Tara VanDerveer: Redefining Excellence in Women’s Basketball

0:00:12 I’m Guy Kawasaki and this is Remarkable People.
0:00:19 We’re on a mission to make you remarkable and helping me in this episode is Tara Vanderveer.
0:00:24 Tara recently retired as the head coach of the Stanford University women’s basketball
0:00:25 team.
0:00:28 She led that team for 38 years.
0:00:35 She took over at Stanford in 1985 and quickly built the program into a national powerhouse.
0:00:43 She led Stanford to three NCAA women’s division one basketball championships in 1990, 1992,
0:00:44 and 2021.
0:00:52 She is a 10-time Pac-12 coach of the year and has won over 1200 games in her career.
0:00:59 The most of any coach in college basketball history, men’s or women’s.
0:01:05 Tara also served as the head coach of the 1996 U.S. Olympic women’s basketball team.
0:01:08 That team won a gold medal.
0:01:10 I’m Guy Kawasaki.
0:01:19 This is Remarkable People and now here is the remarkable, most winning Tara Vanderveer.
0:01:22 What happens a day after you retire?
0:01:30 I see my email and phone blew up, letters, I got some amazing, just beautiful letters
0:01:37 from people, probably honestly over a thousand of them and I’m still working on catching
0:01:43 up writing people back, emailing, texting, and then a lot of different opportunities
0:01:51 to do things, whether it’s books, movie, podcasts, speaking.
0:01:56 At first it felt honestly pretty overwhelming, but I’m going to be working part-time in
0:02:02 the athletic department as an advisor to our athletic director and a coach’s coach.
0:02:07 So I think I’m just getting to that groove and basically during the summer I’m going
0:02:11 to be working remotely, but I’m excited about a new role.
0:02:18 I don’t want to cause PTSD, but can you go through the basic seasons of a D1 college
0:02:19 coach?
0:02:24 What happens when you take off or does recruiting start immediately and it’s never ever you’re
0:02:26 off?
0:02:27 It’s the latter.
0:02:30 You are never ever off.
0:02:36 I would say, as an example, our calendar year was, we would come back to Stanford, we would
0:02:40 start with our team September 15th.
0:02:46 So basically the coaches would meet in person around September 1st and just get everything
0:02:51 ready for our players to come back because they’d been in summer school.
0:02:56 And then we would start working out the 15th, we would do a team bonding exercise usually.
0:03:03 We started school maybe a week later and you’re working out, you’re doing some kind of workout
0:03:08 with your team plus recruiting and all kinds of things just starting up the school year
0:03:10 meetings.
0:03:16 And then you have your whole season and you’re also doing recruiting during your season.
0:03:23 And then as soon as your last game ends, you’re again doing recruiting, going to high school
0:03:28 tournaments and basically all spring and then so yesterday was our first day of basketball
0:03:29 camp.
0:03:34 We have basketball camp in the summer, recruiting in the summer.
0:03:37 And even there are two dead weeks where you’re not allowed to recruit.
0:03:39 One is in May and one is in August.
0:03:42 So those are your two vacation times really.
0:03:52 And it’s become really 24/7, 50 weeks of the year.
0:03:56 I saw something in your background that I found so fascinating.
0:03:59 So can you explain your connection to Bobby Knight?
0:04:02 Well, I went to Indiana University.
0:04:08 I transferred there as a sophomore and I took coach Knight’s basketball class, which
0:04:12 he taught the X’s and O’s and philosophy and things like that.
0:04:18 And in his class, he said that anyone that attended his class had permission to watch
0:04:20 their basketball practice.
0:04:25 I don’t think he thought I would come every day, but I did.
0:04:28 And I watched every day of practice for basically three years.
0:04:29 I loved it.
0:04:30 I learned a lot.
0:04:35 I didn’t have any idea that I would be a basketball coach because really growing up, there were
0:04:38 not basketball teams for women to coach.
0:04:44 So I just really enjoyed watching practice and I thought I majored in sociology.
0:04:45 I thought I’d go to law school.
0:04:48 But I just kind of fell into this coaching a little bit backwards.
0:04:54 From the outside looking in at Bobby Knight, all that I picture is him picking up chairs
0:04:58 and throwing them across the court and abusing players and all that.
0:05:01 But what’s the real story of Bobby Knight?
0:05:05 Because my other impression is that people who played for him loved him.
0:05:06 He was great to me.
0:05:12 He was very generous with his time and knowledge and I watched their practices.
0:05:15 There were times where he would raise his voice.
0:05:19 I never saw him throw a chair or do anything crazy.
0:05:24 But I think that the pressure on college coaches, I think he felt that.
0:05:28 And I learned maybe some things, obviously not to do, but my experience with him was
0:05:30 always very positive.
0:05:36 And I’m very thankful to have that opportunity to have been able to watch and I loved watching
0:05:37 Indiana basketball.
0:05:40 It was really a different game than in a way.
0:05:41 There’s no shot clock.
0:05:43 There was no three point line.
0:05:47 The rules have changed so much that the game is really different.
0:05:50 But I learned a lot and I loved it.
0:05:55 Can you trace any of your coaching philosophy to his coaching philosophies?
0:06:02 I would say that yes, I can, not in temperament as much as he ran a very organized, quick
0:06:08 practice and the use of your time in practice, how you go from one drill to the next, why
0:06:15 you teach certain things, the order that you teach them in, the importance of fundamentals.
0:06:21 I learned a lot and I would just say there’s no one that has had more of an impact on my
0:06:24 basketball coaching than Coach Knight.
0:06:28 How would Indiana players practice free throws?
0:06:34 Usually what they did, they would do a drill where you’re really going hard, you’re playing
0:06:36 and then you would break for free throws.
0:06:40 And then you would do another drill and then you would break so that your free throws was
0:06:45 your water break and your chance to shoot free throws while you were tired.
0:06:50 And we would pretty much shoot free throws the same way in our practice where you would
0:06:53 go hard, you’d be scrimmaging, you’re going up and down the court and then you take a
0:06:57 break and you’re going to make 10 free throws at a basket and you’re scrimmaging again or
0:07:01 you’re doing a really tough running drill so that when you’re shooting your free throws
0:07:03 you’re tired.
0:07:07 Just the logistics of that, so you’re scrimmage and then you have obviously players on the
0:07:09 court at Maples.
0:07:13 How many baskets are there for people to be shooting free throws after a scrimmage?
0:07:15 There’s eight baskets.
0:07:21 During practice usually there’s two main baskets and then you’ve got six on either side and
0:07:22 that’s pretty much true.
0:07:27 I would say most practice courts, the arena will have your main baskets and then actually
0:07:31 in the old days, Maples, the baskets would swing down so you’d always have eight baskets
0:07:35 to practice on which I loved because we would do a lot of shooting drills where you would
0:07:41 divide up, you would go with a partner and maybe a manager and do shooting with a partner
0:07:49 for five minutes and then come back and do another full court drill.
0:07:54 So you explained the influence of Bobby Knight but how would you describe the core of your
0:07:55 coaching philosophy?
0:08:00 Maybe that started with my parents, both of my parents are teachers and I view coaching
0:08:03 as maybe 40 public exams.
0:08:08 You’re coaching and teaching and you’re a mentor for young women and it’s more than
0:08:13 just teaching X’s and O’s but it’s getting to know them as people.
0:08:21 It’s really trying to help them navigate college and a competitive environment and it’s very
0:08:22 challenging.
0:08:28 I noticed that it took you about three years to blossom at Stanford and do you explain
0:08:33 that as finally after three years it’s the players that you recruited or finally they
0:08:36 got the system or what took three years?
0:08:40 Like I said the first year for the most part if you’re hired as a coach the team is not
0:08:46 very good because the coach in front of me at Stanford was fired.
0:08:51 So they’d won five games the year before and it was a team that was really struggling.
0:08:57 So we did, my assistant coaches and myself, we worked very hard and so the first year you
0:09:02 don’t have any of your own players and the second year your players are freshmen and
0:09:07 so in the third year then we really had a great breakout season and went to the NCAA
0:09:10 tournament and then we got to going right away.
0:09:16 And how do you recruit as a first year coach when you’re five and twenty or whatever it
0:09:17 was?
0:09:23 I had coached at Ohio State and had success at Ohio State and had success at Idaho.
0:09:25 So we knew the type of players that we needed.
0:09:30 I had great assistant coaches who were excellent at evaluating players and for Stanford it’s
0:09:34 not just they have to be great players but they have to be great students.
0:09:40 The Dean of Admissions explained to me that Tara the students that you recruit for basketball
0:09:46 need to be able to jump through the same academic hoops as other admits and so I think coaching
0:09:51 at Stanford is the ultimate challenge and it’s even become more challenging with the
0:09:55 portal and collective money and NIL.
0:10:00 So do you think that the portal is improving the game or it’s giving players options or
0:10:04 it’s ruining the game because it’s giving players options?
0:10:09 I think that players should have the opportunity to play where they want to play and the portal
0:10:15 basically allows them to transfer and I think that transferring I would hope it would be
0:10:20 after the season but sometimes what’s happening is if someone has a bad day they just get
0:10:25 mad and then they’re like I’m out of here which I think in some ways is hurting both
0:10:32 teams and players when they’re not developing the resilience and the competitiveness that
0:10:37 would help them later on but I think that I mean I transferred as a freshman I realized
0:10:41 I was not in a place I wanted and I transferred and got to play right away.
0:10:47 The challenge now is not just the portal but the combination of collective money which
0:10:54 is boosters at a certain school will then call players and poach top players off of
0:11:01 really good teams with very high incentive money to go to different places.
0:11:04 And that’s all legal and okay?
0:11:07 It is right now yes.
0:11:13 But wouldn’t a school like Stanford with your history and it’s infinitely wealthy alumni
0:11:17 wouldn’t you benefit from the portal and that collective thing?
0:11:21 I would not say that Stanford has benefited from the portal.
0:11:29 First of all the portal has, again I think the NIL is a great thing for college students,
0:11:35 the combination of the collective and the portal is not beneficial to Stanford.
0:11:41 There are players that are great players at Stanford that are being recruited and poached
0:11:47 by other schools at the direction of their coach which to me is it’s quote legal but
0:11:52 it’s not really legal because the coaches are not supposed to be involved but they are.
0:11:57 And I think it’s something that the teams are becoming stacked which that’s interesting
0:11:58 too.
0:12:05 But the money is just I don’t know I think it’s unsustainable and we do have very wealthy
0:12:11 alums at Stanford that give money to libraries and laboratories and like the door school
0:12:18 of sustainability and just handing over a million dollars or two million dollars to
0:12:23 a basketball player doesn’t seem rational but that’s what’s happening.
0:12:30 Okay you mentioned the word recruiting four or five times already so what exactly do you
0:12:32 look for in a recruit?
0:12:37 For someone at Stanford they have to have the academic background so they’ll be accepted
0:12:40 so that will be something really important.
0:12:44 If I see someone if I’m out recruiting that will be the first thing I want to know is
0:12:47 I want to see their high school transcript.
0:12:49 Are they in AP classes?
0:12:53 What are their SAT scores, ACT scores?
0:12:55 So that’s coming back in.
0:13:00 Then once if in fact they’re in the ballpark then are they skilled at basketball?
0:13:02 Do they shoot the ball well?
0:13:03 Are they athletic?
0:13:04 Do they run the floor well?
0:13:05 What is their strength?
0:13:09 How would they fit in with the players that are already on our team?
0:13:11 And then you just go from there.
0:13:17 If you can check those boxes then a lot of times if they’re interested academically then
0:13:19 you have a really good chance of getting them.
0:13:25 Now it’s a combination of are they interested academically and do you have collective money?
0:13:31 Some of the top upcoming juniors and seniors in high school and women’s basketball are
0:13:38 asking for $100,000, $200,000, $300,000, $400,000 per year guaranteed.
0:13:40 Those words pass through their lips.
0:13:43 They literally ask for the money.
0:13:44 Yes.
0:13:48 No, they just say this is what it will cost for you to recruit me.
0:13:53 I’m interested but that’s what is happening now, yes.
0:13:58 I guess I could build a case that’s good because basketball programs make money off the players
0:14:03 but there’s a part of me that says, “Wow, that just sounds like total commercialization
0:14:04 of a sport.”
0:14:07 It’s a whole new world, a whole new landscape.
0:14:12 I don’t know yet that there are very many women’s basketball programs that do make a
0:14:13 lot of money.
0:14:18 The money for the most part in college athletics is in football.
0:14:26 I would say 85% to 90% of all the money that comes in is because of football and for some
0:14:33 of the top football quarterbacks, especially the marquee type players, their price tag
0:14:37 is maybe $1,000,000 to $3,000,000 per year.
0:14:44 I think that that’s where the NCAA, we’re hoping that in some way there’s some regulation
0:14:50 of this so that it’s not just crazy wild west giving cash money in McDonald’s paper bag
0:14:52 because that’s what’s happening.
0:14:54 It’s really out there right now.
0:14:55 Wow.
0:15:00 Obviously, you’ve coached many winners and with your hindsight, can you sort of break
0:15:01 it down?
0:15:02 Is it talent?
0:15:03 Is it attitude?
0:15:04 Is it luck?
0:15:05 What makes a winner?
0:15:13 I think individually, like you said, I have coached some amazing players, including 12 Olympians,
0:15:18 but the great players that I’ve coached at Stanford or Ohio State, I would say in the
0:15:21 very best players, it starts with discipline.
0:15:24 They really see the end game.
0:15:28 They’re not trying to be an amazing player in one day because that’s not going to happen.
0:15:31 Basketball is like a steel-cut oatmeal.
0:15:32 You’ve got to cook it.
0:15:33 It’s not instant oatmeal.
0:15:36 Being a great student, you’re not going to do it in one day.
0:15:42 The people that are great athletes, they enjoy the process of getting better and they buy
0:15:43 into improving.
0:15:45 They’re very coachable.
0:15:50 They want to hear how can I get better and they really enjoy coming to the gym.
0:15:52 They put in extra time.
0:15:55 They’re people that are really fun to work with.
0:15:57 The very best players are your hardest workers.
0:15:59 They’re great teammates.
0:16:04 Some of the best players I’ve coached, honestly, I just cry when they graduate.
0:16:05 It’s awful.
0:16:07 But they’re great teammates.
0:16:08 They’re leaders.
0:16:11 They’re disciplined, hard-working.
0:16:15 And they just really want to be great and they’ll put in the time and make the effort.
0:16:17 They’re not going to just talk about it.
0:16:21 They’re going to — I call it the — like, some people want the sweatshirt without sweating,
0:16:24 but the great players want to sweat.
0:16:30 And you can determine this in recruiting and scouting when there are sophomores and juniors?
0:16:31 No.
0:16:32 You hope to.
0:16:36 You talk to their coaches, your high school coaches.
0:16:41 And what’s amazing is, whether it’s sometimes they’re high school coaches or sometimes like
0:16:45 their parents, they’re like, “My daughter’s the hardest worker ever.
0:16:50 That’s a red light for me,” you know, because people aren’t always realistic.
0:16:56 And they don’t understand the commitment involved in a great college player.
0:17:01 College athletics, whether you’re a football, men’s or women’s basketball, if you’re a great
0:17:08 basketball player, like when I said we started September 15th, you’re in the gym.
0:17:11 You’re committed at least five hours a day.
0:17:12 Everyone is.
0:17:13 You’re coming to practice.
0:17:15 You’re going to the training room.
0:17:16 You’re going to watch film.
0:17:22 But you’re allowed, quote, “20 hours a week,” but that’s just the time you’re on the court.
0:17:25 So you’re on the court for 20 hours.
0:17:30 And honestly, another 10 hours a week, you’re getting treatment.
0:17:32 You’re maybe in the weight room.
0:17:37 You’re in the gym extra getting shot up, working on your skill to get better.
0:17:42 And there’s some huge motivation for some of these pro basketball players.
0:17:43 And now for women, too.
0:17:44 They’re very motivated.
0:17:48 And at Stanford, they’re also carrying an academic load.
0:17:49 They are.
0:17:52 And some of our players have graduated early.
0:17:58 We had a set of twins, Lexie and Lacey Hull, who are fabulous, fabulous basketball players
0:18:05 and equally fabulous students competing with each other in engineering, which they got
0:18:10 their master’s degree in four years, during COVID also.
0:18:13 Like, three, eight, nine, three, nine, nine.
0:18:15 It was just incredible grade points.
0:18:22 I had a professor say to us, “Coaches, I’ve learned more from Lacey than she’s learned
0:18:23 from me.”
0:18:27 They’re just, they’re amazing athletes and students.
0:18:29 And we’ve had a number of those.
0:18:30 That’s the extreme.
0:18:33 They’re just fabulous, but others are equally good.
0:18:34 And where are they now?
0:18:37 Lexie is playing professionally in Indiana.
0:18:39 She’s in the WNBA.
0:18:44 And Lacey is in corporate America, living in Austin, Texas.
0:18:47 Can we switch gears now to Olympic basketball?
0:18:48 Because you’ve been a coach.
0:18:51 You’ve already coached players who played in the Olympics.
0:18:52 So how does that different?
0:18:55 I mean, how does that even work?
0:18:58 For me, it worked differently than anyone else.
0:19:05 In 1992, the USA men’s team was the dream team and won a gold medal easily.
0:19:10 The women’s team did not win a gold medal, got a bronze medal.
0:19:15 And the 1996 Olympics were in Atlanta, the next quadrennial.
0:19:19 And USA basketball basically said, “Hey, we want to win a gold.
0:19:26 So we’re going to put in a year-long training and we’re going to ask a coach to leave their
0:19:30 job for a year and train our team to win a gold medal.”
0:19:38 So I was the coach in the ’96 quadrennial, which I left Stanford for a year, and we
0:19:45 trained and traveled all over the world and played a total of 52 games before the Olympics.
0:19:47 So we traveled over 100,000 miles.
0:19:52 We went to Russia, we went to Australia, we went to China.
0:19:54 We played in tournaments.
0:19:58 We played college teams all over, barnstormed college teams.
0:20:04 And then in August of 1996, we played in Atlanta and won the gold medal.
0:20:10 And so those, the members of that team, they basically took a year off academically to
0:20:11 them.
0:20:12 No, they were professional.
0:20:13 They were paid.
0:20:14 Oh, excuse me.
0:20:15 Okay.
0:20:16 They took a pay cut.
0:20:19 They took a pay cut to play for USA basketball.
0:20:23 Some of them earned 200, 250.
0:20:31 Now again, this is over 25 years ago, and USA basketball paid them $50,000 to take a year
0:20:37 off and not play in Europe, not play in Italy or Russia, where they were paid over 200,000
0:20:42 because there was no professional women’s basketball in the United States before the
0:20:44 1996 team.
0:20:49 And when USA basketball is involved in this, are you picking your team or are they handing
0:20:52 you the players and saying, “Terra, take it from here?
0:20:54 How does that work?”
0:20:55 They picked the team.
0:20:56 I did not.
0:20:58 You don’t have any say in it.
0:21:01 I might say something, but I had no vote.
0:21:02 Wow.
0:21:03 And is that true today?
0:21:04 Yes.
0:21:06 I think it is pretty true today.
0:21:09 And who is USA basketball that picks this?
0:21:10 How do they do it?
0:21:12 They have a committee.
0:21:18 So this year’s committee is someone like Don Staley, who was a former coach, Bethany
0:21:23 Donovan, who is a Stanford basketball player, but she works for the WNBA.
0:21:26 The head of the, it used to be Carol Cowan, who I worked with.
0:21:29 They have a USA basketball representative.
0:21:33 Simone Augustus is a former USA basketball Olympian.
0:21:36 And I think there’s a couple other people, and I can’t remember right off the top of
0:21:37 my head who’s on the committee.
0:21:38 Okay.
0:21:41 So now I’m an outsider and I just don’t understand.
0:21:46 So I read all this controversy, Caitlin Clark is not on the Olympic team.
0:21:47 She should be.
0:21:48 She shouldn’t be.
0:21:49 What does that work?
0:21:54 The Olympic team is not necessarily picked the Olympic year.
0:21:59 The team trains together and works and plays games four years leading up.
0:22:06 So it is an interesting positive dilemma, I think, with the Caitlin Clark controversy,
0:22:14 because she has, through her college record setting, great career that she had at Iowa,
0:22:19 she is really, for a lot of people, the face of women’s basketball.
0:22:23 And so it’s hard to understand how come she’s not on this team.
0:22:28 The problem is other people have put in a lot of time and they’re really good professional
0:22:31 players and people don’t know about them.
0:22:34 I think that there is an argument that she should be on the team.
0:22:38 She is good enough, but it’s what I call musical chairs.
0:22:43 There are probably, oh, 50 players that are good enough to play on the Olympic team, but
0:22:45 only 12 chairs.
0:22:47 And she’s one of the people that is good enough.
0:22:54 The controversy, I think, much more than Caitlin Clark was when Neko Ogumake was left off.
0:23:01 And so Neko Ogumake played for four years, was hurt in the spring before the Olympics,
0:23:04 and she was left off, but she was healthy by the Olympics.
0:23:07 And so to me, that was much more of a controversy.
0:23:12 But people don’t know the name Neko Ogumake, the household name that Caitlin Clark is.
0:23:17 I think that there is merit to the argument that Caitlin Clark would bring great attention
0:23:20 to the women’s basketball team and the Olympics.
0:23:26 So that would be a reason to include her on that team.
0:23:32 And for the marketing and promotion of women’s basketball, for one person when, you know,
0:23:37 who’s your 12th player on the team, maybe why not have Caitlin Clark, who would bring
0:23:40 such a great notoriety.
0:23:45 I think the first question at the press conference when the USA team goes to Paris will be why
0:23:47 isn’t Caitlin Clark on the team?
0:23:53 So she will generate a lot of enthusiasm, but she won’t be there right now.
0:23:57 And what do you think USA Basketball is going to say when they’re asked that question?
0:24:01 I think what they’ve said is basically there’s players that have more experience.
0:24:07 And in some ways, I think that USA Basketball has hurt itself not having younger players,
0:24:11 not developing younger players for those big moments.
0:24:19 The Olympic team that I coached in ’96, we had, for the most part, I would say 10 new
0:24:25 players as opposed to this year’s team, maybe has five or six new players.
0:24:27 I’d have to look at the numbers exactly.
0:24:33 But I think it’s good to have young, enthusiastic, and to teach them the way it is, to understand
0:24:37 the pressure of playing with USA on your jersey.
0:24:42 And what motivates someone like you who’s so successful at Stanford to take a year off
0:24:43 to do this?
0:24:45 Is it just patriotic duty?
0:24:47 You know, I think it was just another challenge.
0:24:52 And I had coached the younger teams coming up and I was ready to do it.
0:24:55 I’ve been prepared and groomed to do it.
0:24:56 And then it was different.
0:24:59 It was hard to leave Stanford for a year.
0:25:03 I think our program suffered at Stanford.
0:25:04 Not the year I was gone.
0:25:06 My assistant coach did a fabulous job.
0:25:11 It has the winningest percentage at Stanford and was awesome, but our recruiting suffered
0:25:13 after that.
0:25:17 And it’s when you go what you take a year off, basically it really takes time to get
0:25:19 it back on again.
0:25:20 And it did.
0:25:24 When you walk into the athletic defectors office and say, “I want to take a year off
0:25:28 to coach Olympic basketball,” does the AD say, “Oh, hello, you tire us.
0:25:31 Such a great opportunity, absolutely.”
0:25:32 There was probably mixed.
0:25:38 They worked with USA Basketball and it worked out, but I had to resign, basically.
0:25:51 I’ve, quote, “retired” twice.
0:25:58 So now looking forward at women’s basketball, Kaitlyn Clark and this rivalry and stuff.
0:26:02 Is it just a great time for women’s basketball?
0:26:05 I think it is a great time for women’s basketball.
0:26:09 But then I’ve thought it’s always been a great time for women’s basketball.
0:26:15 Since the Olympics in 1996 and 1997, two, basically pro leagues were established.
0:26:20 The ABL, which since has folded, but the WNBA.
0:26:25 And in the Bay Area, now we’re going to have a pro team in San Francisco that Joe Lakeup
0:26:28 is the owner of the Warriors and the Valkyries.
0:26:29 It’s very exciting.
0:26:33 I think it’s a great time for women’s basketball.
0:26:35 The television ratings are way up.
0:26:39 For the first time ever in history, the women’s television rating was higher than the men’s
0:26:42 television rating for the NCAA basketball tournament.
0:26:47 And I think that’s a lot to do with Kaitlyn Clark and they call it Clarkonomics.
0:26:54 She has impacted television ratings, selling of gear, the sell out crowds, but then exposing
0:26:56 more people to women’s basketball.
0:26:59 I think it’s a really, really good thing.
0:27:01 Did you try to recruit her?
0:27:02 I saw her play.
0:27:06 She’s a great high school player, but again, I think she was pretty much set on saying
0:27:09 in the East Coast or Midwest.
0:27:14 And this may be an insensitive question and you can punt on it, but do you think if she
0:27:17 were black, it would be the same phenomena?
0:27:18 I would hope so.
0:27:20 There are some great young players.
0:27:25 Juju Watkins is a superstar coming up and might break Kaitlyn Clark’s record.
0:27:29 I would like to think that we live in a world that appreciates excellence, no matter their
0:27:31 gender or color.
0:27:33 I’m realistic.
0:27:39 The fact that she is white and she’s from Iowa, I think she did generate a lot of enthusiasm
0:27:46 for women’s basketball, but I think there are other players out there who are getting
0:27:51 known and followed in a similar way that Kaitlyn is.
0:27:56 That level of basketball, men’s or women’s, is the difference between Kaitlyn Clark and
0:27:59 someone who’s beneath Kaitlyn Clark and standing and all that.
0:28:06 Is it just like an infestimally small difference or is it head and shoulders above everybody?
0:28:13 She’s a superstar college player in the same way that Kelsey Plum who graduated from Washington
0:28:17 and that’s the record that Kaitlyn broke, Kaitlyn Clark.
0:28:22 These are extraordinarily talented players.
0:28:27 There is a big difference between the extraordinarily talented players, the Olympians, the NBA All
0:28:28 Stars.
0:28:34 There is a difference in the same way that Michael Jordan or LeBron James or Steph Curry
0:28:40 is a phenom and Kaitlyn Clark is a phenom in her own way too.
0:28:45 I would say this guy, I would just say this about Kaitlyn Clark, what’s so amazing about
0:28:50 her is not her three-point shot, her passing is phenomenal, her three-point shooting from
0:28:52 the logo is incredible.
0:28:58 Her maturity, she deals with pressure, the pressure on her, she just acts like it’s water
0:29:00 and rolls off her back.
0:29:03 She does have ice water in her veins.
0:29:10 She handles this so well, the incredible media frenzy about her and I’ve met her, I had dinner
0:29:12 with her and her parents at an event.
0:29:19 It’s not to say a 22-year-old doesn’t have their moments, she does, but she is an absolute
0:29:25 phenom and I very much respect and admire what she’s doing.
0:29:32 Okay, now maybe my last question is, suppose that you are a freshman or a sophomore, maybe
0:29:37 even middle school girl listening to this and you want to be the next Kaitlyn Clark,
0:29:39 what can I learn from Tara?
0:29:42 So what’s your message to that girl?
0:29:46 I think for a young girl or a young boy, there are a lot of boys wearing the Kaitlyn
0:29:52 Clark jerseys too, be passionate, you’re not going to be great at something that you
0:29:54 don’t really love.
0:29:59 I’m a big Katie Ledecky fan, she loves to train, you have to love what you’re doing,
0:30:05 you have to be very passionate about it, so whatever it is, you’re going to put your time
0:30:09 into it, enjoy it, enjoy the process of getting better.
0:30:14 Be a great teammate, I think that basketball is a team sport and I think the things you
0:30:20 learn as a teammate will help you be a better member of your family, be a better student
0:30:27 and school, but being a great teammate, being disciplined, being hard working, having goals
0:30:33 and really working hard to achieve those goals, but enjoying the process, enjoy the journey,
0:30:36 don’t just think, I want to be this great player and it’s going to happen overnight
0:30:38 because it’s not.
0:30:44 And if you have this kind of aspiration, should you as an athlete be like 100% focused
0:30:48 on basketball, basketball 12 months a year or should you play soccer and should you play
0:30:53 other things to get cross training and exposure to other skills?
0:30:57 Well, I think that’s a great question, I think it depends on maybe your age.
0:31:03 As a middle school, I would definitely play three sports or four sports and high school
0:31:04 the same.
0:31:09 I think that sometimes limiting what you’re doing and parents feeling well, they’ve just
0:31:14 got to make a decision when they’re 10 years old what sport you’re going to play.
0:31:19 There are some great young players like Tiger Woods, I know, just love golf so much and
0:31:24 he focused on golf, but I think that until you really know that, I would cross train
0:31:30 it because sometimes we’re having young people have a lot of injuries based on the fact
0:31:36 that maybe they’re overuse injuries, they’re doing too much of the same repetition, motion
0:31:37 over and over.
0:31:41 So your knees or your shoulders, whatever body parts can’t take it.
0:31:47 There are occasional person that says, boy, I want to be this great, whether it’s volleyball
0:31:52 player or softball player, but I would, for the most part, I would say enjoy different
0:31:54 sports.
0:32:00 And what’s your advice to parents who believe they have the next Caitlyn Clarke?
0:32:02 I think parents need to get out of the way.
0:32:08 I think parents need to live their own life, facilitate their children, but not live through
0:32:09 their children.
0:32:15 What I see are some parents that are so crazy about their kids success that the kids are
0:32:17 not even enjoying it.
0:32:22 They’re trying to please their parents and as says a parent, help your young daughter
0:32:29 or young son enjoy whether it’s basketball, help them maybe put up a hoop in your backyard
0:32:34 or get some lights on it so they can shoot at night or let them go to basketball camp.
0:32:40 But it has to come from within the child, not the parent wanting the child to be a great
0:32:41 basketball player.
0:32:47 It has to be their goal and their aspiration, not the parents.
0:32:52 And also parents not pressuring children to go practice and go do this.
0:32:56 They’re not going to love it if they’re being told what to do.
0:33:01 And while you were at Ohio State and Stanford, did you ever have parents email you or call
0:33:04 you and say, “My kid needs more playing time.
0:33:06 She’s better than XYZ.”
0:33:11 You know, usually guy, they didn’t call me, but they would say that to my assistant coaches.
0:33:17 And parents, they would say some crazy things, but we pretty much established a rule with
0:33:23 the players on our team and said, “Look, if your parent calls me, I’m going to tell you
0:33:28 that your parent called me and I’m happy to meet with you and your parent, but I will
0:33:33 not meet with just you or just your parent if it’s to do with something with your parent.”
0:33:37 But I will tell you this, one time I did have a parent leave a message.
0:33:41 This goes back because of, you know, your answering machines, right?
0:33:46 I had apparently to leave a message that was thinking that he knew more about what his
0:33:47 child should do.
0:33:53 And then the next message on my answering machine was the student.
0:33:55 And she said, “Tara, I’d like to meet with you.”
0:33:58 And she said to me, “I play for you.
0:34:04 Please ignore what my parent says and tell me what I need to work on so that I can play
0:34:07 more and I respect your decision.”
0:34:14 It was a mature child and I think a parent that did apologize but was just caught up
0:34:18 in the fact that they were at a game and someone else came in and helped us win the game and
0:34:19 they didn’t.
0:34:24 But parents are not realistic and sometimes that is challenging.
0:34:28 So any last thoughts, what’s the future hold for you?
0:34:31 You know, you’re a young 70, I’m an old 70.
0:34:33 So what’s next?
0:34:38 I did retire from coaching but I am, I call it rewired, not retired.
0:34:44 I’m working in the athletic department at Stanford as an advisor to our athletic director
0:34:49 and I think that the years that I’ve had at Stanford and with coaching, I’m available
0:34:55 to other coaches as a coaches coach and I’ve probably talked to 12 or 15 coaches.
0:34:59 They’ll call me, they’ll text me, I have a question and I just try to listen and try
0:35:00 to help them.
0:35:07 And then I’m spending more time just with my mom as you said and I water ski when my
0:35:12 boat’s in the shop today and I’m mad about it but I water ski, I went sailing yesterday.
0:35:19 I’m reading a lot of good books and I’m really, really taking time to invest in my family
0:35:24 and friends more so than maybe I would when I was coaching but really living a good great
0:35:25 life.
0:35:26 Okay.
0:35:27 Okay.
0:35:30 I promise you this is the last question.
0:35:31 I promise you.
0:35:37 So now put your modesty aside and take it as a given that you are a remarkable person.
0:35:39 Now just answer this question.
0:35:46 So with your hindsight and with your analysis, what do you think enabled you to be remarkable?
0:35:48 You say I’m remarkable.
0:35:51 I don’t get up and look in the mirror and say, wow, I’m remarkable.
0:35:58 I think that I really try to enjoy each day and I really enjoy people so I like to meet
0:35:59 people.
0:36:00 I talk to them.
0:36:01 I like to understand.
0:36:05 Kind of what makes them tick and as a coach, I think I took piano lessons and I thought
0:36:08 I could teach myself and that didn’t work.
0:36:12 So I got a great teacher and I was making CDs and people are like, wow, you’re making
0:36:13 these great CDs.
0:36:14 I said I have a great teacher.
0:36:19 So as a coach, I want to help players get to a place they can’t get to by themselves
0:36:23 and I enjoy that process of improving.
0:36:25 I love to see our teams improve.
0:36:29 I don’t enjoy winning as much as I hate losing.
0:36:34 Losing is extremely painful to me and so I just want to get back at it and do better
0:36:35 the next time.
0:36:37 I think I’m determined.
0:36:43 I’m confident in my own ability but I think more than anything as far as coaching, I enjoy
0:36:45 being in the gym with the players.
0:36:46 I have a great staff.
0:36:48 I love to sit and laugh with them.
0:36:51 We have a lot of fun and I just feel very fortunate.
0:36:53 At the pinch myself, I’m like, this is my life.
0:36:57 I look up and I see, wow, we won all those championships.
0:36:58 Wow, how do we do that?
0:37:00 And I just have fun with it.
0:37:04 I really try to just really enjoy and I’m very fortunate.
0:37:08 I just have a lot of friends that help me.
0:37:14 I hope you learned a few things about how Tara Vander Veer achieves such a remarkable
0:37:15 record.
0:37:20 Remember, she is the most winning coach in college basketball history.
0:37:22 I’m Guy Kawasaki.
0:37:27 This is Remarkable People, my thanks to Kelly Battles.
0:37:31 Without Kelly Battles, this interview would not have happened.
0:37:34 And then there’s the Remarkable People team.
0:37:38 They are Jeff See and Shannon Hernandez.
0:37:40 They are the forwards on our team.
0:37:44 And then there is Madison Neismar, she’s the point guard.
0:37:47 And the shooting guard is Tessa Neismar.
0:37:49 Now who’s the center?
0:37:51 Maybe I’m the center.
0:37:58 Don’t forget the other players, they are Luis Magana, Fallon Yates, and Alexis Nishimura.
0:38:00 We are the Remarkable People team.
0:38:07 We may not have won an NCAA championship or Olympic medal, but we are trying our best
0:38:09 to help you be remarkable.
0:38:16 Until next time, Mahalo and Aloha.
0:38:18 This is Remarkable People.