want to know what
0:06:12 you took away from that experience though. You didn’t serve any time, you got exonerated.
0:06:19 But what’s the lesson there? You better know the rules before you play the game. Yeah,
0:06:27 you know, we were just tired and lazy from surfing all day. And we knew better. But right
0:06:32 at the end, right before you get to the Waimea River, there was a little road that you didn’t
0:06:39 have to walk over all the rocks on the beach. And we just weren’t thinking and we jumped
0:06:46 on that road. And we knew that was a private road, even though it was right next to the
0:06:55 beach. And then they were waiting for us busted. But it’s not like I’m a big localism kind
0:07:03 of guy. But you could make the case that this is Hawaii and you guys are howley rich plantation
0:07:09 owners. What is the big deal about letting surfers walk on your road? Well, obviously
0:07:16 the judge felt that too, because in the end, he said there was no intention to trespass.
0:07:23 And he let us go. We couldn’t believe it. We didn’t know what was going to happen. But
0:07:33 we didn’t think we were going to, you know, get away with that off to Oahu prison we go.
0:07:41 I have a question from left field, which is maybe you can explain to me. Why is the skill
0:07:48 100 held in such high regard? It’s almost like mystical. The people who have a skill
0:07:55 100, it’s like this magic thing that you cannot get. And what’s so magical about that tool?
0:08:03 It was just the ideal tool for shaping foam, because we’ve tried to recreate it. I worked
0:08:10 with Gordon Clark at Clark foam and Jeff Holtby when they tried to take a Hitachi and make
0:08:17 it work like a skill. And it was just, it was the angle of the handle. And it was the
0:08:26 way the adjuster for the depth of cut worked that it was just perfect for shaping foam
0:08:32 into a surfboard. And today they’re really hard to find. How hard could it be for skill
0:08:43 to re reintroduce that? I don’t think there’s that big of a demand for them. Okay, fair enough.
0:08:50 A lot of the information about you goes really deep into yoga. So can you explain for us
0:08:57 the connection of yoga and surfing? When I was, I think it was my sophomore year, I
0:09:02 saw a bunch of good looking Wahinis looking at a bulletin board. So, you know, I like
0:09:08 to think I just went walk up there and hey, how’s it? What’s happening? But most likely
0:09:13 I was very meekly peeked over their shoulders to see what they were interested in. And there
0:09:19 was a yoga class announcement there on the board when they looked at me and put me on
0:09:27 the spot. Are you going? And of course. And I’m sure I went to that class hoping to see
0:09:35 those girls again. But what I found was something that really made a big impression on me ever
0:09:42 since then. I mean, I thought that watching that yoga instructor, this was in 1968, too.
0:09:52 There weren’t many yoga opportunities like this available. And watching that gal just
0:09:57 watching her move, I thought yoga is going to make me a better surfer. I better learn
0:10:04 how to do this. And I stuck with it. You know, I found that over the years that like surfing,
0:10:11 yoga only comes into a person’s life when I guess it’s supposed to. It has to be the
0:10:18 right time. And I’ve tried to introduce so many friends to it, but it wasn’t the right
0:10:26 time for them. So they weren’t that interested. But when it is, it will happen. And is it
0:10:32 the effect of stretching and strengthening or is it a mental thing that links yoga and
0:10:39 surfing? This is like the one hand clapping question for me and something I’ve thought
0:10:48 about over all these years, which for me, it’s been like over 50 years for yoga and long
0:10:55 time for surfing. Obviously, the physical part is really important. But the idea in
0:11:05 yoga is that there’s this whole universe of experience that occurs in this unseen realm
0:11:13 of existence that is constantly every moment of our lives influencing us. And the yogis
0:11:20 call it prana, the Hawaiians call it mana, which is another interesting thing that why
0:11:27 these two cultures on opposite sides of the world world would have almost the same word
0:11:33 for the exact same thing. What they’re talking about is the life force that animates all
0:11:41 life. And I believe that in order to surf successfully, which you have discovered later
0:11:47 in life, which is probably a better time to find that because you probably have thought
0:11:57 about it a lot. But in order to ride away successfully, you have to be in that meditative,
0:12:04 deep meditative state of mind. And if you aren’t, wipe out. And the beauty of surfing
0:12:12 is that you attain that state of mind almost instantaneously the moment that you start
0:12:18 paddling for that wave and especially the moment when you stand up on that surfboard.
0:12:26 To get to that same state of mind in a yoga practice requires a lot more time and some
0:12:35 pretty deep concentration. In a way in surfing, we get to cheat. We get to that state almost
0:12:43 more easily than anyone else except maybe Yogananda who lived in that state. But that’s
0:12:50 something that’s been really intriguing to me for a long time. And I’m really thinking
0:12:56 more and more about that. I’m actually working on another book right now, dealing exactly
0:13:10 that.
0:13:15 We will help you promote that book when it comes out. I don’t suppose it’s as simple
0:13:23 as I asked Jerry Lopez, tell me the three or four yoga poses that will improve my surfing.
0:13:26 And I just do that. It’s not that easy, I think, right?
0:13:36 One of the real lessons in yoga is not in perfecting the pose, but it’s embracing the
0:13:45 process. That way it doesn’t become a dead end of unfulfilled perfection, but an ongoing
0:13:52 evolution of the whole process. And it’s just yoga. It’s something that everybody’s
0:14:01 different level of experience, just development. And you just hug the process and be happy
0:14:04 with where it takes you.
0:14:11 I’m friend with Sean Thompson. And Sean once told me, guy, professional surfing, there
0:14:18 is no training like there is for football and basketball, football and basketball offseason,
0:14:24 you’re hitting the weights, you’re doing all this kind of stuff. But surfers, they just
0:14:30 go out and surf. And now you have yoga. And every once in a while, of course, when you
0:14:35 see a movie or documentary about surfing, there’s the scene where they’re holding a
0:14:40 rock and they’re running underwater. But is that true? Like, why don’t surfers go and
0:14:46 really lift weights and do all that kind of stuff and train? Or am I just mistaken about
0:14:47 that?
0:14:56 No, the top guys all train now. I mean, they spend a lot of time in the gym. And the fitness
0:15:03 level has to be so high, especially for the guys that are surfing the big waves, but even
0:15:10 for the guys that are on the tour that are surfing smaller waves, they have to be top
0:15:20 condition at the highest level of athleticism to do what they do. And injury is so close
0:15:26 with especially the maneuvers and stuff that they do these days, they fly in the air and
0:15:34 easy to get hurt. And when you’re injured, just like football or baseball, if you can’t
0:15:37 come back and play, you’re out.
0:15:38 Tell Sean he’s wrong.
0:15:47 No, I mean, he’s not wrong at all. But that’s true because there’s really nothing except
0:15:52 paddling a surfboard that gets you in shape for paddling a surfboard. It was really interesting
0:15:59 when I moved up here to Oregon, my son met these kids in school and we became friends
0:16:05 with the parents. And I introduced them to surfing out on the Oregon coast here. And
0:16:12 I was telling them the hardest part is paddling. And these kids took to surfing like I couldn’t
0:16:19 believe I’d never seen anybody do that, even top athletes. And I went, wow, what’s the deal?
0:16:24 How come they can paddle surfboards? I go, were you guys swim team guys? And they go,
0:16:32 oh, we swam a little. Later on, I found out they were Nordic skiers. And Nordic skiing
0:16:39 requires the same arm movements that paddling a surfboard does. And it was really interesting
0:16:46 to me that, wow, there’s some cross training for surfing that no one ever thought of. But
0:16:52 that’s the hard part. Surfing is 90% paddling. When, when you don’t do it, you lose it.
0:17:00 So you gotta keep doing it. So no, Sean is absolutely correct. All you can do is just
0:17:05 go surfing as much as you can. I reached out to Sean and I said, Sean, I’m interviewing
0:17:14 Jerry Lopez tomorrow. What should I ask him? And Sean, Sean says, ask him what kind of
0:17:21 cake he was eating when he said pipeline is a cake walk.
0:17:26 The pipeline was really a big part of my life. And Sean says, well, when he came over from
0:17:35 South Africa, he really liked that wave too. And he was very skilled already. And he adapted
0:17:42 to it much quicker than many, many guys that lived in Hawaii. But when you surf a spot
0:17:48 enough, you get familiar with it. Eventually, if that’s what you’re trying to do, you develop
0:17:56 a relationship with it, a personal relationship. And I really always thought that my relationship
0:18:03 with the pipeline was pretty deep and pretty special. And I got away with a lot of stuff
0:18:11 that a lot of other guys didn’t get away with. And eventually at the pipeline, everybody
0:18:18 gets hurt. It’s not if it’s when, and the more you push it, eventually that’s going
0:18:25 to happen. And I had to pay to play out there. And I did willingly because I really enjoyed
0:18:32 that spot, just like Sean and all those guys, they did too. And they came at a time when
0:18:40 the pipeline was just becoming a popular spot because back in the late sixties and the very
0:18:45 early seventies, the place to surf on the North Shore was Sunset Beach. That was the
0:18:53 challenging spot and nobody came to the pipeline. It had a reputation. It had hurt a lot of
0:19:00 people and had already killed one really good surfer from Peru. And so it had a specter
0:19:08 about it, a reputation. And everybody went to sunset. That’s why I think I had a little
0:19:14 bit of an advantage at the pipeline was because nobody was there. And I got to learn about
0:19:21 that place without the big crowds. And then the attention started changing because not
0:19:27 only was it really easy to photograph, but when the waves were good there, it looked
0:19:32 really spectacular on film. And they had my picture in a couple surf movies before that
0:19:37 in the beginning days, when they started surfing, the pipeline was in the surf movies,
0:19:45 but it was always the wipeout section. And that was really mostly because the equipment,
0:19:51 the surfboards weren’t really suited to that wave. And it was our generation when the early
0:19:58 seventies there, when the shortboards started coming that we were able to develop equipment
0:20:05 that worked there. And that gave us some success surfing the wave. And then they showed it
0:20:10 in the movies. And then the next thing, you know, all the attention now is all on the
0:20:16 pipeline and nobody even remembers sunset beach.
0:20:22 In a sense, isn’t this Jeff Clark has Maverick’s to himself for 15 years. And now when you
0:20:29 go out to Maverick, there’s like 40 people out there or more or more. Yeah. Surfing was
0:20:38 a small sport. And because it is so attractive and appealing, it’s grown so rapidly. None
0:20:46 of us ever believed it was going to get as big as it has. And Sean had, and his group
0:20:52 where they first guys, when they came around, they go, we’re going to get paid to go surfing.
0:20:58 These guys in Hawaii, me and Barry Kanaiapuni, Tiger Espar, Eddie, I come, we looked at them,
0:21:04 we laugh up. Hey, who’s going to pay you to go surfing? Nobody going to pay you. They
0:21:14 were right. And they had some vision in regards to that surfing was going to grow and the
0:21:19 industry was going to get on a footing where like it is today, where they pay these top
0:21:24 surfers a nice salary to go surfing. Jerry, a lot of people listening to this, they may
0:21:30 not know, what the hell is he talking about pipeline? And obviously it’s a break and it’s
0:21:36 a place people surf, but at a higher, more metaphysical level, can you explain what pipeline
0:21:45 represents to surfing? What it’s become in my lifetime is maybe one of the higher or
0:21:54 if not highest level of surfing for any surfer to test himself to test how much of a surfer
0:22:02 he wants to be, it’s become one of the ultimate waves. Yeah, the pipeline, like I said, started
0:22:13 out as not a real popular spot. And suddenly the focus completely changed. And now it is
0:22:20 considered one of the ultimate surfing spots in the world today. And just in my lifetime,
0:22:26 surfing went from a very small obscure sport that none of our parents wanted us to become
0:22:32 surfers. They wanted us to do something useful with our lives. And we just, we couldn’t help
0:22:39 ourselves. And here I am 75 years old. And I still, that’s all I want to do is go surfing
0:22:47 as much as I can. And I don’t know. I don’t feel bad about that. I actually feel good
0:22:54 about it. For any surfers out there listening, what’s the gist of how you successfully surf
0:23:01 pipeline? Not that I’m going to do this, just give us kind of the insights on how you conquered
0:23:09 or maybe not conquer, but how you sink with that wave. In the beginning, it looked so
0:23:16 fast and so hollow. And this was the reason that the old longboards had such difficulty
0:23:24 there because the surfers were equally as skilled as any of the surfers are today. But
0:23:30 their equipment was holding them back. As the boards improved, then the guys started having
0:23:38 a lot more success. And the surfboards have continued to improve. And today, these guys
0:23:45 are at, like I said, such a high level of athleticism that they’re able to ride surfboards
0:23:52 that in my time, I would think, well, it’s way too small a surfboard. But they are such
0:23:59 good surfers now that they’re able to do that on this wave, wave that hasn’t changed. It’s
0:24:05 still very fast. Their quick draw has gotten a lot quicker these days. There seems to be
0:24:11 better shots. When you see Garrett McNamara surf a hundred foot wave in Nazaree or people
0:24:17 at Mavericks, do you say that’s not really surfing or that’s the ultimate in surfing?
0:24:23 What’s the difference between someone surfing Nazaree and someone surfing pipeline? It’s
0:24:33 all surfing. And all of it is impressive. On the top guys are just unbelievably impressive.
0:24:39 And even the guys, I don’t think I’d paddle out at Nazaree. In fact, I know I would and
0:24:46 especially nowadays, someone like Garrett who pretty much pioneered the place. So he got
0:24:54 an email from two Portuguese surfers that said, Hey, can you come over here and look
0:25:01 at our wave and tell us what you think? Because we think it’s really a good wave. And you
0:25:08 know, at first, he, I don’t know. And then finally he went and he looked and he went,
0:25:16 holy cow. And so he was really the guy to pioneer that place and show the rest of the
0:25:26 world how big a wave can be surfed. And that’s something else. And you know, in Europe, Garrett
0:25:35 McNamara is like a legend because the Europeans, they take their sports heroes really seriously.
0:25:41 I mean, even more than us guys over here, especially the people in Hawaii, but Garrett’s
0:25:46 a big deal for what he does, you know, and he made surfing, which was already becoming
0:25:56 big in Europe, much bigger. I watched the Patagonia documentary about you. And you more or less
0:26:03 freely admit that you got better. And one of the methods was stealing a lot of waves.
0:26:07 What’s your current thinking on surf etiquette these days? Is it like every man for himself
0:26:17 or have you gotten mellower in your old age? No, you got to surf with Aloha. But Duke tried
0:26:25 to tell us all us guys that in the beginning, you know, and we was young and stupid. And
0:26:32 of course surfing was, like I said, such a much smaller sport then, but today it’s busy
0:26:39 and you can’t get away with being a jerk anymore. Yeah, it’s all about learning how
0:26:44 to not only live with Aloha, but especially to go when you go surfing to surf with Aloha
0:26:51 too. I surf with a few people who don’t have Aloha and they’re pretty good surfers. And
0:26:56 I’m always wondering if I could surf as good as you, I would be so freaking happy. I’m
0:27:03 like a beginner, maybe advanced beginner, and I’m so happy surfing and you’re a much
0:27:07 better surfer. Why are you angry? What are you angry about? I don’t understand those
0:27:14 people, Jer. We have a wave here in the river. I don’t know if you’ve ever heard of a river
0:27:23 wave, but I saw one in Munich. Yeah, that one, which that one has because it’s been
0:27:31 surfed for so long, they have some heavy localism issues there. But we have a wave here in our
0:27:37 little town in Ben, Oregon, that when we go surfing in the summer, you know, I wondered
0:27:43 why everybody was having such a good time, not everyone was having good time, but everybody
0:27:49 was happy. And there was no tension. And I was going, why is that it’s not like that
0:27:58 in the ocean? And I realized, wow, it’s because everybody knows whose turn it is, because
0:28:04 you wait in line until it’s your turn. And in the ocean, you get so many guys that think,
0:28:12 oh, not enough waves for me. That’s why it was like me when I was young, take waves instead
0:28:23 of share. And that’s a real interesting part of surfing. Eventually you learn, but sometimes
0:28:28 it takes a long time. I always think that you get plenty lessons in surfing. I was surfing
0:28:36 like 20, 25 years before it was like, that was just a test to see if I was really interested.
0:28:42 And then when surfing realized I was interested, then I started to understand that there’s
0:28:48 all this great stuff to learn and many very interesting parables about life. And while
0:28:56 the waves of life may seem indeed more challenging to ride than the waves of the ocean, when
0:29:02 we apply the lessons learned in the surf, we sometimes can find in a metaphorical sense
0:29:09 the easier paddle out, hooking into that rip current that lets us slide out smoothly through
0:29:14 the closed out sets of day to day life, and maybe even get to the outside lineup with
0:29:21 our hair still dry. That’s a metaphor for life. Yes. Yes. And that’s, that’s one of
0:29:27 the big lessons of surfing that you learn from the beginning, but you don’t really
0:29:33 understand what you’re learning. And it takes a while to see that, oh, maybe the whole
0:29:40 Hawaiians were really onto something, yoga and surfing go back maybe thousands of years.
0:29:46 We don’t know yoga we do. They had Pantajali. He wrote the yoga sutras, but we didn’t have
0:29:53 somebody like that in Hawaii that was recording what the ancient Hawaiian surfers were all
0:30:01 about. And it just may be that both those cultures are equally as ancient. I can tell
0:30:07 you as someone who’s been surfing nine years that surfing is one of the hardest sports
0:30:14 to learn. It is. And, and I think the hardest part of the hardest sport is how do you pick
0:30:19 a wave? How do you pick where you sit? I feel like when I’m out there trying to read the
0:30:25 waves, I’m blind and I’m trying to use Braille. I want from Jerry Lopez, what goes through
0:30:31 your mind? How do you pick a wave? First, you gotta see it coming. It’s all about paying
0:30:36 attention just like in life. And that’s why I used to make these funny rules. Hey, no
0:30:42 talking in a lineup because you get distracted. And then a lot of set comes and you get caught
0:30:48 inside and all surfers, no matter how long they’ve been surfing and how good they are,
0:30:54 you’re going to get caught inside. And that’s, there’s a great lesson to be learned from
0:30:59 that. But when you’re out in the lineup, you don’t want to get caught inside. You want
0:31:06 to be where the waves are. And that’s hard to do because no more sign posts out there,
0:31:14 no more place to mark the lineup. And it really all comes back to paying attention. And it’s
0:31:21 just repetition. You have to just like Sean Thompson said, you got to just go all the
0:31:28 time and each time you go, you don’t even realize it. But you are learning things. And eventually
0:31:34 it’s like you get little bites every day, little advances every day. And then one day
0:31:39 all of a sudden something happens for what reason you don’t know, but you get a big bite
0:31:46 on you. Wow. And that’s the light bulb moment where, oh, I really learned something today.
0:31:52 But then the next day you forget it. You got to relearn it again. And that’s the beauty
0:31:58 and the downside of surfing. That’s why it’s so hard. Up next on Remarkable People. I
0:32:05 think John was a great mentor to both of us. And not only do we have all of us have a whole
0:32:11 lot of fun making that movie, but he really got Arnold and I through that. And Arnold
0:32:17 went on to a brilliant film career. And I think that John Millius really had a lot to
0:32:30 do with that. If you find our show valuable, please do us a favor and subscribe, rate and
0:32:37 review it. Even better, forward it to a friend, a big mahalo to you for doing this. Welcome
0:32:47 back to Remarkable People with Guy Kawasaki. Two years ago I lost my hearing and now I
0:32:51 have a cochlear implant. So with the cochlear implant, obviously we’ve been having this
0:32:57 conversation, but you cannot use a cochlear implant in the water. And I got this cochlear
0:33:04 implant about a year ago. So basically when I’m in the water, I’m essentially deaf. And
0:33:10 then I read your rule about not talking in the lineup, pay attention. I think being deaf
0:33:15 has helped me become a better surfer because I cannot talk in the lineup because I cannot
0:33:23 hear. That’s my theory. In surfing, you’ve got to use all your senses. And like I said,
0:33:30 attention is the main thing that you have to constantly be on top of. But hearing comes
0:33:36 into effect when you’re surfing big waves because sometimes you see a set coming and
0:33:44 you think, “Wow, maybe to get one big one outside.” And then you hear it already breaking
0:33:49 and you know you’re in trouble. And you know if you don’t catch the first one that’s right
0:33:54 there, you’re going to be in bigger trouble. That’s the only time that you really need
0:34:01 your hearing in surfing. Well, Jerry, just to be transparent, a big way for me is four
0:34:07 feet. And so when the waves are bigger, the only thing I’m surfing is a couch. Okay,
0:34:14 just FYI. Yeah, but surfing is such a compelling sport. It’s going to suck you in just like
0:34:21 it sucks everyone else. And pretty soon, oh, five feet is good. And then pretty soon, wow,
0:34:27 I want to be out there when it’s six feet. Before you know it, you might be scheduling
0:34:32 a trip to Mavericks. My daughter surf said Mavericks and she has
0:34:37 caught a wave and she’s been towed in and all that. And I got to tell you, the thought
0:34:41 of that just scares the shit out of me so much. I won’t even go and watch her surf.
0:34:48 Could not handle watching her surf at Mavericks. It would be. Wow. That’s very impressive.
0:34:55 Okay, completely switching gears. How did you get the part of Sabotai in Conan the Bobrarian?
0:35:03 It’s not a left field. How did that happen? I worked on a movie called Big Wednesday that
0:35:14 John Milius co-wrote and directed. And we became friends. And later on, when he took
0:35:21 on the Conan project, he rewrote the script. Oliver Stone had written a script that John
0:35:28 wanted to improve on. And so he wrote the script and wrote in this part and sent the
0:35:34 script to me. And what do you think? He goes, I want you to play the part of Sabotai. And
0:35:42 I read the script and went, Oh my God, this is like a big part. I can’t act. He said,
0:35:52 don’t worry, you’ll be fine. And Arnold couldn’t act either. But I think John was a great mentor
0:35:56 to both of us. And not only do we have all of us have a whole lot of fun making that
0:36:07 movie, but he really got Arnold and I through that. And Arnold went on to a brilliant film
0:36:13 career. And I think that John Milius really had a lot to do with that.
0:36:17 Is Arnold a good guy? You know, it’s hard to tell from the outside who’s a good guy.
0:36:25 Who’s an asshole as an actor. He’s great. Arnold is awesome. They kept delaying the
0:36:33 start date on Conan. And we were doing some sword training with a Japanese instructor
0:36:43 from Anaheim, Yamazaki son. And so Arnold and I got to spend almost a year together
0:36:51 before we actually went to Spain and started to work on the movie. And I think he’s a
0:36:54 great guy. I thought he was a great governor too.
0:36:57 Yeah. Yeah, I’d vote for him for president.
0:37:06 I would too. I was going to say that. Okay. You’re 75, Jerry. Have you like transitioned
0:37:11 from shortboards to longboards or are you still a shortboard ripper?
0:37:17 I ride them all. I’ll ride anything I can. I like all the ways you can ride a wave. I
0:37:23 even like body surfing, but there’s all these new sports, kite surfing and wing surfing
0:37:31 and foil surfing. They’re all equally as compelling and challenging and attractive as surfing
0:37:37 is, but it always comes back to surfing. Yeah.
0:37:42 Just like you, you know, you hear about a good swell or some good wave somewhere and
0:37:46 you’re thinking, okay, what do I got to do to go surfing?
0:37:53 So Madison and I live in Santa Cruz and there’s a theory that you start in calls at your
0:38:01 end in calls. Okay. So would you say that’s true of Queens? You started Queens, you ended
0:38:06 Queens? I’ll tell you what, when standup surfing came, I really got into it, especially here
0:38:12 in Oregon where the water’s super cold and the waves are hard to catch. And it was because
0:38:19 of standup surfing that I rediscovered Waikiki, the joy and even much deeper than that. What
0:38:24 the ancient Hawaiians, they used to call that area in front, the Outrigger Reef Kawehe Wehe.
0:38:30 And that was where they went when they weren’t feeling good, when they were ill or sick or
0:38:38 or just not feeling right. They would go there and just go in the water and they felt that
0:38:44 would make them feel better. And so with the standup boards, we started touring Waikiki
0:38:50 area again, because you have all that mobility with the standup board. And we start out right
0:38:56 there, Kawehe Wehe, paddle out from in front, the Outrigger Reef there, go out to number
0:39:03 three’s or pops. And then we’d look up and let’s go cruise. Let’s go check out Publix.
0:39:10 And then from Publix. Publix. Hey, Publix. Yeah, you know, and then next thing you know,
0:39:20 we’re at Tongs. And then, wow, a long way from Waikiki. That whole area was really special
0:39:27 to me growing up. And I just was really wonderful to renew that specialness with Waikiki. And
0:39:35 I still encourage every surfer, no matter how good they think they are, go Waikiki.
0:39:44 Because that’s where it really all started. And just feel it. It’s interesting in Santa
0:39:52 Cruz anyway, many of the surfers look down on paddleboard, paddleboarding and paddle surfing.
0:40:01 And what I’ve noticed is that the really good surfers, like you, like Bob Pearson, to them,
0:40:06 it’s like surfing is surfing and paddleboarding is just as good as prone surfing. There’s
0:40:12 no pecking order and we shouldn’t let paddleboarders in here because what, they can catch the
0:40:19 wave further outside. It’s kind of the surfers that think they are better than they are that
0:40:25 have that attitude. I always been like that. Yeah. But like I said, there’s plenty of ways
0:40:30 to ride a wave. And might as well try them all. You might find one that you like better
0:40:37 than the other, you know, and they’re all great, but a surfboard is still the greatest.
0:40:44 It’s simple. It’s the most simple one. Yeah. And there’s a real beauty in that simplicity
0:40:51 that just you and you got to have wetsuit when you stay in the mainland, but just a surfboard
0:40:58 pair of shorts and Waikiki. That’s all you need. Yeah. Yeah. Are you still shaping boards?
0:41:07 I am. Yes. And can anybody order one? Yeah. With COVID, I took a break. COVID was weird.
0:41:14 I did really disrupted all of our lives. And it’s just coming on the other side of it.
0:41:20 What happened when COVID hit was that everybody wanted surfboards and the surfboard industry
0:41:27 went crazy. And it was, if you weren’t doing all the work yourself, it was really hard
0:41:33 to get, if you were just a customer, it was really hard to find surfboards. But if you
0:41:38 were a shaper like me, it was hard to get your surfboards glass because everything was
0:41:44 in big demand. That’s turned completely upside down now. And the surfboard industry is in
0:41:49 one of the biggest slumps it’s been in, in my lifetime. And I don’t know what’s going
0:41:57 to happen, but yeah, I still love shaping surfboards and building them. And I still
0:42:03 do it. Yeah. People can get boards from me. So, so I can order like a 11 foot glider from
0:42:08 you or is that beneath you to make a long board like that? That’s my secret weapon,
0:42:17 the glider. Okay. I’m ordering right now. I want an 11 foot glider from you. Okay. Just
0:42:23 tell me how much and where to send the money. I have two gliders that I make with surf deck
0:42:29 which is started as a Santa Cruz company that are really beautiful that I enjoy riding
0:42:35 very, very much. And those are easy because you don’t have to wait. If you order a board
0:42:42 from me, you got to wait till I get in the shaping room and then get them shaped. Even
0:42:51 me, even I have to wait. Even I got a week. Yeah. I haven’t made myself too many new
0:42:58 surfboards these days. Okay. I got to ask you this. What’s the deal with the Jerry Lopez
0:43:08 Wave Storm board? Oh, the Costco board. Yeah. Yeah. It was a way to have a cheap surfboard
0:43:14 that people that don’t want to spend a thousand dollars, $2,000 to get one of my surfboards
0:43:22 to try surfing. And there’s been, I got a lot of flack about that, but I always felt
0:43:29 that just like Duke, hey, Duke Hanamoku traveled the world to share the gift of surfing with
0:43:36 a lot of people. And when he went to Australia, that was in what 1915 or something that he
0:43:43 went down there and he saw, he was in Sydney for some swimming exhibition and he saw good
0:43:50 waves and he went, wow. And so he tracked down big piece of pine wood and made himself
0:43:56 a surfboard. And then when the surfboard was Paul, he went surfing and you know, all the
0:44:03 people were watching going, wow. And they still have that surfboard. Really? It’s in
0:44:09 the freshwater surf lifesaving club. And I looked at that board and went, oh, that’s
0:44:15 not that big a board because part of that story is that he wrote a couple of waves in
0:44:22 all the way to the beach. And then he came in and he asked some young girl, her name
0:44:29 was Isabelle Latham. And he asked her if she would like to accompany him out and ride
0:44:37 a wave in with him. And so she went, sure. And so he paddled out tandem with her. They
0:44:43 caught a wave and they both stood up and rode all the way to the beach. And that’s how surfing
0:44:52 started in Australia, which surfing is huge in Australia these days. But the Duke was,
0:44:58 that was what he did. He shared the gift of surfing with people. You know, now, like we
0:45:04 were talking about earlier, plenty serving. We don’t like anymore surfers get too many
0:45:11 already. But surfing is a beautiful thing that that should be shared. And the whole
0:45:15 deal with that Costco board was to make an affordable surfboard so that people could
0:45:24 try it and see what it is that people like you and I live for. Why we live for it.
0:45:30 I never thought that my name and your name would be in a sentence together about surfing.
0:45:39 So my life is complete now, Jerry. So my attitude on that Costco board is God bless
0:45:43 him. I hope he makes millions of dollars like that, right?
0:45:50 Well, you know what? It was your guys fault in Santa Cruz because the first year Costco,
0:45:56 when they’re looking at a new product like that, they do a test run and they put them
0:46:02 in certain stores. And it was the Costco you guys have in Santa Cruz that all of a sudden
0:46:08 the guys went, Oh, these things are selling like hotcakes. And then that’s when they put
0:46:13 in their order. Seriously. So it’s your guys fault.
0:46:19 Oh, when this episode comes out, there’s going to be protests in front of that Costco
0:46:29 board. And I won’t be able to get into by my hot dogs anymore, so Jerry, what do you
0:46:35 think about holding like WSL or even Olympic events in a wave pool? I mean, it seems to
0:46:41 me that so much of surfing is about figuring out where to sit, when to go, all that kind
0:46:46 of stuff. And some of those variables are not exactly there like in the ocean. So do you
0:46:52 think that’s a bastardization of the sport or figure skating in the Olympics? The ice
0:46:59 is perfect. Every rink is kind of the same. And so you compete not on the conditions and
0:47:06 reading the ice. So which way do you fall on wave pools and competitive surfing? I think
0:47:14 the wave pools are an absolute definite part of the future of surfing that you know what
0:47:20 it’s like in most lineups, especially the good lineups, that it’s busy. It’s crowded
0:47:27 and there’s tension. And the thing we talked about earlier about how you go to a wave pool,
0:47:33 everybody knows who’s turn it is. Right. And everybody has a good time. So that’s the experience
0:47:41 of surfing that I’m sure that Duke Hanamuka was trying to promote all over the world.
0:47:48 I just don’t think that he had any idea that surfing was going to grow as large and certainly
0:47:59 not as fast as it did and become how it is now, which is crowded, not enough way for everybody
0:48:06 or me. Whereas in a wave pool, everybody takes turns. And the level of surfing, the
0:48:14 few events that they’ve had at the surf ranch is incredible. And I don’t think there’s any
0:48:22 one of those surfers that would say this is not a good place to have a surf contest.
0:48:30 And the karma factor is taken out of the equation. It’s not like a lot of times in surf
0:48:36 contest, sometimes the last good wave doesn’t come for the guy that all he needs is one
0:48:45 more ride. But in the wave pool, it levels the playing field a little more. So everybody
0:48:50 gets good chance. And obviously, that’s not going to be the only place they have surfing
0:48:56 competitions. But I think it’s if they have good waves. Have you been to the surf ranch
0:49:03 yet? No, I’ve been invited many times. But I’m afraid to go because if I go in, I fall
0:49:12 in love. I just be going all the time. And I don’t need any more distractions in my life.
0:49:18 It’s just like I said, like all the different ways to ride a wave. This is just another
0:49:24 one of them. And when you get there and you see that, holy cow, they’re creating this
0:49:33 wave in a pool, you can’t believe it. You really can’t believe it that such an unbelievable
0:49:42 wave can happen in a big swimming pool. Okay, two more questions. All right. So I got Lopez
0:49:50 rules. The first four are surf to surf tomorrow. Pace yourself. Don’t talk in the lineup.
0:49:58 And the fifth one is best surfer is the one who’s having the most fun. So now with hindsight,
0:50:04 you got any more rules or different interpretation of the rules? Has anything changed about the
0:50:12 Lopez rules? No, I mean, those rules I feel are still valid. But the bottom line of all
0:50:22 of it is keep paddling and not only in a literal sense, because otherwise the next time you
0:50:28 go surfing, you’re going to be all out of shape, but certainly in a metaphorical sense.
0:50:36 Okay, great. I got to tell you a little story. So I go to make this speech for Bob Reef, right?
0:50:42 And at the end of the speech, he presents me with a Jerry Lopez lightning bolt board.
0:50:48 This a gift for making that speech. So this is the most valuable board I have, right? Jerry
0:50:55 Lopez is even signed to me. So during the pandemic, I used to do a lot of virtual talks
0:51:02 and all over the world. So sometimes I’m talking at three, four, five, six a.m. So one day after
0:51:09 I got your board, I decided in my talk, I was going to put it behind me so that I can
0:51:14 show you how cool I am. I surf. I don’t know if I’m a surfer. But anyway, there’s a freaking
0:51:20 Jerry Lopez board behind me as I give this speech. And this is like five a.m. Okay, I
0:51:26 figure. And I lean it against the door because that just happened with the camera. That was
0:51:31 the best place to open the door and the board fell down. Six a.m. I figure what could go
0:51:37 wrong. I don’t know why because my son has never gotten up at six a.m. in the morning
0:51:45 in his life. He opens the door, board fell down, and there’s two dings in it. And this
0:51:50 board has never been waxed, never been used, but it’s got two dings. It’s hanging on my
0:51:58 wall. And ever since that day, I’ve been wondering, what should I do? Should I just put two decals
0:52:06 on it and cover it? Should I ask some local board guy to fix it? Should I ask Bob if I
0:52:12 can send it back to Jerry to fix it? Should I ask Bob if I can send it back to Jerry and
0:52:20 Jerry just circles it in signs? It’s okay, guy. No problem. Leave the ding. So I’ve been
0:52:27 thinking about this for years. Seriously. So now I’m talking to the Jerry Lopez who made
0:52:32 that board. Leave them. No, it is a great story. So maybe I should leave the things.
0:52:39 Little trophies. What do you advise me to do about the two things in my Jerry Lopez board?
0:52:46 What about these? And then you can tell him the story. And then when your son comes, look
0:52:52 at those things. Oh, boy, gonna shake his head. But you know what we should do, guy? We gotta
0:53:01 tell Bob, hey, we got to get guy the 10 six glider. So when he goes out at Cowles, he can
0:53:08 sit outside by the guys with the stand up boards and he can catch all the waves he like. Never
0:53:18 miss one. Yeah. Yeah. Just tell me how much you want the money. Start today. Call up us
0:53:27 phone order the blank. I would do that in a second Jerry. Although another funny story
0:53:33 is I gave a speech for a company in Santa Barbara. And as a gift, they gave me this
0:53:40 yater spoon. And this is a triple stringer yater spoon. Beautiful board. It’s got wood
0:53:47 tail, wood nose, the block. It’s just beautiful. So I bring it home to Santa Cruz. And the
0:53:52 guys I surf with and my family, they tell me, you’re not going to surf that board that
0:53:58 board is too beautiful. Just put it on the wall. So that board has never been ridden.
0:54:05 And then I decided that when I die, and there’s a paddle out for me, hopefully, I’m going
0:54:14 to have my ashes paddle on that yater. Because finally I get to ride the yater. But when
0:54:19 you make me this glider press up, brother, I may save this moment and be paddled out
0:54:29 on the Jerry Lopez glider for my last trip at calls. Thank you guy. Pressures on Jerry.
0:54:36 I hope you enjoyed this episode with Mr. Pipeline Jerry Lopez. Now you know why I need to take
0:54:43 up yoga. You know the origin of the Jerry Lopez Costco board, which drives local surfers
0:54:51 in Santa Cruz absolutely crazy. And you know why I will not fix the ding in my Jerry Lopez
0:54:57 board. I have to tell you one more story about this episode. Madison and I were so excited
0:55:03 to interview Jerry Lopez that we forgot to press the record button for the first 30
0:55:09 minutes. Luckily, we have backup systems. But I will say when we told Jerry what happened,
0:55:15 he was totally cool about it and willing to start all over. That’s the kind of guy that
0:55:22 Jerry Lopez is. I want to thank the people that made this episode possible. First and
0:55:30 foremost is Bob Reef. Without Bob Reef and what a great last name for a surfing enthusiast.
0:55:36 Without Bob Reef, this episode would not have happened. And then there’s the remarkable
0:55:44 people team. Shannon Hernandez and Jeff C. on sound design. Tessa Nizmer, researcher.
0:55:50 And there’s Louise Magana, Alexis Nishimura and Fallon Nyapes. Finally, there’s Madison
0:55:57 Nizmer. She’s the producer of this podcast and co-author of the book, “Think Remarkable”.
0:56:02 The point of this book is to help you make a difference and be remarkable. If this interests
0:56:10 you, you have to read this book. Let’s just say that on this day, March 17th, 2024, there
0:56:19 are 31 reviews of “Think Remarkable” on Amazon. They are all 5 stars. What can I say?
0:56:24 We are the remarkable people team. We’re on a mission to help you make a difference and
0:56:36 be remarkable. Until next time, mahalo and aloha.
0:00:22 Jerry Lopez. He’s known as Mr. Pipeline. He was born in Honolulu, Hawaii and his early
0:00:28 surfing career started at the Alamoana Balls. This paved his way for a spectacular surfing
0:00:35 career. He won the title of Hawaii State Champion at just 14. His evolution continued
0:00:41 at Oahu’s North Shore, where he mastered the Banzai Pipeline. He scored victories at
0:00:50 the Pipeline Masters in 1972 and 1973. His influence extends beyond riding waves to also
0:00:55 surfboard manufacturing. He co-founded the Lightning Bolt Surfboard Company, where he
0:01:02 pioneered high-performance shortboards. He’s also somewhat of a movie star. He had great
0:01:07 roles in North Shore and Conan the Barbarian. He’s the source of one of my favorite movie
0:01:14 lines of all time. He’s so Howley, he doesn’t even know he’s Howley. I’ll explain that
0:01:21 to you. Howley is a somewhat negative term used in Hawaii for white people. So when this
0:01:27 mainland Howley came to Hawaii and started surfing on the North Shore, he had to break
0:01:33 into a group of locals. And let’s just say that locals are not always initially welcoming
0:01:40 to strangers. Basically, Jerry is saying that the mainland Howley is so dumb, he doesn’t
0:01:48 even know he’s dumb. What can I say? You had to be there. Jerry is truly a legend. He exemplifies
0:01:54 passion, innovation, and inspiration. You’ll also find out in this episode about the relationship
0:02:00 of yoga and surfing, as well as whether I should fix a board that he made for me that
0:02:08 was damaged in a very funny incident. I’m Guy Kawasaki. This is Remarkable People. Join
0:02:14 me in celebrating the remarkable life of Mr. Pipeline, Jerry Lopez.
0:02:21 Quote, he’s so Howley, he doesn’t even know he’s Howley. That’s you in North Shore, right?
0:02:26 Yeah, that was a fun project we did. That was a while ago. I was in the early 80s. When
0:02:32 I read the script, I thought, wow, this is a pretty good script. This is believable.
0:02:41 And today, now with the whole wave pool thing, it’s really becoming like a very real possibility
0:02:47 that there may be some very near future world champion that learns how to surf in a wave
0:02:54 pool. And who came up with that line? Because whoever came up with the line truly understood
0:03:00 Howley. When I read the script, obviously, there was a lot of whoever, the guys that
0:03:05 wrote the script were a little bit Howley, but they wanted to use pigeon in a lot of
0:03:11 the things that I was saying and the who we guys were saying. But their pigeon wasn’t
0:03:20 very authentic. I ended up actually becoming one of the technical advisors. You mean putting
0:03:27 most of the pigeon lines in that movie. So you’re a linguist as well as a surfer, just
0:03:32 like you. We grew up with pigeon. Probably your parents were just like mine. They wouldn’t
0:03:39 let us talk pigeon in the house. But when we were with all our friends, it’s funny because
0:03:46 I’m 69 years old and I went to college in the mainland and I have been trying to lose
0:03:53 my pigeon for 40, 50 years. But people still come up to me and say, I heard you just talk.
0:03:59 Are you from Hawaii? And I’m like, what the hell? What’s giving this away? And then a
0:04:04 few months ago, I interviewed this linguist on this show and she said you should stop
0:04:11 being ashamed of your accent. It’s part of you. Don’t try to clean it up. Just be you.
0:04:18 It’s always there. And when us locals hear each other speak, even if we don’t know each
0:04:27 other, just look at them and go, so I’m local. So has anybody ever pointed out the irony
0:04:35 that someone from Punahou was playing a North Shore Moke? I mean, there is some irony there,
0:04:46 right, Jerry? I guess there is, right? Okay, let’s take us back to your first wave at Queens.
0:04:51 What was the feeling? That’s a feeling that never leaves. I don’t think any surfer. They
0:04:58 always remember that first wave. And what they remember is that gliding, just that the waves
0:05:04 doing all the work and you’re just gliding along like riding down a hill on a bicycle
0:05:15 with no hands, just sailing along. And I think it just touches everyone somewhere deep inside.
0:05:22 And that’s the reason, you know, surfing is like it is. And surfers are like they are
0:05:30 that all they want to do is go surf and recapture that feeling again. But it’s always the first
0:05:37 one that makes the biggest impression. Yeah, I started surfing at 60. And if I had surfed
0:05:43 as a kid, I would not be where I am today. There’s no way. I’d be making coffee at Alamona
0:05:50 Center for somebody right now. I know surfing doesn’t take some of your time, it takes all
0:05:57 of it. Yeah, I take a break from surfing to work now. There’s a story in your book about
0:06:04 how you got arrested on Kauai for trespassing on the Robinson land. And I want to know what
0:06:12 you took away from that experience though. You didn’t serve any time, you got exonerated.
0:06:19 But what’s the lesson there? You better know the rules before you play the game. Yeah,
0:06:27 you know, we were just tired and lazy from surfing all day. And we knew better. But right
0:06:32 at the end, right before you get to the Waimea River, there was a little road that you didn’t
0:06:39 have to walk over all the rocks on the beach. And we just weren’t thinking and we jumped
0:06:46 on that road. And we knew that was a private road, even though it was right next to the
0:06:55 beach. And then they were waiting for us busted. But it’s not like I’m a big localism kind
0:07:03 of guy. But you could make the case that this is Hawaii and you guys are howley rich plantation
0:07:09 owners. What is the big deal about letting surfers walk on your road? Well, obviously
0:07:16 the judge felt that too, because in the end, he said there was no intention to trespass.
0:07:23 And he let us go. We couldn’t believe it. We didn’t know what was going to happen. But
0:07:33 we didn’t think we were going to, you know, get away with that off to Oahu prison we go.
0:07:41 I have a question from left field, which is maybe you can explain to me. Why is the skill
0:07:48 100 held in such high regard? It’s almost like mystical. The people who have a skill
0:07:55 100, it’s like this magic thing that you cannot get. And what’s so magical about that tool?
0:08:03 It was just the ideal tool for shaping foam, because we’ve tried to recreate it. I worked
0:08:10 with Gordon Clark at Clark foam and Jeff Holtby when they tried to take a Hitachi and make
0:08:17 it work like a skill. And it was just, it was the angle of the handle. And it was the
0:08:26 way the adjuster for the depth of cut worked that it was just perfect for shaping foam
0:08:32 into a surfboard. And today they’re really hard to find. How hard could it be for skill
0:08:43 to re reintroduce that? I don’t think there’s that big of a demand for them. Okay, fair enough.
0:08:50 A lot of the information about you goes really deep into yoga. So can you explain for us
0:08:57 the connection of yoga and surfing? When I was, I think it was my sophomore year, I
0:09:02 saw a bunch of good looking Wahinis looking at a bulletin board. So, you know, I like
0:09:08 to think I just went walk up there and hey, how’s it? What’s happening? But most likely
0:09:13 I was very meekly peeked over their shoulders to see what they were interested in. And there
0:09:19 was a yoga class announcement there on the board when they looked at me and put me on
0:09:27 the spot. Are you going? And of course. And I’m sure I went to that class hoping to see
0:09:35 those girls again. But what I found was something that really made a big impression on me ever
0:09:42 since then. I mean, I thought that watching that yoga instructor, this was in 1968, too.
0:09:52 There weren’t many yoga opportunities like this available. And watching that gal just
0:09:57 watching her move, I thought yoga is going to make me a better surfer. I better learn
0:10:04 how to do this. And I stuck with it. You know, I found that over the years that like surfing,
0:10:11 yoga only comes into a person’s life when I guess it’s supposed to. It has to be the
0:10:18 right time. And I’ve tried to introduce so many friends to it, but it wasn’t the right
0:10:26 time for them. So they weren’t that interested. But when it is, it will happen. And is it
0:10:32 the effect of stretching and strengthening or is it a mental thing that links yoga and
0:10:39 surfing? This is like the one hand clapping question for me and something I’ve thought
0:10:48 about over all these years, which for me, it’s been like over 50 years for yoga and long
0:10:55 time for surfing. Obviously, the physical part is really important. But the idea in
0:11:05 yoga is that there’s this whole universe of experience that occurs in this unseen realm
0:11:13 of existence that is constantly every moment of our lives influencing us. And the yogis
0:11:20 call it prana, the Hawaiians call it mana, which is another interesting thing that why
0:11:27 these two cultures on opposite sides of the world world would have almost the same word
0:11:33 for the exact same thing. What they’re talking about is the life force that animates all
0:11:41 life. And I believe that in order to surf successfully, which you have discovered later
0:11:47 in life, which is probably a better time to find that because you probably have thought
0:11:57 about it a lot. But in order to ride away successfully, you have to be in that meditative,
0:12:04 deep meditative state of mind. And if you aren’t, wipe out. And the beauty of surfing
0:12:12 is that you attain that state of mind almost instantaneously the moment that you start
0:12:18 paddling for that wave and especially the moment when you stand up on that surfboard.
0:12:26 To get to that same state of mind in a yoga practice requires a lot more time and some
0:12:35 pretty deep concentration. In a way in surfing, we get to cheat. We get to that state almost
0:12:43 more easily than anyone else except maybe Yogananda who lived in that state. But that’s
0:12:50 something that’s been really intriguing to me for a long time. And I’m really thinking
0:12:56 more and more about that. I’m actually working on another book right now, dealing exactly
0:13:10 that.
0:13:15 We will help you promote that book when it comes out. I don’t suppose it’s as simple
0:13:23 as I asked Jerry Lopez, tell me the three or four yoga poses that will improve my surfing.
0:13:26 And I just do that. It’s not that easy, I think, right?
0:13:36 One of the real lessons in yoga is not in perfecting the pose, but it’s embracing the
0:13:45 process. That way it doesn’t become a dead end of unfulfilled perfection, but an ongoing
0:13:52 evolution of the whole process. And it’s just yoga. It’s something that everybody’s
0:14:01 different level of experience, just development. And you just hug the process and be happy
0:14:04 with where it takes you.
0:14:11 I’m friend with Sean Thompson. And Sean once told me, guy, professional surfing, there
0:14:18 is no training like there is for football and basketball, football and basketball offseason,
0:14:24 you’re hitting the weights, you’re doing all this kind of stuff. But surfers, they just
0:14:30 go out and surf. And now you have yoga. And every once in a while, of course, when you
0:14:35 see a movie or documentary about surfing, there’s the scene where they’re holding a
0:14:40 rock and they’re running underwater. But is that true? Like, why don’t surfers go and
0:14:46 really lift weights and do all that kind of stuff and train? Or am I just mistaken about
0:14:47 that?
0:14:56 No, the top guys all train now. I mean, they spend a lot of time in the gym. And the fitness
0:15:03 level has to be so high, especially for the guys that are surfing the big waves, but even
0:15:10 for the guys that are on the tour that are surfing smaller waves, they have to be top
0:15:20 condition at the highest level of athleticism to do what they do. And injury is so close
0:15:26 with especially the maneuvers and stuff that they do these days, they fly in the air and
0:15:34 easy to get hurt. And when you’re injured, just like football or baseball, if you can’t
0:15:37 come back and play, you’re out.
0:15:38 Tell Sean he’s wrong.
0:15:47 No, I mean, he’s not wrong at all. But that’s true because there’s really nothing except
0:15:52 paddling a surfboard that gets you in shape for paddling a surfboard. It was really interesting
0:15:59 when I moved up here to Oregon, my son met these kids in school and we became friends
0:16:05 with the parents. And I introduced them to surfing out on the Oregon coast here. And
0:16:12 I was telling them the hardest part is paddling. And these kids took to surfing like I couldn’t
0:16:19 believe I’d never seen anybody do that, even top athletes. And I went, wow, what’s the deal?
0:16:24 How come they can paddle surfboards? I go, were you guys swim team guys? And they go,
0:16:32 oh, we swam a little. Later on, I found out they were Nordic skiers. And Nordic skiing
0:16:39 requires the same arm movements that paddling a surfboard does. And it was really interesting
0:16:46 to me that, wow, there’s some cross training for surfing that no one ever thought of. But
0:16:52 that’s the hard part. Surfing is 90% paddling. When, when you don’t do it, you lose it.
0:17:00 So you gotta keep doing it. So no, Sean is absolutely correct. All you can do is just
0:17:05 go surfing as much as you can. I reached out to Sean and I said, Sean, I’m interviewing
0:17:14 Jerry Lopez tomorrow. What should I ask him? And Sean, Sean says, ask him what kind of
0:17:21 cake he was eating when he said pipeline is a cake walk.
0:17:26 The pipeline was really a big part of my life. And Sean says, well, when he came over from
0:17:35 South Africa, he really liked that wave too. And he was very skilled already. And he adapted
0:17:42 to it much quicker than many, many guys that lived in Hawaii. But when you surf a spot
0:17:48 enough, you get familiar with it. Eventually, if that’s what you’re trying to do, you develop
0:17:56 a relationship with it, a personal relationship. And I really always thought that my relationship
0:18:03 with the pipeline was pretty deep and pretty special. And I got away with a lot of stuff
0:18:11 that a lot of other guys didn’t get away with. And eventually at the pipeline, everybody
0:18:18 gets hurt. It’s not if it’s when, and the more you push it, eventually that’s going
0:18:25 to happen. And I had to pay to play out there. And I did willingly because I really enjoyed
0:18:32 that spot, just like Sean and all those guys, they did too. And they came at a time when
0:18:40 the pipeline was just becoming a popular spot because back in the late sixties and the very
0:18:45 early seventies, the place to surf on the North Shore was Sunset Beach. That was the
0:18:53 challenging spot and nobody came to the pipeline. It had a reputation. It had hurt a lot of
0:19:00 people and had already killed one really good surfer from Peru. And so it had a specter
0:19:08 about it, a reputation. And everybody went to sunset. That’s why I think I had a little
0:19:14 bit of an advantage at the pipeline was because nobody was there. And I got to learn about
0:19:21 that place without the big crowds. And then the attention started changing because not
0:19:27 only was it really easy to photograph, but when the waves were good there, it looked
0:19:32 really spectacular on film. And they had my picture in a couple surf movies before that
0:19:37 in the beginning days, when they started surfing, the pipeline was in the surf movies,
0:19:45 but it was always the wipeout section. And that was really mostly because the equipment,
0:19:51 the surfboards weren’t really suited to that wave. And it was our generation when the early
0:19:58 seventies there, when the shortboards started coming that we were able to develop equipment
0:20:05 that worked there. And that gave us some success surfing the wave. And then they showed it
0:20:10 in the movies. And then the next thing, you know, all the attention now is all on the
0:20:16 pipeline and nobody even remembers sunset beach.
0:20:22 In a sense, isn’t this Jeff Clark has Maverick’s to himself for 15 years. And now when you
0:20:29 go out to Maverick, there’s like 40 people out there or more or more. Yeah. Surfing was
0:20:38 a small sport. And because it is so attractive and appealing, it’s grown so rapidly. None
0:20:46 of us ever believed it was going to get as big as it has. And Sean had, and his group
0:20:52 where they first guys, when they came around, they go, we’re going to get paid to go surfing.
0:20:58 These guys in Hawaii, me and Barry Kanaiapuni, Tiger Espar, Eddie, I come, we looked at them,
0:21:04 we laugh up. Hey, who’s going to pay you to go surfing? Nobody going to pay you. They
0:21:14 were right. And they had some vision in regards to that surfing was going to grow and the
0:21:19 industry was going to get on a footing where like it is today, where they pay these top
0:21:24 surfers a nice salary to go surfing. Jerry, a lot of people listening to this, they may
0:21:30 not know, what the hell is he talking about pipeline? And obviously it’s a break and it’s
0:21:36 a place people surf, but at a higher, more metaphysical level, can you explain what pipeline
0:21:45 represents to surfing? What it’s become in my lifetime is maybe one of the higher or
0:21:54 if not highest level of surfing for any surfer to test himself to test how much of a surfer
0:22:02 he wants to be, it’s become one of the ultimate waves. Yeah, the pipeline, like I said, started
0:22:13 out as not a real popular spot. And suddenly the focus completely changed. And now it is
0:22:20 considered one of the ultimate surfing spots in the world today. And just in my lifetime,
0:22:26 surfing went from a very small obscure sport that none of our parents wanted us to become
0:22:32 surfers. They wanted us to do something useful with our lives. And we just, we couldn’t help
0:22:39 ourselves. And here I am 75 years old. And I still, that’s all I want to do is go surfing
0:22:47 as much as I can. And I don’t know. I don’t feel bad about that. I actually feel good
0:22:54 about it. For any surfers out there listening, what’s the gist of how you successfully surf
0:23:01 pipeline? Not that I’m going to do this, just give us kind of the insights on how you conquered
0:23:09 or maybe not conquer, but how you sink with that wave. In the beginning, it looked so
0:23:16 fast and so hollow. And this was the reason that the old longboards had such difficulty
0:23:24 there because the surfers were equally as skilled as any of the surfers are today. But
0:23:30 their equipment was holding them back. As the boards improved, then the guys started having
0:23:38 a lot more success. And the surfboards have continued to improve. And today, these guys
0:23:45 are at, like I said, such a high level of athleticism that they’re able to ride surfboards
0:23:52 that in my time, I would think, well, it’s way too small a surfboard. But they are such
0:23:59 good surfers now that they’re able to do that on this wave, wave that hasn’t changed. It’s
0:24:05 still very fast. Their quick draw has gotten a lot quicker these days. There seems to be
0:24:11 better shots. When you see Garrett McNamara surf a hundred foot wave in Nazaree or people
0:24:17 at Mavericks, do you say that’s not really surfing or that’s the ultimate in surfing?
0:24:23 What’s the difference between someone surfing Nazaree and someone surfing pipeline? It’s
0:24:33 all surfing. And all of it is impressive. On the top guys are just unbelievably impressive.
0:24:39 And even the guys, I don’t think I’d paddle out at Nazaree. In fact, I know I would and
0:24:46 especially nowadays, someone like Garrett who pretty much pioneered the place. So he got
0:24:54 an email from two Portuguese surfers that said, Hey, can you come over here and look
0:25:01 at our wave and tell us what you think? Because we think it’s really a good wave. And you
0:25:08 know, at first, he, I don’t know. And then finally he went and he looked and he went,
0:25:16 holy cow. And so he was really the guy to pioneer that place and show the rest of the
0:25:26 world how big a wave can be surfed. And that’s something else. And you know, in Europe, Garrett
0:25:35 McNamara is like a legend because the Europeans, they take their sports heroes really seriously.
0:25:41 I mean, even more than us guys over here, especially the people in Hawaii, but Garrett’s
0:25:46 a big deal for what he does, you know, and he made surfing, which was already becoming
0:25:56 big in Europe, much bigger. I watched the Patagonia documentary about you. And you more or less
0:26:03 freely admit that you got better. And one of the methods was stealing a lot of waves.
0:26:07 What’s your current thinking on surf etiquette these days? Is it like every man for himself
0:26:17 or have you gotten mellower in your old age? No, you got to surf with Aloha. But Duke tried
0:26:25 to tell us all us guys that in the beginning, you know, and we was young and stupid. And
0:26:32 of course surfing was, like I said, such a much smaller sport then, but today it’s busy
0:26:39 and you can’t get away with being a jerk anymore. Yeah, it’s all about learning how
0:26:44 to not only live with Aloha, but especially to go when you go surfing to surf with Aloha
0:26:51 too. I surf with a few people who don’t have Aloha and they’re pretty good surfers. And
0:26:56 I’m always wondering if I could surf as good as you, I would be so freaking happy. I’m
0:27:03 like a beginner, maybe advanced beginner, and I’m so happy surfing and you’re a much
0:27:07 better surfer. Why are you angry? What are you angry about? I don’t understand those
0:27:14 people, Jer. We have a wave here in the river. I don’t know if you’ve ever heard of a river
0:27:23 wave, but I saw one in Munich. Yeah, that one, which that one has because it’s been
0:27:31 surfed for so long, they have some heavy localism issues there. But we have a wave here in our
0:27:37 little town in Ben, Oregon, that when we go surfing in the summer, you know, I wondered
0:27:43 why everybody was having such a good time, not everyone was having good time, but everybody
0:27:49 was happy. And there was no tension. And I was going, why is that it’s not like that
0:27:58 in the ocean? And I realized, wow, it’s because everybody knows whose turn it is, because
0:28:04 you wait in line until it’s your turn. And in the ocean, you get so many guys that think,
0:28:12 oh, not enough waves for me. That’s why it was like me when I was young, take waves instead
0:28:23 of share. And that’s a real interesting part of surfing. Eventually you learn, but sometimes
0:28:28 it takes a long time. I always think that you get plenty lessons in surfing. I was surfing
0:28:36 like 20, 25 years before it was like, that was just a test to see if I was really interested.
0:28:42 And then when surfing realized I was interested, then I started to understand that there’s
0:28:48 all this great stuff to learn and many very interesting parables about life. And while
0:28:56 the waves of life may seem indeed more challenging to ride than the waves of the ocean, when
0:29:02 we apply the lessons learned in the surf, we sometimes can find in a metaphorical sense
0:29:09 the easier paddle out, hooking into that rip current that lets us slide out smoothly through
0:29:14 the closed out sets of day to day life, and maybe even get to the outside lineup with
0:29:21 our hair still dry. That’s a metaphor for life. Yes. Yes. And that’s, that’s one of
0:29:27 the big lessons of surfing that you learn from the beginning, but you don’t really
0:29:33 understand what you’re learning. And it takes a while to see that, oh, maybe the whole
0:29:40 Hawaiians were really onto something, yoga and surfing go back maybe thousands of years.
0:29:46 We don’t know yoga we do. They had Pantajali. He wrote the yoga sutras, but we didn’t have
0:29:53 somebody like that in Hawaii that was recording what the ancient Hawaiian surfers were all
0:30:01 about. And it just may be that both those cultures are equally as ancient. I can tell
0:30:07 you as someone who’s been surfing nine years that surfing is one of the hardest sports
0:30:14 to learn. It is. And, and I think the hardest part of the hardest sport is how do you pick
0:30:19 a wave? How do you pick where you sit? I feel like when I’m out there trying to read the
0:30:25 waves, I’m blind and I’m trying to use Braille. I want from Jerry Lopez, what goes through
0:30:31 your mind? How do you pick a wave? First, you gotta see it coming. It’s all about paying
0:30:36 attention just like in life. And that’s why I used to make these funny rules. Hey, no
0:30:42 talking in a lineup because you get distracted. And then a lot of set comes and you get caught
0:30:48 inside and all surfers, no matter how long they’ve been surfing and how good they are,
0:30:54 you’re going to get caught inside. And that’s, there’s a great lesson to be learned from
0:30:59 that. But when you’re out in the lineup, you don’t want to get caught inside. You want
0:31:06 to be where the waves are. And that’s hard to do because no more sign posts out there,
0:31:14 no more place to mark the lineup. And it really all comes back to paying attention. And it’s
0:31:21 just repetition. You have to just like Sean Thompson said, you got to just go all the
0:31:28 time and each time you go, you don’t even realize it. But you are learning things. And eventually
0:31:34 it’s like you get little bites every day, little advances every day. And then one day
0:31:39 all of a sudden something happens for what reason you don’t know, but you get a big bite
0:31:46 on you. Wow. And that’s the light bulb moment where, oh, I really learned something today.
0:31:52 But then the next day you forget it. You got to relearn it again. And that’s the beauty
0:31:58 and the downside of surfing. That’s why it’s so hard. Up next on Remarkable People. I
0:32:05 think John was a great mentor to both of us. And not only do we have all of us have a whole
0:32:11 lot of fun making that movie, but he really got Arnold and I through that. And Arnold
0:32:17 went on to a brilliant film career. And I think that John Millius really had a lot to
0:32:30 do with that. If you find our show valuable, please do us a favor and subscribe, rate and
0:32:37 review it. Even better, forward it to a friend, a big mahalo to you for doing this. Welcome
0:32:47 back to Remarkable People with Guy Kawasaki. Two years ago I lost my hearing and now I
0:32:51 have a cochlear implant. So with the cochlear implant, obviously we’ve been having this
0:32:57 conversation, but you cannot use a cochlear implant in the water. And I got this cochlear
0:33:04 implant about a year ago. So basically when I’m in the water, I’m essentially deaf. And
0:33:10 then I read your rule about not talking in the lineup, pay attention. I think being deaf
0:33:15 has helped me become a better surfer because I cannot talk in the lineup because I cannot
0:33:23 hear. That’s my theory. In surfing, you’ve got to use all your senses. And like I said,
0:33:30 attention is the main thing that you have to constantly be on top of. But hearing comes
0:33:36 into effect when you’re surfing big waves because sometimes you see a set coming and
0:33:44 you think, “Wow, maybe to get one big one outside.” And then you hear it already breaking
0:33:49 and you know you’re in trouble. And you know if you don’t catch the first one that’s right
0:33:54 there, you’re going to be in bigger trouble. That’s the only time that you really need
0:34:01 your hearing in surfing. Well, Jerry, just to be transparent, a big way for me is four
0:34:07 feet. And so when the waves are bigger, the only thing I’m surfing is a couch. Okay,
0:34:14 just FYI. Yeah, but surfing is such a compelling sport. It’s going to suck you in just like
0:34:21 it sucks everyone else. And pretty soon, oh, five feet is good. And then pretty soon, wow,
0:34:27 I want to be out there when it’s six feet. Before you know it, you might be scheduling
0:34:32 a trip to Mavericks. My daughter surf said Mavericks and she has
0:34:37 caught a wave and she’s been towed in and all that. And I got to tell you, the thought
0:34:41 of that just scares the shit out of me so much. I won’t even go and watch her surf.
0:34:48 Could not handle watching her surf at Mavericks. It would be. Wow. That’s very impressive.
0:34:55 Okay, completely switching gears. How did you get the part of Sabotai in Conan the Bobrarian?
0:35:03 It’s not a left field. How did that happen? I worked on a movie called Big Wednesday that
0:35:14 John Milius co-wrote and directed. And we became friends. And later on, when he took
0:35:21 on the Conan project, he rewrote the script. Oliver Stone had written a script that John
0:35:28 wanted to improve on. And so he wrote the script and wrote in this part and sent the
0:35:34 script to me. And what do you think? He goes, I want you to play the part of Sabotai. And
0:35:42 I read the script and went, Oh my God, this is like a big part. I can’t act. He said,
0:35:52 don’t worry, you’ll be fine. And Arnold couldn’t act either. But I think John was a great mentor
0:35:56 to both of us. And not only do we have all of us have a whole lot of fun making that
0:36:07 movie, but he really got Arnold and I through that. And Arnold went on to a brilliant film
0:36:13 career. And I think that John Milius really had a lot to do with that.
0:36:17 Is Arnold a good guy? You know, it’s hard to tell from the outside who’s a good guy.
0:36:25 Who’s an asshole as an actor. He’s great. Arnold is awesome. They kept delaying the
0:36:33 start date on Conan. And we were doing some sword training with a Japanese instructor
0:36:43 from Anaheim, Yamazaki son. And so Arnold and I got to spend almost a year together
0:36:51 before we actually went to Spain and started to work on the movie. And I think he’s a
0:36:54 great guy. I thought he was a great governor too.
0:36:57 Yeah. Yeah, I’d vote for him for president.
0:37:06 I would too. I was going to say that. Okay. You’re 75, Jerry. Have you like transitioned
0:37:11 from shortboards to longboards or are you still a shortboard ripper?
0:37:17 I ride them all. I’ll ride anything I can. I like all the ways you can ride a wave. I
0:37:23 even like body surfing, but there’s all these new sports, kite surfing and wing surfing
0:37:31 and foil surfing. They’re all equally as compelling and challenging and attractive as surfing
0:37:37 is, but it always comes back to surfing. Yeah.
0:37:42 Just like you, you know, you hear about a good swell or some good wave somewhere and
0:37:46 you’re thinking, okay, what do I got to do to go surfing?
0:37:53 So Madison and I live in Santa Cruz and there’s a theory that you start in calls at your
0:38:01 end in calls. Okay. So would you say that’s true of Queens? You started Queens, you ended
0:38:06 Queens? I’ll tell you what, when standup surfing came, I really got into it, especially here
0:38:12 in Oregon where the water’s super cold and the waves are hard to catch. And it was because
0:38:19 of standup surfing that I rediscovered Waikiki, the joy and even much deeper than that. What
0:38:24 the ancient Hawaiians, they used to call that area in front, the Outrigger Reef Kawehe Wehe.
0:38:30 And that was where they went when they weren’t feeling good, when they were ill or sick or
0:38:38 or just not feeling right. They would go there and just go in the water and they felt that
0:38:44 would make them feel better. And so with the standup boards, we started touring Waikiki
0:38:50 area again, because you have all that mobility with the standup board. And we start out right
0:38:56 there, Kawehe Wehe, paddle out from in front, the Outrigger Reef there, go out to number
0:39:03 three’s or pops. And then we’d look up and let’s go cruise. Let’s go check out Publix.
0:39:10 And then from Publix. Publix. Hey, Publix. Yeah, you know, and then next thing you know,
0:39:20 we’re at Tongs. And then, wow, a long way from Waikiki. That whole area was really special
0:39:27 to me growing up. And I just was really wonderful to renew that specialness with Waikiki. And
0:39:35 I still encourage every surfer, no matter how good they think they are, go Waikiki.
0:39:44 Because that’s where it really all started. And just feel it. It’s interesting in Santa
0:39:52 Cruz anyway, many of the surfers look down on paddleboard, paddleboarding and paddle surfing.
0:40:01 And what I’ve noticed is that the really good surfers, like you, like Bob Pearson, to them,
0:40:06 it’s like surfing is surfing and paddleboarding is just as good as prone surfing. There’s
0:40:12 no pecking order and we shouldn’t let paddleboarders in here because what, they can catch the
0:40:19 wave further outside. It’s kind of the surfers that think they are better than they are that
0:40:25 have that attitude. I always been like that. Yeah. But like I said, there’s plenty of ways
0:40:30 to ride a wave. And might as well try them all. You might find one that you like better
0:40:37 than the other, you know, and they’re all great, but a surfboard is still the greatest.
0:40:44 It’s simple. It’s the most simple one. Yeah. And there’s a real beauty in that simplicity
0:40:51 that just you and you got to have wetsuit when you stay in the mainland, but just a surfboard
0:40:58 pair of shorts and Waikiki. That’s all you need. Yeah. Yeah. Are you still shaping boards?
0:41:07 I am. Yes. And can anybody order one? Yeah. With COVID, I took a break. COVID was weird.
0:41:14 I did really disrupted all of our lives. And it’s just coming on the other side of it.
0:41:20 What happened when COVID hit was that everybody wanted surfboards and the surfboard industry
0:41:27 went crazy. And it was, if you weren’t doing all the work yourself, it was really hard
0:41:33 to get, if you were just a customer, it was really hard to find surfboards. But if you
0:41:38 were a shaper like me, it was hard to get your surfboards glass because everything was
0:41:44 in big demand. That’s turned completely upside down now. And the surfboard industry is in
0:41:49 one of the biggest slumps it’s been in, in my lifetime. And I don’t know what’s going
0:41:57 to happen, but yeah, I still love shaping surfboards and building them. And I still
0:42:03 do it. Yeah. People can get boards from me. So, so I can order like a 11 foot glider from
0:42:08 you or is that beneath you to make a long board like that? That’s my secret weapon,
0:42:17 the glider. Okay. I’m ordering right now. I want an 11 foot glider from you. Okay. Just
0:42:23 tell me how much and where to send the money. I have two gliders that I make with surf deck
0:42:29 which is started as a Santa Cruz company that are really beautiful that I enjoy riding
0:42:35 very, very much. And those are easy because you don’t have to wait. If you order a board
0:42:42 from me, you got to wait till I get in the shaping room and then get them shaped. Even
0:42:51 me, even I have to wait. Even I got a week. Yeah. I haven’t made myself too many new
0:42:58 surfboards these days. Okay. I got to ask you this. What’s the deal with the Jerry Lopez
0:43:08 Wave Storm board? Oh, the Costco board. Yeah. Yeah. It was a way to have a cheap surfboard
0:43:14 that people that don’t want to spend a thousand dollars, $2,000 to get one of my surfboards
0:43:22 to try surfing. And there’s been, I got a lot of flack about that, but I always felt
0:43:29 that just like Duke, hey, Duke Hanamoku traveled the world to share the gift of surfing with
0:43:36 a lot of people. And when he went to Australia, that was in what 1915 or something that he
0:43:43 went down there and he saw, he was in Sydney for some swimming exhibition and he saw good
0:43:50 waves and he went, wow. And so he tracked down big piece of pine wood and made himself
0:43:56 a surfboard. And then when the surfboard was Paul, he went surfing and you know, all the
0:44:03 people were watching going, wow. And they still have that surfboard. Really? It’s in
0:44:09 the freshwater surf lifesaving club. And I looked at that board and went, oh, that’s
0:44:15 not that big a board because part of that story is that he wrote a couple of waves in
0:44:22 all the way to the beach. And then he came in and he asked some young girl, her name
0:44:29 was Isabelle Latham. And he asked her if she would like to accompany him out and ride
0:44:37 a wave in with him. And so she went, sure. And so he paddled out tandem with her. They
0:44:43 caught a wave and they both stood up and rode all the way to the beach. And that’s how surfing
0:44:52 started in Australia, which surfing is huge in Australia these days. But the Duke was,
0:44:58 that was what he did. He shared the gift of surfing with people. You know, now, like we
0:45:04 were talking about earlier, plenty serving. We don’t like anymore surfers get too many
0:45:11 already. But surfing is a beautiful thing that that should be shared. And the whole
0:45:15 deal with that Costco board was to make an affordable surfboard so that people could
0:45:24 try it and see what it is that people like you and I live for. Why we live for it.
0:45:30 I never thought that my name and your name would be in a sentence together about surfing.
0:45:39 So my life is complete now, Jerry. So my attitude on that Costco board is God bless
0:45:43 him. I hope he makes millions of dollars like that, right?
0:45:50 Well, you know what? It was your guys fault in Santa Cruz because the first year Costco,
0:45:56 when they’re looking at a new product like that, they do a test run and they put them
0:46:02 in certain stores. And it was the Costco you guys have in Santa Cruz that all of a sudden
0:46:08 the guys went, Oh, these things are selling like hotcakes. And then that’s when they put
0:46:13 in their order. Seriously. So it’s your guys fault.
0:46:19 Oh, when this episode comes out, there’s going to be protests in front of that Costco
0:46:29 board. And I won’t be able to get into by my hot dogs anymore, so Jerry, what do you
0:46:35 think about holding like WSL or even Olympic events in a wave pool? I mean, it seems to
0:46:41 me that so much of surfing is about figuring out where to sit, when to go, all that kind
0:46:46 of stuff. And some of those variables are not exactly there like in the ocean. So do you
0:46:52 think that’s a bastardization of the sport or figure skating in the Olympics? The ice
0:46:59 is perfect. Every rink is kind of the same. And so you compete not on the conditions and
0:47:06 reading the ice. So which way do you fall on wave pools and competitive surfing? I think
0:47:14 the wave pools are an absolute definite part of the future of surfing that you know what
0:47:20 it’s like in most lineups, especially the good lineups, that it’s busy. It’s crowded
0:47:27 and there’s tension. And the thing we talked about earlier about how you go to a wave pool,
0:47:33 everybody knows who’s turn it is. Right. And everybody has a good time. So that’s the experience
0:47:41 of surfing that I’m sure that Duke Hanamuka was trying to promote all over the world.
0:47:48 I just don’t think that he had any idea that surfing was going to grow as large and certainly
0:47:59 not as fast as it did and become how it is now, which is crowded, not enough way for everybody
0:48:06 or me. Whereas in a wave pool, everybody takes turns. And the level of surfing, the
0:48:14 few events that they’ve had at the surf ranch is incredible. And I don’t think there’s any
0:48:22 one of those surfers that would say this is not a good place to have a surf contest.
0:48:30 And the karma factor is taken out of the equation. It’s not like a lot of times in surf
0:48:36 contest, sometimes the last good wave doesn’t come for the guy that all he needs is one
0:48:45 more ride. But in the wave pool, it levels the playing field a little more. So everybody
0:48:50 gets good chance. And obviously, that’s not going to be the only place they have surfing
0:48:56 competitions. But I think it’s if they have good waves. Have you been to the surf ranch
0:49:03 yet? No, I’ve been invited many times. But I’m afraid to go because if I go in, I fall
0:49:12 in love. I just be going all the time. And I don’t need any more distractions in my life.
0:49:18 It’s just like I said, like all the different ways to ride a wave. This is just another
0:49:24 one of them. And when you get there and you see that, holy cow, they’re creating this
0:49:33 wave in a pool, you can’t believe it. You really can’t believe it that such an unbelievable
0:49:42 wave can happen in a big swimming pool. Okay, two more questions. All right. So I got Lopez
0:49:50 rules. The first four are surf to surf tomorrow. Pace yourself. Don’t talk in the lineup.
0:49:58 And the fifth one is best surfer is the one who’s having the most fun. So now with hindsight,
0:50:04 you got any more rules or different interpretation of the rules? Has anything changed about the
0:50:12 Lopez rules? No, I mean, those rules I feel are still valid. But the bottom line of all
0:50:22 of it is keep paddling and not only in a literal sense, because otherwise the next time you
0:50:28 go surfing, you’re going to be all out of shape, but certainly in a metaphorical sense.
0:50:36 Okay, great. I got to tell you a little story. So I go to make this speech for Bob Reef, right?
0:50:42 And at the end of the speech, he presents me with a Jerry Lopez lightning bolt board.
0:50:48 This a gift for making that speech. So this is the most valuable board I have, right? Jerry
0:50:55 Lopez is even signed to me. So during the pandemic, I used to do a lot of virtual talks
0:51:02 and all over the world. So sometimes I’m talking at three, four, five, six a.m. So one day after
0:51:09 I got your board, I decided in my talk, I was going to put it behind me so that I can
0:51:14 show you how cool I am. I surf. I don’t know if I’m a surfer. But anyway, there’s a freaking
0:51:20 Jerry Lopez board behind me as I give this speech. And this is like five a.m. Okay, I
0:51:26 figure. And I lean it against the door because that just happened with the camera. That was
0:51:31 the best place to open the door and the board fell down. Six a.m. I figure what could go
0:51:37 wrong. I don’t know why because my son has never gotten up at six a.m. in the morning
0:51:45 in his life. He opens the door, board fell down, and there’s two dings in it. And this
0:51:50 board has never been waxed, never been used, but it’s got two dings. It’s hanging on my
0:51:58 wall. And ever since that day, I’ve been wondering, what should I do? Should I just put two decals
0:52:06 on it and cover it? Should I ask some local board guy to fix it? Should I ask Bob if I
0:52:12 can send it back to Jerry to fix it? Should I ask Bob if I can send it back to Jerry and
0:52:20 Jerry just circles it in signs? It’s okay, guy. No problem. Leave the ding. So I’ve been
0:52:27 thinking about this for years. Seriously. So now I’m talking to the Jerry Lopez who made
0:52:32 that board. Leave them. No, it is a great story. So maybe I should leave the things.
0:52:39 Little trophies. What do you advise me to do about the two things in my Jerry Lopez board?
0:52:46 What about these? And then you can tell him the story. And then when your son comes, look
0:52:52 at those things. Oh, boy, gonna shake his head. But you know what we should do, guy? We gotta
0:53:01 tell Bob, hey, we got to get guy the 10 six glider. So when he goes out at Cowles, he can
0:53:08 sit outside by the guys with the stand up boards and he can catch all the waves he like. Never
0:53:18 miss one. Yeah. Yeah. Just tell me how much you want the money. Start today. Call up us
0:53:27 phone order the blank. I would do that in a second Jerry. Although another funny story
0:53:33 is I gave a speech for a company in Santa Barbara. And as a gift, they gave me this
0:53:40 yater spoon. And this is a triple stringer yater spoon. Beautiful board. It’s got wood
0:53:47 tail, wood nose, the block. It’s just beautiful. So I bring it home to Santa Cruz. And the
0:53:52 guys I surf with and my family, they tell me, you’re not going to surf that board that
0:53:58 board is too beautiful. Just put it on the wall. So that board has never been ridden.
0:54:05 And then I decided that when I die, and there’s a paddle out for me, hopefully, I’m going
0:54:14 to have my ashes paddle on that yater. Because finally I get to ride the yater. But when
0:54:19 you make me this glider press up, brother, I may save this moment and be paddled out
0:54:29 on the Jerry Lopez glider for my last trip at calls. Thank you guy. Pressures on Jerry.
0:54:36 I hope you enjoyed this episode with Mr. Pipeline Jerry Lopez. Now you know why I need to take
0:54:43 up yoga. You know the origin of the Jerry Lopez Costco board, which drives local surfers
0:54:51 in Santa Cruz absolutely crazy. And you know why I will not fix the ding in my Jerry Lopez
0:54:57 board. I have to tell you one more story about this episode. Madison and I were so excited
0:55:03 to interview Jerry Lopez that we forgot to press the record button for the first 30
0:55:09 minutes. Luckily, we have backup systems. But I will say when we told Jerry what happened,
0:55:15 he was totally cool about it and willing to start all over. That’s the kind of guy that
0:55:22 Jerry Lopez is. I want to thank the people that made this episode possible. First and
0:55:30 foremost is Bob Reef. Without Bob Reef and what a great last name for a surfing enthusiast.
0:55:36 Without Bob Reef, this episode would not have happened. And then there’s the remarkable
0:55:44 people team. Shannon Hernandez and Jeff C. on sound design. Tessa Nizmer, researcher.
0:55:50 And there’s Louise Magana, Alexis Nishimura and Fallon Nyapes. Finally, there’s Madison
0:55:57 Nizmer. She’s the producer of this podcast and co-author of the book, “Think Remarkable”.
0:56:02 The point of this book is to help you make a difference and be remarkable. If this interests
0:56:10 you, you have to read this book. Let’s just say that on this day, March 17th, 2024, there
0:56:19 are 31 reviews of “Think Remarkable” on Amazon. They are all 5 stars. What can I say?
0:56:24 We are the remarkable people team. We’re on a mission to help you make a difference and
0:56:36 be remarkable. Until next time, mahalo and aloha.
In this episode of Remarkable People, Guy Kawasaki sits down with legendary surfer Gerry Lopez, known as “Mr. Pipeline.” Gerry shares his journey from mastering the waves of Oahu’s North Shore to pioneering high-performance shortboards through his company, Lightning Bolt. The conversation delves into the deep connection between surfing and yoga, the evolution of surf etiquette, and Gerry’s experience acting in Hollywood films. Discover Gerry’s perspective on the future of surfing, including wave pools and the Olympics. Tune in for an enlightening discussion with a true surfing icon who continues to inspire generations with his passion and wisdom.
—
Guy Kawasaki is on a mission to make you remarkable. His Remarkable People podcast features interviews with remarkable people such as Jane Goodall, Marc Benioff, Woz, Kristi Yamaguchi, and Bob Cialdini. Every episode will make you more remarkable.
With his decades of experience in Silicon Valley as a Venture Capitalist and advisor to the top entrepreneurs in the world, Guy’s questions come from a place of curiosity and passion for technology, start-ups, entrepreneurship, and marketing. If you love society and culture, documentaries, and business podcasts, take a second to follow Remarkable People.
Listeners of the Remarkable People podcast will learn from some of the most successful people in the world with practical tips and inspiring stories that will help you be more remarkable.
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