Mark Rober’s Odyssey: From NASA to YouTube Fame

0:00:13 I’m Guy Kawasaki and this is Remarkable People.
0:00:16 We’re on a mission to make you Remarkable.
0:00:21 Today’s Remarkable Guest is Mark Rober.
0:00:25 If you don’t recognize the name, ask your kids.
0:00:27 They will know who he is.
0:00:36 Basically, Mark Rober makes science entertaining through his wondrous gadgets and viral experiments.
0:00:41 After earning elite engineering degrees and a nine-year NASA career working on the Mars
0:00:49 Curiosity rover, Mark went to Apple and worked in its secretive special projects group.
0:00:54 But that’s not what most people know about Mark Rober.
0:01:01 Mark Rober is the guy who started with a viral Halloween costume illusion that looked like
0:01:04 you were looking through his flesh.
0:01:08 Well, he’s come a long way from that.
0:01:16 And now, if you watch YouTube’s videos of Squirrel Olympics or his glitter and fart
0:01:20 bombs, that’s Mark.
0:01:23 Oh my God, my kids love him.
0:01:31 Mark has this “Build It Yourself” philosophy that embodies the spirit of innovation and
0:01:33 intellectual curiosity.
0:01:38 He has tens of millions of followers on YouTube.
0:01:45 He also rallies the troops to support causes like treating autism and taking care of the
0:01:46 ocean.
0:01:50 He has unrelenting curiosity and humor.
0:01:59 And this was a really special episode because it was recorded in person at his secret studio
0:02:00 in Silicon Valley.
0:02:02 I’m Guy Kawasaki.
0:02:12 This is Remarkable People and now here is the one and only Remarkable Mark Rober.
0:02:18 You’re cutting onions at home in your kitchen.
0:02:21 You were in goggles now, or have you found something?
0:02:23 If you want the truth, we’re just getting right to the truth.
0:02:27 I torn ash everything now.
0:02:28 So much for that.
0:02:32 It’s still a good story, though.
0:02:36 So the story we’re talking about is that when he was a kid, he created these goggles.
0:02:40 I was raised in a household like everybody did chores and we all worked together, including
0:02:41 preparing dinner and stuff.
0:02:46 So I think I was like six years old and my mom asked me to make the salad and cut the
0:02:47 onions.
0:02:51 And I do remember this and I was like, “Wait, I’m crying.
0:02:55 I should protect my eyes,” which I went upstairs under our sink and I got the swim goggles
0:02:57 and I came down and put them on.
0:03:02 Not trying to make a big deal out of it and my mom saw that and now this is like a common
0:03:06 life hack, but this was before then and I was a friggin’ six-year-old.
0:03:09 And I just remember her making a big deal about that and it made me feel good.
0:03:14 Oh, like if I have an idea, it’s rewarded to have a good idea and to pursue it.
0:03:16 And so much so that she took a picture of it.
0:03:19 And back then, pictures mattered.
0:03:23 You only had 24 on a roll, so you were pretty judicious.
0:03:26 And so we still have that picture in the family of me cutting onions.
0:03:31 If you Google Mark Rover cutting onions, it’s like online somewhere, yeah.
0:03:33 We’re gonna look for that picture, okay.
0:03:37 Speaking of your parents, what do you tell your parents you do now?
0:03:45 Yeah, it is funny because growing up, I worked at NASA for a decade and then Apple for five
0:03:46 years.
0:03:48 As a mechanical engineer.
0:03:52 So it’s like, I did do the serious route at least, I gave it a go.
0:03:56 And now I feel like I’m taking the best parts of the serious route and what I learned there.
0:04:00 Building the world’s largest Nerf gun or building a glitter bomb, there’s a lot of principles
0:04:03 there that are the same as putting a rover on Mars.
0:04:08 You prototype, you test, there’s a design phase that you iterate.
0:04:13 So like a lot of the skills I learned in real life work for what I do today on YouTube.
0:04:18 But yeah, luckily YouTube is enough of a thing now that they have something to say.
0:04:23 But it was funny growing up because my dad, three or four times I remember sitting down
0:04:26 and just like, Mark, because I did pranks a lot, right?
0:04:28 Which probably shouldn’t come as a surprise to you as a kid.
0:04:30 I just was not serious.
0:04:33 He’s like, Mark, someday you’re gonna have to get serious.
0:04:36 You can’t just skate through life.
0:04:38 And now I’m like, what’s up dad?
0:04:39 Look at me.
0:04:43 I’m like farts spraying glitter on YouTube.
0:04:48 I’m building obstacle courses for squirrels in my backyard, dad.
0:04:50 You’re having wiffle ball drones?
0:04:53 Yeah, wiffle ball drones, yeah.
0:04:58 Basically any sport, automatic bullseye dartboards, anything humans aren’t good at that they wish
0:05:02 they were better at, I’m like, all right, what’s the robot that could do that better?
0:05:03 That’s why we bought the surfboard.
0:05:06 We have a surfboard question.
0:05:10 The first major area is NASA and JPL.
0:05:18 So first of all, how does it feel to send the machine seven months away, 300 million
0:05:20 miles away, and there’s no mechanic?
0:05:25 Yeah, that’s such a good question because when you look at space, a lot of times it’s
0:05:27 more expensive.
0:05:31 And that’s because it’s different than making a car because with a car, you have mechanics
0:05:36 and it doesn’t have to be so reliable out to the 12th decimal place because you could
0:05:41 just bring it into the shop or have a recall or there’s warranties for this purpose.
0:05:43 But with space, none of those are options.
0:05:45 It just has to work.
0:05:52 So sometimes when a bolt has a length, that’s one inch, it’s like 1.000 inches.
0:05:58 It needs to be that length because if an arm’s coming by, the precision can matter because
0:05:59 it has to work.
0:06:03 So therefore that bolt is a $45 bolt.
0:06:10 So yeah, it’s a little bit terrifying to send something to Mars and your job is done.
0:06:13 There’s literally nothing you can do from a hardware perspective.
0:06:17 On top of that, the other thing that’s scary about sending it to Mars too is it takes 30
0:06:23 minutes to get a signal from Mars to Earth and it takes only seven minutes to go from
0:06:30 that upper atmosphere that started an intruscent landing 25,000 miles per hour down to three
0:06:33 miles per hour on the ground.
0:06:37 And so that means by the time we’ve even got a signal and we’re trying to get to Mars
0:06:44 that we’ve hit the upper atmosphere, in reality for 23 minutes, it’s either been successfully
0:06:49 clean and landed looking awesome on the surface and everything worked or it’s a smoldering
0:06:52 heap and you just have to sit and wait.
0:06:57 So it all has to be autonomous and think on its own, especially for that intruscent landing.
0:07:02 So it’s this weird situation where you at the end of the day, it is a dice roll, but
0:07:07 you just do everything you can as an engineer and scientists stack the dice in your favor,
0:07:10 which I think is a great metaphor for life.
0:07:15 So if there was ever an application for artificial intelligence, that’s it, right?
0:07:16 It’s in the rover.
0:07:21 If you can’t do anything for 23 minutes, at least if there’s AI there, it’s like a more
0:07:24 simplified because it’s more like a decision tree.
0:07:26 If it feels this hot, then do this.
0:07:29 If you’re going too fast, then do this.
0:07:35 I think currently for the intruscent landing, it’s like a very brute force version of AI
0:07:36 in a sense.
0:07:40 What was the hardest mechanical system to make on the rover?
0:07:44 It’s interesting because it’s like when people ask me questions about the rover, it’s like
0:07:50 nobody really knows what the rover is because I know my hardware that I built better than
0:07:56 anyone else does because I was in the weeds with it for five years and so does the engineer
0:07:59 next to me because that’s how they divide up the rover into chunks and everyone’s responsible
0:08:01 for a portion.
0:08:05 But then the guy who has the overall view of everything, he or she knows all the parts
0:08:06 of the robot.
0:08:07 They don’t know it individually, right?
0:08:12 So it’s like this weird like emergence thing where we’re all little ants and the colony
0:08:16 does this amazing thing, but no single ant knows all the things.
0:08:20 From my perspective, what I do know about the high level, one of the things that makes
0:08:23 Mars so challenging is the temperature fluctuations.
0:08:28 It’s not something we really have to deal with as extremely here on Earth because there’s
0:08:32 less of an atmosphere and so when the sun’s shining, it’s really, really hot.
0:08:34 When the sun’s not, it’s very, very cold.
0:08:37 It’s like being in a desert on Earth, but to a much more extreme.
0:08:39 Like burning man without the rain.
0:08:41 Yeah, exactly.
0:08:46 And metal grows and everything grows and shrinks depending on the temperature and when in
0:08:49 the variations more, it grows and shrinks more.
0:08:51 So that creates a lot of problems.
0:08:54 Not to mention, I know we had a lot of problems with actuators.
0:08:58 So the motors that move everything and there’s a bunch of them with lubrication, with those
0:08:59 temperature environments.
0:09:03 I think my answer to that would be like the actuators we really struggle with.
0:09:08 And I think it was the actuators that actually pushed the original mission back two years
0:09:10 because that’s the other challenge of Mars.
0:09:11 You can’t just go to Mars whenever you want.
0:09:15 You literally have to go when the planets are aligned and there’s a specific window
0:09:16 that you can go.
0:09:18 It’s usually about every two years that it’s okay.
0:09:22 It’s close enough that I haven’t a fuel to get there.
0:09:30 What does the fact that something that was specced to last 90 days lasted 14 years mean?
0:09:32 That guys like you did such a great job?
0:09:39 No, it means that’s as a great PR department because you sandbag there’s two things there.
0:09:43 One is you want to keep expectations low and exceed expectations, right?
0:09:50 So they intentionally like set, it would be a great W if this worked for 90 days, right?
0:09:52 And so then it works longer.
0:09:55 But the other thing is like, going back to like, you stack the dice in your favor at
0:09:57 the end of the day, it’s a dice roll.
0:09:59 You have all these things that could be failures.
0:10:02 Sometimes if any one of them goes wrong, the whole mission is over.
0:10:07 You just design everything as robustly as possible.
0:10:12 And if nothing fails and it lasts for longer, then the mission ends up lasting longer.
0:10:14 It’s kind of out of your hands.
0:10:17 Did your name get sent on perseverance?
0:10:19 Did I sign it somewhere or something?
0:10:22 Like in the inside of the Macintosh we signed it.
0:10:24 No public comment on that.
0:10:25 Okay.
0:10:26 That’s a yes.
0:10:27 Everybody.
0:10:28 Okay.
0:10:35 One last question about Mars and, and NASA and stuff is when you read about Elon Musk
0:10:38 saying we’re going to put people there and they’re going to live in all that.
0:10:39 You say, oh, that’s my hero.
0:10:40 He’s doing it.
0:10:41 Are you saying?
0:10:43 What the hell is he thinking?
0:10:44 He has no clue.
0:10:49 No, I think Elon Musk is great for humanity.
0:10:53 If he could just stay off Twitter and not be such an idiot.
0:10:59 If you look at what he’s done, Starlink would be someone’s most crown jewel achievement
0:11:02 that they’ve ever done, getting internet out there for people.
0:11:03 Ukraine.
0:11:04 Ukraine is an example.
0:11:07 He did it just because he needed a little bit of cash to like run another business.
0:11:11 It’s like a, his side hustle is something that’s a really good idea.
0:11:12 Yeah.
0:11:17 So I think he has the ability to really, his crystal ball is clearer, I think in some
0:11:20 ways than the average person for sure.
0:11:22 And he has other aspects about him.
0:11:25 Making humans a multi-planetary species.
0:11:26 Yes.
0:11:27 Of course.
0:11:30 That is absolutely a backup plan is always a good thing.
0:11:35 And I think he’s doing more as an individual to push us toward that than anyone else.
0:11:36 I can’t fault them for that.
0:11:39 He single-handedly got us into electric cars.
0:11:40 Yeah.
0:11:41 Yeah.
0:11:42 That’s another side business.
0:11:43 Yeah.
0:11:45 And he really made it cool.
0:11:51 And I think he really pushed that forward a lot faster than it would have happened otherwise.
0:11:52 Okay.
0:11:54 Now, sometimes history is rewritten.
0:11:59 Is it accurate to say that you lift NASA to make high-tech Halloween costumes?
0:12:00 Yes.
0:12:01 That actually is true.
0:12:02 That’s accurate.
0:12:03 That is accurate.
0:12:04 It’s funny.
0:12:05 Which is another one.
0:12:09 When I told my dad that at the time, he’s like, it made sense.
0:12:13 So what happened is my first YouTube video ever while working at NASA was like this Halloween
0:12:17 costume where an iPad in front, iPad in back.
0:12:20 If you do a FaceTime video chat, it looks like you have a hole in your body because the front
0:12:23 camera shows us from the back and vice versa.
0:12:25 And that video went really viral.
0:12:28 And I was like, my first video ever, it felt really good.
0:12:33 It was like going back to the onions in the, cutting the onions in the kitchen so many
0:12:37 years before, except this time instead of my mom taking pictures, like a bunch of strangers
0:12:38 sharing this video.
0:12:40 And I was like, well, I’ve got more ideas.
0:12:45 And so since that time, I’ve done one video a month for over a decade now.
0:12:50 And with that, the main comment on that Halloween costume was like, cool idea, bro, but I don’t
0:12:54 have $1,200 for a Halloween costume, which got me thinking, how can I make this cheaper?
0:12:58 And then the thought was like, if you just have a normal t-shirt with a cool print on
0:13:02 it, a scary print with an eyeball, and then you make a free app with an eyeball that moves
0:13:05 all around, like it’s looking around, you could cut a hole in the t-shirt, you could
0:13:10 duct tape your phone to the back of the t-shirt, and now you have like a super chill, really
0:13:11 wild Halloween costume.
0:13:16 So I worked nights and weekends that whole year to come up with this idea, 24 shirts,
0:13:21 free app, and we launched it and it was a banger success.
0:13:27 And so from that, there’s a company in the UK who wanted to buy it and bring me with
0:13:28 it.
0:13:29 And it was a great deal for me.
0:13:30 It made sense.
0:13:32 And it was like a fun opportunity.
0:13:34 So I did that for two years.
0:13:38 I still lived in California, but I would go over to the UK every couple months and work
0:13:40 with those guys.
0:13:45 And then my boss’s boss from NASA eventually called me, he had come up to work at Apple,
0:13:48 and he’s like, hey, I think I would love to have you on my team.
0:13:51 I think we really need you up here.
0:13:54 And I was like, oh, this seems like a cool next opportunity.
0:14:01 And that’s what moved me up to the Bay Area.
0:14:03 And can you talk about what you did at Apple?
0:14:09 I can talk more about this than I do, but I can say there’s a patent that I’m the lead
0:14:13 author on, which is kind of nice because you can talk publicly about that.
0:14:17 And I will say patently Apple is like a website who covers Apple’s patents.
0:14:19 They called it the patent of the decade.
0:14:23 And it’s all about using virtual reality and self-driving cars.
0:14:28 And what does that mean when you combine virtual reality with the fact that you have a self-driving
0:14:35 car, because if you think about it, when self-driving cars come around, like 40% of people get motion
0:14:36 sickness.
0:14:40 And so 40% of the population will have all this free time, but they can’t utilize it
0:14:43 because they need to be like looking at the road.
0:14:46 Are there ways to mitigate motivation sickness with virtual reality?
0:14:50 Are there ways to create some really interesting entertainment opportunities?
0:14:55 Because if you think about it, a car is like the world’s greatest simulator, motion simulator,
0:14:57 because you’re actually moving.
0:15:00 Whereas on Star Tours and one of these things, when you need to accelerate, the seat turns
0:15:02 back 90 degrees.
0:15:06 And that kind of does feel like you’re accelerating forward, but then you’re not feeling pressure
0:15:07 on your butt.
0:15:09 It just feels a little bit off.
0:15:13 But in a car, you’d actually feel 1G down, and you get the accelerations in different
0:15:14 directions.
0:15:18 What does that mean when you pair it with a zombie apocalypse experience?
0:15:19 Right?
0:15:23 If you close your eyes and go over a speed bump, from personal experience, I’ve thought
0:15:25 about this, it feels a lot like running over a zombie.
0:15:30 And by the way, the car knows where all the potholes are because it talks with other cars.
0:15:35 So you could design a very interesting simulation that feels very real.
0:15:38 And if you get to a red light, in real life, it’s just a red light.
0:15:42 But in this zombie apocalypse game, you get there and it’s like the car dies.
0:15:44 And you’re like, come on, go, go, go, go.
0:15:47 The light turns green right at the right time, but you can pull off.
0:15:49 And that’s like a zombie game.
0:15:54 Like there’s also, if you’re stuck in traffic on the freeway, and you just want to motivate
0:15:57 that, the motions you’re feeling, because that’s what motion sickness is when weight
0:16:00 doesn’t match up with your internal gyro.
0:16:03 So now instead of just being stuck in traffic on the freeway going home, maybe you’re on
0:16:04 a lazy river.
0:16:07 And when the road turns right, the river turns right.
0:16:10 And when you need to stop because there’s a car in front of you and it’s about traffic,
0:16:13 like a little log comes up and your canoe stops.
0:16:15 So this is really interesting.
0:16:19 And that’s like just the tip of the iceberg, but it was a very extensive pattern.
0:16:23 So that’s all I could say about my time at Apple.
0:16:24 Because that’s public information.
0:16:27 I’m just talking about publicly what’s in that pattern.
0:16:29 Have you considered talking to Joby?
0:16:33 Because Joby has the same sort of needs, right?
0:16:35 Virtual reality flying is even.
0:16:36 Yeah.
0:16:39 And the answer is no, because Apple owns that pattern now.
0:16:42 I want to stay clear of their lawyers.
0:16:43 Okay.
0:16:48 Listen, I have a rich history of Apple.
0:16:49 Yeah, I know you do.
0:16:50 I know you do.
0:16:57 And the thought of Apple making a car, they’re going to spec, especially electricity and
0:17:00 there’s going to be a dongle, but the dongle will be 10 grand.
0:17:01 Yeah.
0:17:07 And the car will be really great, but only go 75 miles or four hours.
0:17:09 Yeah, that’s right.
0:17:13 And somehow they’ll convince you that it’s like the best thing and you’ll believe it.
0:17:14 Apple is good at that.
0:17:15 You have an iPhone.
0:17:16 Yeah.
0:17:18 This is a 13.
0:17:19 Okay.
0:17:20 Yeah.
0:17:21 I will buy the 15.
0:17:25 This morning I placed an order for a GoPro 12 too.
0:17:26 You guys use GoPro’s?
0:17:28 So we don’t anymore.
0:17:30 And you want to know what we use instead?
0:17:31 Reds.
0:17:32 iPhones.
0:17:33 Really?
0:17:34 I’m serious.
0:17:36 We have like 20 iPhones that we filmed with.
0:17:38 You don’t use Reds or so many iPhones or anything.
0:17:39 No.
0:17:46 You have our primary cameras are like Panasonic GH5s or whatever, but like 30% of the shots
0:17:48 in all my YouTube videos are on an iPhone.
0:17:49 Really?
0:17:50 Yeah.
0:17:51 They’re great.
0:17:52 They have great dynamic range.
0:17:56 And on YouTube, if a TV show puts, you know, Discovery Channel puts something on YouTube,
0:17:58 it never does well because it’s too polished.
0:18:03 So there’s a little bit of on YouTube, you want to be authentic and who I am right now
0:18:04 talking to you.
0:18:05 This is who I am.
0:18:06 It’s who I am in my videos.
0:18:08 And I think people can sniff that out.
0:18:12 And so by having a lot of the shots on an iPhone or whatever, this is more just about
0:18:17 capturing what’s actually happening versus this super polished thing with everything
0:18:18 just perfect.
0:18:22 I think it works better and they’re just way easier to use and they don’t overheat for
0:18:23 can GoPro.
0:18:25 Sorry GoPro.
0:18:32 I surf and I use a GoPro and I swear 20% of the time it crashes in the middle of it and
0:18:36 there’s nothing you can do except pull out the battery and put it back in, except that’s
0:18:38 I’m very risky in the water.
0:18:44 And then I don’t know why, but the date and time is always off.
0:18:45 That’s funny.
0:18:50 And then it saves it to the wrong folder and like, you know, GoPro, this is version freaking
0:18:51 I know.
0:18:55 Can we just get it reliable or how they even name their files?
0:19:00 Like when you record, if you have a clip that’s longer, it’s like GH, it’s not even sequential,
0:19:01 which I don’t understand.
0:19:03 And you think they would have fixed that by now.
0:19:04 Yeah.
0:19:05 I don’t know.
0:19:08 I don’t have a GoPro, but I’m happy to hear someone in a completely different street also
0:19:09 have issues them.
0:19:14 I can’t tell you how many times we have not got an amazing shot that I really wanted because
0:19:18 it just stopped recording or it overheated or whatever.
0:19:19 So I was just like, we’re done.
0:19:24 We interviewed Garrett McNamara and the 100 foot wave guy.
0:19:27 And he uses GoPro so he has the same issues.
0:19:28 Oh, really?
0:19:29 Yeah.
0:19:34 And it’s one thing for you to do another take with a squirrel jumping over 100 foot wave.
0:19:35 But not always.
0:19:40 We have this elephant toothpaste experiment that was like a hundred and some on thousand
0:19:42 dollars just for all the chemicals.
0:19:45 We’re doing some big old world record.
0:19:48 It’s this foam that creates this chemical reaction to the sky and we had like three
0:19:51 go pros inside like the money shots.
0:19:53 They all overheated, didn’t get the shot.
0:20:00 So I would argue, no, it’s not always just a squirrel guy.
0:20:04 So now we’re going from Apple to YouTube.
0:20:05 Yeah.
0:20:06 A more general question.
0:20:09 Like, how did you make these transitions?
0:20:17 How did you go from rocket scientists to costume maker to virtual reality to YouTuber?
0:20:18 Yeah.
0:20:19 So it’s interesting.
0:20:21 I’m a very conservative person.
0:20:23 I want to say that right now.
0:20:24 I don’t feel like I make big.
0:20:26 You think Trump won?
0:20:27 Yeah.
0:20:28 Not politically.
0:20:29 Not talking politically.
0:20:32 I am very conservative in nature as an engineer.
0:20:36 And so I agree on paper when you look at some of the decisions I made and some of the bets
0:20:43 I’ve made that they seem big, but then at the time, and I think this is maybe it’s a
0:20:47 blessing and a curse, but it feels like the next move is very obvious.
0:20:51 And I think that’s always been the case for me where it’s like, it feels very clear.
0:20:56 I don’t have a crystal ball that works five, 10 years in the future, but my one year crystal
0:20:59 ball, I feel is pretty good.
0:21:04 And I don’t swing it a lot of pitches, but the pitches I swing at are the juicy ones
0:21:07 that I feel like, yep, this is a hundred percent.
0:21:08 I beg to differ.
0:21:09 I saw the Whiffleball video.
0:21:10 True.
0:21:13 The Whiffleball side.
0:21:14 Yeah.
0:21:19 I think as an example, when I finally left Apple, at that point, to be fair, I had 10
0:21:22 million subscribers when I finally left Apple.
0:21:23 And most people will use- Wait, wait, wait, wait.
0:21:24 You had 10 million?
0:21:25 Yeah.
0:21:27 I left Apple five years ago.
0:21:32 And Apple PR Nazis, they weren’t shutting you down so you can’t be this public.
0:21:34 You’re like- No, they tried.
0:21:35 And you quit.
0:21:36 No, no.
0:21:40 So when I first went to work there, they told me I couldn’t make YouTube videos.
0:21:43 And I only had 180,000 subscribers then.
0:21:45 And I was like, well, forget you guys.
0:21:48 You asked me to work for you, and I told them no.
0:21:49 And they’re like, fine.
0:21:52 At least when you come here, you have to wait three months to release a video.
0:21:54 I was like, guys, you don’t have to worry about it.
0:21:56 It’s not like my videos get that many views anyways.
0:21:57 The first video, I waited three months.
0:22:01 The first video I did was just like how to skin a watermelon video.
0:22:02 It’s this dumb video.
0:22:03 It just has a really good thumbnail.
0:22:08 It got like 40 million views in a week.
0:22:13 It’s still, to this day, is my most viewed video because it just has this really wacky
0:22:18 thumbnail of this watermelon shell that’s peeled open and you see like a shaved watermelon
0:22:19 inside.
0:22:20 Anyways.
0:22:26 So, that was my start with them, and then, but I just said I would never say I worked
0:22:27 for Apple.
0:22:28 I would keep it quiet, right?
0:22:29 And then I had an opportunity to go on Jimmy Kimmel.
0:22:34 They reached out to me, and I asked Apple, I was like, hey, can I do this?
0:22:36 It went all the way up to a senior VP.
0:22:39 I won’t say his name, but you know who he is.
0:22:43 And he’s like, look, we should be focused on making great products.
0:22:44 That was the answer.
0:22:49 So it wasn’t like a no, but I was like, at first I was like, oh crap, I can’t do this.
0:22:50 Then I was like, hold on.
0:22:53 They can’t tell me I can’t play badminton on the weekend.
0:22:58 Like, as long as I don’t say I work for Apple, his response of not being no basically tip
0:23:00 me off that legally he couldn’t say no type of thing.
0:23:02 And so I was like, okay, I forget this.
0:23:03 I’m doing it.
0:23:04 And I did it.
0:23:08 And to this day, I ended up going on Jimmy’s show like eight times.
0:23:10 I hosted his show.
0:23:11 We’re really good friends.
0:23:14 I spend the night at his house any time I’m in LA.
0:23:19 So it was like, it was a really good move for me to not take that advice of not going
0:23:21 on but a show.
0:23:25 The evangelist and marketer in me would say, holy shit.
0:23:33 This is a gift from God that I got this person whose rank and file employee who has 30 million
0:23:35 followers and gets 40 million views.
0:23:38 Like I’ll let him introduce the next Apple watch.
0:23:43 No, no, because in their mind, and to be honest, I think they’re right.
0:23:44 There’s just no upside.
0:23:48 Apple doesn’t need someone saying, hey, that you know about Apple.
0:23:52 So it’s all just downside when I have some controversy.
0:23:55 Like obviously that’s not going to happen or knock on wood.
0:23:56 Let’s get that.
0:23:59 Like I’m pretty conservative in my personal life with stuff.
0:24:01 So I don’t think I’m going to get canceled.
0:24:05 But if I did, if there was some event, it only can say, oh, this guy also works for
0:24:06 Apple.
0:24:07 And so they just don’t want any of that.
0:24:10 They want to be fully in control of their destiny.
0:24:14 On the other hand, they got to spend so much effort sucking up to Marquez and iJustine.
0:24:17 In fact, they own a Marquez or iJustine, right?
0:24:18 Yeah.
0:24:22 But like they always have that layer of separation where there’s an independent journalist that’s
0:24:25 just different than them being an Apple employee.
0:24:26 Yeah.
0:24:31 So anyways, all that’s to say, I quit my job at Apple when I had 10 million subscribers
0:24:35 and I loved my team, the people I worked with were awesome.
0:24:36 They wanted me to stay.
0:24:40 I really, and I loved the job I did there, but it was just getting too big.
0:24:42 The YouTube thing.
0:24:45 So I ended up going full time obviously to do this.
0:24:47 And then recently we launched Crunch Labs, which I’m sure we’ll talk about in a little
0:24:48 bit.
0:24:53 And that was another example where it’s like, this just is clearly the right thing to do.
0:24:55 And yeah, it’s gone well.
0:25:01 And when this clearly the right thing to do feeling happens, is it an epiphany or is it
0:25:05 like a little acorn that grows over the course of this?
0:25:06 Yeah, that’s a great question.
0:25:07 It’s a tree.
0:25:11 I’d say it’s more, it’s a combination.
0:25:16 It’s like an acorn, but I would say a lot of the growth happens very quickly.
0:25:21 And by very quickly, I mean like in a matter of hours, you get the gestational idea.
0:25:25 And I feel like 70% of building out the meat on the bones happens.
0:25:29 Like I just get really excited and I would just start writing things down.
0:25:32 And of course this, this seems so obvious, right?
0:25:37 And then, and then the rest grows like maturely over time because the devil’s in the details
0:25:39 execution is what really matters.
0:25:43 But that first vision of just getting stoked about what something could be, like that apple
0:25:48 patent as an example, most of the ideas and that really, really long patent came in a
0:25:50 matter of an hour and a half, right?
0:25:54 When I first had the idea and I was like shaking, I was like, oh my gosh, there’s so much here.
0:25:55 Yeah.
0:25:57 How often do you get those hour and a half?
0:25:58 Not.
0:25:59 It’s for the big ones.
0:26:00 It’s for the big ideas.
0:26:02 And Amazon, I make monthly videos too.
0:26:05 So sometimes if I have a video idea and I’m like, oh, this is great and I could do this
0:26:09 and it could be this, that’s a familiar feeling to me just from the monthly video cadence.
0:26:13 But like the big ideas, for example, the toy company, Crunch Labs.
0:26:14 Yeah.
0:26:18 Once it made sense and the story is actually Kimmel was the one.
0:26:22 I was spending that at his house cause we had just done a fundraiser for my son who’s
0:26:24 on the autism spectrum.
0:26:28 We did a big fundraiser on my channel and it was that night after we’d done it, like
0:26:32 a four hour live stream, he’s like, you really need to make a product for kids.
0:26:36 You think, I don’t think you realize what you have and what you mean to people but people
0:26:37 trust you.
0:26:42 I mean, standard responses, no, like whenever someone tells me I need to do something, like
0:26:48 write a book, go on tour, do a podcast, for example, guy, I’m always like, why?
0:26:52 And when we keep asking why and get to the root of it, it’s so I can make more money.
0:26:54 And it’s like, I have enough money.
0:26:56 I don’t spend that much money.
0:27:01 I’d rather focus on the things I really love and focus on those and make those excellent
0:27:05 and amazing and not just inundate myself and spread myself super thin.
0:27:09 So when Kimmel told me this, I was like, my answer is no, I don’t need to Jimmy, I enjoy
0:27:10 making these monthly videos.
0:27:13 But then just the more I thought about it, it’s like, yeah, you can only learn so much
0:27:18 passively watching a video, but if you actually had a toy that was really, really fun, taught
0:27:19 a physics principle.
0:27:24 There’s a video for me explaining the physics principle and you got that every month.
0:27:29 And then the concept is, teach you to think like an engineer, it’s literally on the box.
0:27:32 Then it’s like, you can reach kids at a deeper level.
0:27:36 And he was definitely right that there was the right move to do because it’s gone fairly
0:27:37 well.
0:27:39 So now it helps make the YouTube videos even better.
0:27:44 So it’s like there’s a virtuous cycle of just reaching more, really everyone, but especially
0:27:47 the young folk to get them stoked about science and engineering.
0:27:48 It’s really helped me level up.
0:27:50 So how do you define yourself?
0:27:53 Are you an evangelist for STEM, basically?
0:27:57 You’re not just trying to get a bunch of views so you can monetize your feed.
0:27:58 Yeah, that’s right.
0:27:59 100%.
0:28:00 That’s right.
0:28:05 I think we can all agree my definition of success is do you have a net positive impact
0:28:06 on the world?
0:28:11 There’s a lot of people who I think by the world’s definition of success, maybe they’ve
0:28:13 made a lot of money, but they’re just kind of shitty people.
0:28:16 It’s like a net negative effect on the world.
0:28:22 And I think by that definition of success, I just want to have a net positive impact
0:28:23 on the world.
0:28:28 And I think the way I can do that most is I’ve done something with these videos.
0:28:31 I realized that I can hide the vegetables well.
0:28:35 Basically, if you want someone to learn something and you say, hey, you need to learn something,
0:28:36 they’re going to shut down.
0:28:40 But if you have a picture of the world’s largest jello pool and you’re in the jello and it
0:28:44 says 15 ton jello pool and that’s the click bait and you click on it because you want
0:28:45 to see that.
0:28:47 And sure enough, I’m building the world’s largest jello pool.
0:28:52 What I’m also doing is teaching you about the scientific method and how you actually
0:28:56 make jello and how all the failures we encounter to get to this thing and you’re learning about
0:28:57 chemistry.
0:29:02 It’s like hiding the vegetables of the real meat with this covering of this really interesting
0:29:04 thing to suck you in.
0:29:09 And so I think that carrot versus the stick approach to education and getting stoked about
0:29:13 science is something that I’ve realized I can do well.
0:29:18 And so this just helps me amplify it because there’s a lot of big problems in the world
0:29:21 and we’re in an all brains on deck situation.
0:29:26 So the more kids that I can play some small role in inspiring to enter the steam and stem
0:29:30 fields, then that feels pretty good to me.
0:29:36 We interviewed a woman they won the Harding who also worked for NASA and she was the person
0:29:40 who could have said Rover doesn’t go, Curiosity doesn’t go.
0:29:42 She was the manager of that.
0:29:44 She made the call.
0:29:53 And after her very successful career at NASA, she went to national NOAA, National Ocean
0:29:55 Atmospheric or whatever, right?
0:29:56 Successful there.
0:30:04 And now she’s teaching students in Georgia math and physics, right?
0:30:05 Oh, what grade?
0:30:06 Do you know?
0:30:07 Yeah.
0:30:09 So she went from NASA to…
0:30:10 So this is my dream job.
0:30:12 I want to be a high school physics teacher.
0:30:13 Really?
0:30:14 Yeah, I swear.
0:30:19 I started getting my credentials five years ago and then things just really picked up
0:30:20 and got crazy.
0:30:21 I want to teach in a class.
0:30:24 Obviously I’d be like a volunteer high school physics teacher, but that’s like where it
0:30:29 really clicked for me that I love this stuff and you can explain the world around you in
0:30:32 math and equations was my high school business class.
0:30:36 And in this time that we are talking here, I’ll just tell you, I’m gonna pull out my
0:30:38 phone and look at my YouTube analytics.
0:30:43 In the time that we are having this conversation guy, I want to tell you how many other households
0:30:53 I’m also in, which is, let’s see here, give me one sec, I will be in and I haven’t released
0:30:54 a video in two and a half months.
0:30:57 So it’s not like the channel necessarily popping right now.
0:31:01 But in the time that listeners are listening to this podcast, I’ll be in 400,000 other
0:31:05 homes on just like a random day, right, 400,000.
0:31:10 That’s five really big football stadiums of people, which is like kind of terrifying to
0:31:11 think about for me.
0:31:16 So it’s like, I can reach a lot of people, but I don’t get that selfishly that moment
0:31:18 of like seeing that, aha, which I crave.
0:31:23 I love those aha moments for myself when something clicks and it’s, oh, I get that.
0:31:28 That’s such a good feeling that if I’m teaching high school physics, like I get to see that
0:31:30 selfishly 20 kids there.
0:31:35 But this is why I admittedly it’s a little bit of a selfish pursuit because I get to
0:31:38 see that, I get to get that feedback, right?
0:31:42 And arguably, if you say a YouTube video is one level, making these boxes every month
0:31:47 is another level, being someone’s teacher for years, another level of deeply impacting
0:31:48 their lives.
0:31:50 And what are they going to go on and do, right?
0:31:56 So this is what I love about teachers is they’re the ultimate sort of investors in human capital
0:32:00 because it’s like, you know, I am the product of some amazing teachers who are they themselves
0:32:02 product of teachers before them.
0:32:06 With the teachers, you don’t really ever get to see the full impact of your work, but it’s
0:32:10 like you are investing in people who will then go off and do hopefully amazing things
0:32:12 and inspire other folks.
0:32:17 It’s because unbroken chain back thousands of generations.
0:32:19 You would love one the Harding.
0:32:20 Yeah.
0:32:21 I love her already because she let the rover go.
0:32:24 I guess she was the one who made the call.
0:32:31 And when I knew I was going to interview you, scene has all your guys are rocket scientists.
0:32:34 I sent an email to her saying, I’m interviewing Mark.
0:32:35 What should I ask them?
0:32:36 Okay.
0:32:40 She’s the one who said, how does it feel to send a machine like Rover on a seven month
0:32:44 300 mile trip to Mars without a mechanic?
0:32:45 I was wondering.
0:32:47 I did feel like, oh, good knowledge guy.
0:32:48 Good knowledge.
0:32:52 You didn’t think I was that smart, but he is.
0:32:58 When you realize you’re not smart, you ask somebody like Wanda to help you look smart.
0:33:00 That’s the real genius in the room.
0:33:04 I completely agree with you because you just made yourself way more smarter by basically
0:33:05 creating a net.
0:33:09 I mean, you know so many people and by extension that you are incredibly intelligent because
0:33:12 you could find out anything.
0:33:17 You were telling me about all these trade offs or he’s at any given moment and you said,
0:33:19 so why are you doing this podcast?
0:33:20 Yeah.
0:33:23 You’re not going to reach 400,000 people in my podcast.
0:33:24 Yeah.
0:33:25 Yeah.
0:33:26 I think I generally.
0:33:27 It was the socks.
0:33:28 Yeah.
0:33:31 I’m not a new podcast guy, but I know about you.
0:33:33 I respect your work and so that’s the answer.
0:33:37 But to answer your question, I kind of say no to everything.
0:33:39 This is very rare for me to say yes.
0:33:44 In fact, part of it was the sock connection on the plane to just such a funny story of
0:33:45 how we met.
0:33:46 Yeah.
0:33:49 Because I know really don’t ever really talk to people on the plane.
0:33:50 Yeah.
0:33:54 And then I was talking next to someone who had a great story.
0:33:55 She was an entrepreneur.
0:33:58 She knew you had such nice things to say about you.
0:34:02 Up next on remarkable people because I have all the footage in front of me.
0:34:07 I watch it through and then I’m like, oh, okay, this is a good moment.
0:34:09 In the end, we landed here with this thing.
0:34:14 So now I need to pick the clips that support this landing of this thing being, or let’s
0:34:16 say something fails in the end when we film it.
0:34:20 I want to make sure at the beginning of the video to say, look, we’re not sure if this
0:34:26 part’s going to work, but we’re going to give it our best shot.
0:34:30 Come a little more remarkable with each episode of remarkable people.
0:34:35 It’s found on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
0:34:41 Welcome back to remarkable people with Guy Kawasaki.
0:34:43 Do you know what the word icky guy means?
0:34:44 Yeah.
0:34:45 I think so.
0:34:46 So what’s your icky guy?
0:34:47 Maybe I’m wrong.
0:34:50 But is the guy the thing that’s like what your passion is, what you’re good at?
0:34:52 It’s like the middle of all those things.
0:34:53 Why you live?
0:34:54 Can you remember?
0:34:55 Can you remind me what those four buckets are?
0:34:58 Because I think this is such a beautiful concept.
0:35:03 It’s not necessarily a Venn diagram of what you’re good at, what you like, what you can
0:35:04 get paid for.
0:35:07 It’s really, it’s obviously a Japanese term.
0:35:12 They always show the video of this guy who’s been making samurai swords for 30 years.
0:35:16 It takes six months to make one sword.
0:35:17 It’s his icky guy.
0:35:20 My icky guy is podcasting.
0:35:23 So it’s your reason for getting up in the morning.
0:35:25 It’s your reason for living.
0:35:29 It’s not so much about the intersection of money, talent, and interest.
0:35:30 Got it.
0:35:31 So what’s your icky guy?
0:35:36 For me, it’s getting people, but especially young people stoked about science and engineering
0:35:38 and education.
0:35:43 And I also love making these videos and telling stories.
0:35:45 And I just can’t believe it.
0:35:50 Honestly, once a week, I’m looking at one of my people I work with here and I’m just
0:35:52 like, I cannot believe we get paid for this.
0:35:53 This is bonkers.
0:35:54 Is that what you say?
0:35:55 Yeah.
0:35:56 That’s right.
0:35:57 Like I can’t believe it.
0:36:01 When we’re just doing something ridiculous or blowing something up or building something
0:36:07 crazy, my next video is the world’s smallest Nerf gun because I hold the record for the
0:36:10 world’s largest and we, it’s so small.
0:36:12 We kind of go down in stages.
0:36:18 The final one, we literally folded DNA to make a Nerf gun working with the Salk Institute.
0:36:24 You could fit, I think it’s 2000 if you laid them and across the width of a human hair.
0:36:29 And it’s like learning about what they do at Salk and just the process of that whole
0:36:33 video on, on top of these explosions, we’ve got so much stuff going on right now.
0:36:34 We’re at Crunch Labs.
0:36:38 There’s so many cool things I could show you around here, future videos and ideas we’ve
0:36:42 got that it’s honestly, once a week, I’m just like, this is bonkers.
0:36:44 So like that is my icky guy.
0:36:50 If you can max out on one attribute to having your life, I think it’s gratitude and contentment.
0:36:55 And I think people like you who are very successful or you know, an Elon Musk type where you have
0:36:59 a very dopaminergic brain, which means that you’re really focused on what’s next.
0:37:02 Very ambitious, basically never satisfied.
0:37:04 It’s kind of a curse to have a brain like that.
0:37:08 You get a lot done, you accomplish a lot in your lifetime, but you never feel like you
0:37:12 ever accomplished very much because you’re always focusing on the next thing.
0:37:14 That’s the role of dopamine in our brain.
0:37:18 And so I think contrast that with someone, let’s say maybe they just have a very simple
0:37:22 life and existence and by the world standards, they don’t do much.
0:37:24 Maybe they never even have kids.
0:37:25 They just, hey, I have my show.
0:37:26 I like to watch.
0:37:27 I work in this factory.
0:37:29 So there’s something in between those.
0:37:31 There’s a happy medium, like everything in life.
0:37:36 There’s a middle ground and I do struggle with thinking of the next big thing and just getting
0:37:41 stoked about the next thing and sometimes forgetting to live in the moment, but it’s something
0:37:45 I really consciously try and make an effort of being just really content and grateful
0:37:46 for what I have.
0:37:50 And one life hack for that for me is like to go back 10 years and if 10 years ago I
0:37:53 knew I’d be in this position, I would literally die on the spot.
0:37:55 Like my brain would explode.
0:37:58 Like the people I get to work with down the things we get to do, if I knew about this
0:38:02 when I was like 15 years old, it’s just bonkers.
0:38:11 I think when 40 million people watch a video, there’s going to be quite a few 15 year olds
0:38:15 who see that and look back and say, that was a turning point in my life.
0:38:16 I saw that video.
0:38:17 I saw the Gemel.
0:38:18 I saw the Wiffle ball.
0:38:22 I saw the Squirrel Olympics and I thought, I can do that.
0:38:23 I love science.
0:38:24 Let’s do it.
0:38:25 Yeah.
0:38:26 And it’s pretty cool.
0:38:28 More and more, I’m hearing more of those stories, right?
0:38:29 As time goes on.
0:38:33 Like I just did the MIT commencement speech and they told me the reason they did that
0:38:37 is they asked the students who they want to speak and they said overwhelmingly, my name
0:38:38 came up.
0:38:42 And how much greater praise can there be that freaking MIT has asked you to be?
0:38:43 Right.
0:38:44 I know.
0:38:49 And these kids have grown up watching my videos and these are like next generation’s best
0:38:50 and brightest engineers.
0:38:51 So I mean, that’s an example.
0:38:52 Yeah.
0:38:55 It’s hard to really process what that means, but I’m just going to put my head down.
0:38:57 I’m going to keep doing what I’m doing.
0:39:02 And I think 20 years from now, it will bear out to be the right decision.
0:39:06 I’m glad I did this versus pursuing a career in Hollywood or something.
0:39:08 Not that anyone in Hollywood would ever want me.
0:39:09 I’m a terrible actor.
0:39:11 You have to be on strike right now.
0:39:12 Yeah.
0:39:13 That’s true too.
0:39:17 Have you decoded the DNA of making a video go viral?
0:39:18 Yeah.
0:39:19 You have?
0:39:20 Yeah.
0:39:21 Honestly, I have a good answer to this.
0:39:22 That’s absolutely correct.
0:39:23 That’s pretty simple.
0:39:26 Probably the first person to ask it isn’t.
0:39:27 Yeah.
0:39:29 And the answer is this is true.
0:39:35 You just have to evoke a visceral response in the viewer, whether it makes them laugh,
0:39:39 makes them feel amazed, makes them feel wonder.
0:39:41 It makes them feel angry.
0:39:43 You just have to make them feel something.
0:39:46 No one’s going to share a video that they don’t finish watching.
0:39:51 And unfortunately today in our culture, like anger is one of the easier ones to stoke and
0:39:53 to get views on.
0:39:56 Even someone on Twitter, it’s like they’ll realize, oh, the hot take I had that was really
0:39:59 polarizing is the one that got the most views and likes.
0:40:05 I’m going to have more hot takes and more angry things to say because it feels good
0:40:08 that people see my thing and I get attention.
0:40:10 So that’s the answer.
0:40:14 As humans, if we feel something, then we will act on it.
0:40:15 For example, sharing the video.
0:40:19 Now the hard part is how do you get them to feel something?
0:40:21 And like I said, anger is a cheap way to do it.
0:40:25 One way as an example is like I said, world’s largest Nerf gun or world’s smallest Nerf
0:40:30 gun or world’s largest Super Soaker or world’s largest Jellopool.
0:40:34 By just being world’s largest, it’s something that’s never been seen before.
0:40:39 And so inherently you stack the dice that they feel like they’re going to see something
0:40:43 that’s going to make them feel amazed because this is the first time I’m seeing this is bigger
0:40:45 than anything I’ve ever seen.
0:40:46 So it’s like that aspect of it.
0:40:51 And then also if you could tell stories, a lot of people had made videos about squirrels
0:40:56 in their backyard before I made mine, but they didn’t really like name the squirrels
0:41:02 fat guss and give them back stories and really create a story around it.
0:41:03 Quite like I did.
0:41:06 And I think that’s something people think, oh, you’re a good engineer and you make these
0:41:07 videos.
0:41:11 But if I had to pick one thing, I think there’s a lot of tons of engineers that are way better
0:41:12 than me.
0:41:13 Truthfully.
0:41:14 That’s not fake humility.
0:41:19 I’m an okay engineer, but I’m a pretty good storyteller guy when it comes down and packaging
0:41:23 that specifically a storyteller in the form of video.
0:41:27 And so for a lot of these kids, they’re seeing these videos and for the first time they’re
0:41:33 having these visceral responses to a media, someone they don’t know.
0:41:38 And so I think it creates a very interesting link in their brains where like they’re feeling
0:41:40 emotions like this feels cool.
0:41:42 I want to do that.
0:41:43 I want to be that.
0:41:48 So it’s this hack into their brains that I’m planting these seeds and putting it in the
0:41:52 right soil and I’m stoked to be doing it.
0:42:00 When you do these videos and your storytelling is off the charts, I agree, but is it carefully
0:42:04 scripted and planned or are you out there in the field and say, okay, let’s name the
0:42:07 squirrels now and let’s get a wiffle ball that we cut in half.
0:42:09 We put a brass slug in it.
0:42:14 How much is scripted in advance and how much is marked real time?
0:42:16 I never write the videos.
0:42:19 I write the videos is always the very last step.
0:42:23 Like we’ve been working on this world’s smallest Nerf gun for over a year now.
0:42:26 The video will release in a week and a half.
0:42:30 I am just now looking at all the footage and writing what the script is.
0:42:31 That’s my process.
0:42:35 It’s scripted in the sense that so for the squirrels example, we had 10,000 hours of
0:42:36 squirrels filming them.
0:42:39 That’s what people don’t realize when you’re filming on iPhones and it’s like, oh, it’s
0:42:40 just this dude in this backyard.
0:42:44 I had so much footage that we combed through.
0:42:47 And so at that point, people are like, Oh, the squirrels are like actors.
0:42:49 How do you get them to do everything just so perfectly?
0:42:55 It’s like with 10,000 hours of footage, I can tell whatever story I want.
0:43:00 So it’s a combination of, you know, or we’re going to do the world’s largest elephant toothpaste
0:43:06 video or I went to Rwanda and covered this company called zip line that are delivering
0:43:12 drones or blood through the sky, like on drones and they’ve reduced maternal mortality rate
0:43:14 by like 88%.
0:43:15 I went to Rwanda.
0:43:16 I just knew I wanted to cover them.
0:43:20 I just filmed a bunch and then I come home with the footage and then I piece together
0:43:22 how to tell the story.
0:43:24 And getting down to brass tacks.
0:43:26 Tell me, are you using Premiere?
0:43:27 Premiere Pro.
0:43:28 Yeah.
0:43:29 Yeah.
0:43:30 Premiere Pro.
0:43:31 Yeah.
0:43:32 Most editors do.
0:43:33 Final cut.
0:43:34 People are starting to go back to that.
0:43:35 Apple just stopped supporting it for a really long time.
0:43:36 It burned if you were on Final Cut.
0:43:37 Yeah.
0:43:40 They’ve come back around and are now trying to support it again, but they’ve lost so
0:43:41 much market share.
0:43:46 So I’d say by and large, most YouTubers use Premiere and then in industry it’s like Avid
0:43:47 and other more professional.
0:43:56 And are you sitting on a super duper three monitor, Mac Pro, just $25,000 Macintosh?
0:43:58 So you’re not doing it on your iPhone, right?
0:44:02 The funny story about this is I bought, you know, Apple has what’s it called the Mac?
0:44:04 That one’s desktop tower.
0:44:05 Yeah.
0:44:08 I maxed it out and I’m embarrassed to say how much I paid for that.
0:44:10 But it’s like tens of thousands.
0:44:11 Yeah.
0:44:15 It’s more than a car because I was like, I don’t spend my money on other stuff.
0:44:16 I should spend it on this.
0:44:17 So it’s really fast.
0:44:21 And for whatever reason, the way Apple does their graphics cards and the way Premiere does,
0:44:28 it’s literally no faster than my freaking laptop, which I’m like, so if anyone’s listening,
0:44:32 don’t spend money on the big fancy Apple thing, just a laptop is fine.
0:44:37 But we do things like in the workflow, making proxies, so versions of the video that are
0:44:41 lightweight so you can scrum through easy, and when we do that, honestly, you can edit
0:44:42 from a laptop.
0:44:43 It’s fine.
0:44:49 So if you end up with a 25 minute video, how many man hours or person hours went into that?
0:44:51 So are you talking editing or just everything?
0:44:52 Everything.
0:44:56 So this is, it’s a great question because this is the thing people are most shocked by.
0:45:01 When they come and actually film with me for a day or just are around me, they’re amazed
0:45:04 at the amount of work that goes into a video.
0:45:06 Most of these videos take like a year to make and build.
0:45:12 I have my next 12 videos planned out and we’re working on them in different stages.
0:45:14 How many man hours?
0:45:19 If you add everyone up, because I still edit the videos, I write the video.
0:45:23 I mean, I have people who help me edit, but I spend 80 hours just myself editing and writing
0:45:29 every single video, but I thousands, thousands of man hours, thousands, you get one hour
0:45:30 to get one.
0:45:31 Half an hour.
0:45:32 No.
0:45:33 No.
0:45:34 To get friggin 15 minutes, guy.
0:45:35 Yeah.
0:45:36 So that’s the thing.
0:45:38 When you watch my videos, it’s very punchy.
0:45:39 We’re going from one thing to the next.
0:45:43 I just pack a ton in there because I just want it to be a very engaging experience.
0:45:46 You know, Mr. Beast, my buddy, takes that to a next level.
0:45:50 His are just like really, but I do the equivalent of science.
0:45:53 Not quite as insane, but I really just try and keep them moving.
0:45:56 And so that’s also a thing when we go and film with someone and we interview them.
0:45:58 We’re with them for three days.
0:46:00 We always have to tell them.
0:46:01 We got a ton of footage here.
0:46:05 We talked to so many people, please understand most of you won’t be in the video and those
0:46:09 who are, it’s going to be like three sentences, you know what I mean?
0:46:12 So you know that doctor from the bed bugs episode?
0:46:18 You have like hours and hours of him and he comes down to 30 seconds and just putting
0:46:19 it on your arm.
0:46:20 Yeah.
0:46:24 But what’s great about that though is you just get to pick the best parts, right?
0:46:25 The funniest parts.
0:46:30 And also the other promise I make to everyone in my videos is like everyone comes out looking
0:46:31 amazing.
0:46:33 Like I always want to tell our podcast.
0:46:34 Damn it.
0:46:38 I assumed we had this agreement.
0:46:40 God, how great would that be?
0:46:43 You like cut this for I’m saying like all these terrible things.
0:46:46 Don’t cancel the guy.
0:46:49 First stop is Apple general.
0:46:50 Yeah.
0:46:51 Amazing.
0:46:52 Yeah.
0:46:59 So by doing that and just cherry picking, I can really just make sure everyone sounds
0:47:02 as smart as they really are and sometimes people get nervous.
0:47:03 Yeah.
0:47:04 That’s how I like to make the video.
0:47:06 Oh, it sounds like push comes to shove.
0:47:08 The secret to this is the editing.
0:47:09 It’s not the.
0:47:10 Yeah.
0:47:15 It’s a combination, but yes, it’s the writing and I’d say more editing.
0:47:18 I feel like writing is a better way to phrase it than editing because editing feels like,
0:47:21 oh, you use the right sound effect or the right transition.
0:47:27 But yes, the editing and the writing, I think has a way more profound effect on the channel
0:47:28 success than people realize.
0:47:30 But what do you mean by writing?
0:47:35 Because most people would think writing is the writing the script in advance.
0:47:36 That’s not what you’re saying.
0:47:37 No.
0:47:38 Writing the script after the fact.
0:47:39 Which is what?
0:47:41 How do you write the script after you?
0:47:43 Because I have all the footage in front of me.
0:47:47 I watch it through and then I’m like, oh, okay, this is a good moment.
0:47:50 In the end, we landed here with this thing.
0:47:54 So now I need to pick the clips that support this landing of this thing being, or let’s
0:47:57 say something fails in the end when we film it.
0:48:00 I want to make sure at the beginning of the video to say, look, we’re not sure if this
0:48:05 part’s going to work, but we’re going to give it our best shot to frame it so that when
0:48:09 that does fail, people have the right context for understanding why it failed.
0:48:15 You know, Madison and I are co-authoring a book called Think Remarkable as opposed to
0:48:17 Think Different.
0:48:26 And step one, we had about 200 interviews in the can averaging 20 pages each of transcript.
0:48:27 Wow.
0:48:29 So that’s 200 times 20 is 4,000 pages.
0:48:36 So we read 4,000 pages to write the book after we read.
0:48:38 So in a sense, that was our raw footage.
0:48:39 Yeah, that’s right.
0:48:41 And then we wrote the book afterwards.
0:48:43 And you start picking out themes.
0:48:46 Some people start saying the same things and it starts crystallizing your mind what the
0:48:47 story is, right?
0:48:52 I feel like to me, it’s like, how in the world do you write something before?
0:48:53 That boggles my mind.
0:48:56 And we have brought an editor on this happened literally just yesterday.
0:48:58 They’re just like, I don’t understand.
0:48:59 Where’s the script?
0:49:01 I have this footage, but what am I cutting to?
0:49:05 And my chief creative Addy was like, I know it’s weird.
0:49:06 It’s just how we do it around here.
0:49:07 Just trust me.
0:49:11 Just do this thing because then I look at all the footage and then it’s okay.
0:49:12 This is the story.
0:49:13 This is the script.
0:49:18 I write the full script out and then it goes back to the editors and me to then pick the
0:49:19 shots.
0:49:20 As I’m doing it too.
0:49:21 I’m like, use this shot.
0:49:22 I write this, use this shot.
0:49:24 And I’m like picking the shots as I write it.
0:49:28 What if you write something that you did not record?
0:49:34 I just don’t write that you think of it backwards like I only write what’s recorded.
0:49:39 So if I don’t have a shot and something to support a statement or I go out and shoot
0:49:41 it, I vio all my videos a bunch.
0:49:46 So I have the ability and voiceover to say something and then I can create motion graphics
0:49:47 to make that point.
0:49:52 So I do that a lot where I really want to explain how carbon nanotubes are made.
0:49:54 Cause that’s how we made this tiny nerf gun.
0:49:59 So I’m going to just explain and voiceover and use motion graphics to do this.
0:50:02 But like the intro to my video where it’s like, today we’re going to go out and blah,
0:50:03 blah, blah.
0:50:07 That is absolutely the very last thing I write and film on every video.
0:50:11 The part where I’m introducing what’s going to happen is the very last thing I write because
0:50:15 I know at that point what happened and I can set it up appropriately.
0:50:20 Cause I want this to, this spoonful of sugar to go down as smoothly as possible.
0:50:26 And the more the story has a nice arc and it’s cohesive and real life and chemistry
0:50:30 and physics and science can be messy and you don’t know where it will land.
0:50:36 So I do the cool experiment and make the cool thing, film it all, see where the piece is
0:50:40 landed and then figure out a way to weave a tapestry that goes through each of those
0:50:41 bits.
0:50:44 With your glitter bombs.
0:50:46 Did anybody ever try to retaliate?
0:50:47 They knew where they got the package.
0:50:50 Why don’t they go back to your house?
0:50:53 So yeah, the first year we had them on my porch, after that I never put them on the
0:50:54 actual porch.
0:50:58 We find people across the country who are willing to put them on their porch.
0:51:00 Oh, I thought you use yours.
0:51:01 Yeah.
0:51:06 I mean, year one I did, but after that I realized and even for year one I partially did a package
0:51:10 to actually got from my porch, which was the impetus for doing this.
0:51:15 But yeah, no, after that we’re all across the country and locally here around this area
0:51:19 when we see a spot, a house that we think is good, we’ll knock on the door and be like,
0:51:21 this is a great visibility from the street.
0:51:24 Are you cool if we leave this package on your porch?
0:51:27 And almost 100% of the time they’re like, hell yes.
0:51:32 And then when you show the video of the thief and you don’t blur out his or her face.
0:51:33 Yeah.
0:51:34 You want to know why?
0:51:35 Did they have to sign already?
0:51:36 Yes.
0:51:37 Yes.
0:51:38 And they said, I’m a dumbass.
0:51:41 I will sign a release of me committing a crime.
0:51:42 Yes, guy.
0:51:43 I don’t.
0:51:47 And I don’t, by the way, I don’t say like, and if you sign this, I won’t press charges
0:51:48 because that’s against the law.
0:51:50 That’s like me threatening them or something.
0:51:51 That’s not it at all.
0:51:53 Some people just want to be internet famous guy.
0:51:57 And they just don’t care about their reputation like you think they would.
0:51:59 This is like candid camera except you’re the criminal.
0:52:00 I know.
0:52:01 And they love it.
0:52:06 I wouldn’t say they love it, but like, I mean, arguably we just say it’s for like,
0:52:09 oh, this is just a YouTube video.
0:52:13 And sometimes it’s like you incentivize them with something like a Starbucks gift card,
0:52:15 like not much.
0:52:18 That was a trick Kimmel taught me because it’s like sometimes they need to get people
0:52:23 to sign releases and his producers are like, oh yeah, it doesn’t take much.
0:52:25 But generally, yes, that’s the hard and fast rule.
0:52:29 If the face is blurred, I didn’t get permission or we weren’t able to track them down.
0:52:33 If the face is not blurred, I absolutely have a signed release somewhere where they say
0:52:37 that’s okay because I’m not in the business of ruining someone’s life over one stupid
0:52:38 decision.
0:52:39 Maybe this is the only time they did it.
0:52:41 I’m not here to make that judgment.
0:52:42 That’s not my call.
0:52:45 But if they give consent and say, no, this is totally cool, then it’s great.
0:52:49 I’m going to use it.
0:52:50 Last question.
0:52:51 Okay.
0:52:52 I have to do it the surf board.
0:52:53 Oh yeah.
0:52:54 Okay.
0:52:55 This is a short board obviously.
0:52:56 Yeah, yeah.
0:52:57 So it’s not for nose riding.
0:52:58 Yeah.
0:52:59 Or cross stepping.
0:53:00 Yeah.
0:53:01 Okay.
0:53:02 But I was watching the Wifflewald episode.
0:53:03 Yeah.
0:53:04 Yeah.
0:53:05 And what’s it called?
0:53:06 I want to say Kanda.
0:53:07 Kanda.
0:53:08 Kanda effect.
0:53:09 Yeah.
0:53:10 Yeah.
0:53:14 And basically you’re saying that when fluid goes over a convex edge, it follows it.
0:53:15 Yeah, that’s right.
0:53:16 Yeah.
0:53:22 So I think many people who surf, they think that what’s happening that they can get to
0:53:28 the nose is because the weight of the water on the back of the board is holding the board
0:53:29 now.
0:53:30 Yeah.
0:53:36 But you’re saying that it’s the physics of the effect of the fluid sticking to the
0:53:37 side, right?
0:53:38 Yeah.
0:53:39 Let’s see.
0:53:41 I think if your nose riding on like a long board is your point.
0:53:42 Yes.
0:53:43 Let me just think of this through.
0:53:48 I think though, that’s the opposite effect guy because the Kanda effect specifically,
0:53:49 so like a Frisbee.
0:53:52 Let’s take a Frisbee’s example because this is a good way to visualize it.
0:53:54 Frisbees kind of seem to like float in the air, right?
0:53:55 Which is kind of wild.
0:53:57 Like how do they hover like that?
0:54:02 And it’s the Kanda effect where air is passing over the top and then it curves over the back.
0:54:08 So it’s basically taking this air, throwing a bunch of air downwards like a jet pack,
0:54:12 which then conservation of momentum equal opposite reaction.
0:54:17 It pushes the Frisbee up into the air, keeps the Frisbee into the air by curving air down.
0:54:22 So I think this wouldn’t be the Kwan effect because if what you’re saying is true, water
0:54:25 comes up and goes down, it would have the opposite effect of like pushing the board
0:54:26 up.
0:54:27 Ah.
0:54:32 And the thing is, it’s all a matter of the reason you see that on wiffle balls and Frisbees,
0:54:34 they’re super lightweight.
0:54:38 That’s why it has an outside effect of keeping them in the air.
0:54:42 They’re so lightweight that the equal opposite reaction, you know, pushing air down does
0:54:44 force the Frisbee up.
0:54:47 Even if it was water going down and the Kwan effect is happening, it’s curving over the
0:54:48 edge.
0:54:52 The surfboard weighs so much, that effect is negligible.
0:54:57 So I don’t think it’s the Kwan effect that’s keeping the board in or out of the water in
0:54:58 this case.
0:55:02 Well, I imagine there’s also some element of surface tension.
0:55:05 It’s an interesting, we need to like look at a video.
0:55:07 I don’t want to go outside of my domain here.
0:55:11 There’s always someone out there who knows exactly, but the Kwan effect absolutely is
0:55:12 happening here guy.
0:55:14 It definitely is curving over the surface.
0:55:17 Just like you said, you would have spoon in a flow of water and it curves.
0:55:19 That’s absolutely happening here.
0:55:22 I’m not sure if that explains why you can go to the front of it.
0:55:24 We’d have to like look at some video, but here’s what I love guy.
0:55:26 You know, I love about this.
0:55:28 You watch that video.
0:55:33 You learn something and you took it into your own life and started thinking about it, right?
0:55:37 Like that’s the highest compliment anyone could give me right there.
0:55:39 Like you just made my day.
0:55:40 Right?
0:55:44 You just made my day.
0:55:55 So that’s Mark Rober, Mr. Fart Bombs, Glitter Bombs, Squirrel Olympics, Bed Bugs.
0:55:56 You name it.
0:56:06 Check him out on YouTube, I guarantee that you will learn something and you will be entertained.
0:56:08 I’m Guy Kawasaki.
0:56:11 This is Remarkable People.
0:56:15 We are on a mission to make you remarkable.
0:56:20 And one way we’re doing that is Madison and I have written a book.
0:56:23 It’s called Think Remarkable.
0:56:27 It’s a pun on “think different” in case you’re too young to know.
0:56:29 So check that book out.
0:56:33 It will help you make a difference and be remarkable.
0:56:38 My thanks to the staff of the Remarkable People team.
0:56:45 Jeff C. Shannon Hernandez, Sound Engineer’s Supreme.
0:56:48 And then there’s the Nismar Sisters.
0:56:52 They’re like the Pointer Sisters, only of podcasting.
0:56:58 Tessa, who prepares me and checks all the transcripts.
0:57:00 Believe me, it’s a lot of work.
0:57:08 And Madison, Producer and co-author, not to mention the drop-in queen of Santa Cruz.
0:57:15 And then there’s Luis Magana, Alexis Nishimura, and Fallon Yates.
0:57:23 This is the Remarkable People team, and we are on a mission to make you remarkable.
0:57:35 Until next time, mahalo and aloha.