YAPClassic: Tori Dunlap, How to Fix Your Money Mindset and Unlock Financial Freedom

0:00:03 Today’s episode of YAP is sponsored in part by Shopify,
0:00:05 Found, and Airbnb.
0:00:07 Shopify is the global commerce platform
0:00:09 that helps you grow your business.
0:00:12 Sign up for a $1 per month trial period
0:00:14 at Shopify.com/profitink.
0:00:17 Found gives you banking, invoicing, and bookkeeping
0:00:21 all in one place and was created for busy entrepreneurs.
0:00:25 Try Found for free at found.com/profitink.
0:00:28 Hosting on Airbnb has never been easier
0:00:30 with Airbnb’s new co-host network.
0:00:34 Find yourself a co-host at Airbnb.com/host.
0:00:36 As always, you can find all of our incredible deals
0:00:40 in the show notes or at youngandprofiting.com/deals.
0:00:53 Welcome back, Young and Profiters.
0:00:56 Today on YAP Classic, we’re showcasing an interview
0:01:00 I did about a year ago with the remarkable Tori Dunlap.
0:01:04 After graduating college in 2016, 22-year-old Tori
0:01:06 started an entry-level job in corporate marketing,
0:01:09 but she set herself a goal on the side
0:01:13 to figure out a way to make $100,000 by the age of 25.
0:01:14 And sure enough, three years later,
0:01:16 she met her goal and quit her job.
0:01:20 In doing so, she realized how money and personal finance
0:01:22 are tools you can use to shape your life
0:01:24 into something that you love.
0:01:27 Today, Tori is an internationally-recognized
0:01:30 money and career expert, seven-figure entrepreneur,
0:01:33 TikTok and Instagram mega influencer,
0:01:35 best-selling author, and top podcast host
0:01:38 of the Financial Feminist podcast.
0:01:40 Which, by the way, is in my podcast network,
0:01:42 the number one business and self-improvement
0:01:45 podcast network, YAP Media.
0:01:48 And in this conversation from episode 245,
0:01:49 Tori does not disappoint.
0:01:52 She tells us how we can all get better at navigating
0:01:55 the emotional and psychological sides of money.
0:01:57 She also shared some awesome wealth-building tips,
0:01:59 including why you need to open up
0:02:02 your own high-yield savings account right now.
0:02:04 So I think it’s about time for you to reconsider
0:02:07 your relationship with money and what it means to your life.
0:02:09 It’s time for Tori Dunlap.
0:02:16 So Tori, you’re a Forbes 30 under 30 honoree
0:02:18 and recognized as a top financial expert,
0:02:20 especially for women and millennials.
0:02:23 And after doing some research on your background,
0:02:24 I discovered that you’ve always been really good
0:02:25 with your money.
0:02:28 So curious to understand what were your influences
0:02:31 growing up around money, and how did that shape
0:02:34 your mindset and attitude towards the topic?
0:02:37 – I grew up with parents who educated me about money,
0:02:39 and I thought that was the case for everybody.
0:02:40 I thought, okay, everybody knows
0:02:41 not to overspend on credit cards.
0:02:42 Everybody knows how to save.
0:02:46 Everybody knows how to manage money responsibly.
0:02:49 And as I got older, graduated high school,
0:02:51 went into college and started having
0:02:52 more conversations with people,
0:02:54 I realized, of course, that wasn’t the case,
0:02:58 and especially not the case for most people
0:03:00 that I was talking to in my generation,
0:03:01 and specifically women.
0:03:03 So I was the friend all of my friends
0:03:06 were coming to for advice and guidance around money.
0:03:07 It shocks a lot of people to hear
0:03:08 and may shock your audience to hear.
0:03:09 I did not study finance.
0:03:11 I technically didn’t even study business.
0:03:14 I studied marketing and theater in college,
0:03:15 but Donald Trump got elected.
0:03:18 So I graduated college in May of 2016,
0:03:20 was trying to figure out the kind of person
0:03:22 and the woman I wanted to be in this world.
0:03:25 And five months later, the election happens,
0:03:29 and I’m coming into adulthood and really into womanhood
0:03:30 in a very different country than I think
0:03:31 a lot of us expected.
0:03:34 So I’m trying to figure out, how do I want to show up?
0:03:34 What do I care about?
0:03:36 What do I want my life to look like?
0:03:39 And when you’re the friend,
0:03:40 all of your friends were coming to for advice,
0:03:42 and when you’re also starting to see
0:03:45 that your own financial background
0:03:48 is the reason you’re able to have flexibility
0:03:51 you’re able to quit the job that feels toxic
0:03:54 and find a better option for you.
0:03:55 You’re able to travel,
0:03:57 you’re able to donate to causes you believe in.
0:03:58 You start to realize,
0:04:01 “Oh, maybe money is my form of protest in this world.
0:04:04 Maybe money is the tool and the resource I need
0:04:06 to not only build the life that I love,
0:04:10 but also to start shaping a world that I want to see.”
0:04:15 And so I really became just so on fire
0:04:16 about personal finance,
0:04:19 but specifically again, using money as a tool
0:04:22 to shape your life into something that you love
0:04:25 and to start shaping communities around you.
0:04:29 So my work started as a side hustle, her first 100K,
0:04:32 this now global multi-million dollar business
0:04:34 with employees and a podcast and a book
0:04:35 was the thing I was doing
0:04:37 on the side of my nine to five in marketing.
0:04:40 And as I was growing my own confidence as a leader
0:04:43 and as someone who was learning how to connect with people
0:04:46 and educate them step by step about how to build wealth,
0:04:48 I was also seeing in my own life,
0:04:50 “Oh, when I have money, I have options.”
0:04:52 And so the rest is just crazy now.
0:04:56 I took it full time after saving $100,000 at age 25,
0:04:58 which was the origin story of her first 100K.
0:05:01 I was on Good Morning America, quit my job three weeks later,
0:05:04 and now we have three million people who were shaping
0:05:06 and teaching them how to pay off debt
0:05:08 and save money and start investing.
0:05:09 – I love your story.
0:05:11 And we have so many similarities.
0:05:15 I also started Yap and Yap Media as a side hustle.
0:05:16 And so from my understanding,
0:05:20 the first thing you started was a blog, is that right?
0:05:23 – Yeah, so it was a blog in late 2016.
0:05:26 That kind of era, like mid-2010s,
0:05:28 was like the Tumblr blog era,
0:05:30 if you can think back that far, right?
0:05:31 – Yeah, I had a blog too.
0:05:33 – Yeah, so that was what I thought.
0:05:35 It was like, “Okay, I wanna share my life
0:05:38 “as a 20-something woman, like how to navigate career,
0:05:41 “how to travel, and how to do all these things.”
0:05:44 And I started to realize, probably about a year or two in,
0:05:47 that I was like, “Oh, all of my topics
0:05:48 “have something to do with money.”
0:05:50 Yeah, I would talk about traveling to Costa Rica,
0:05:54 but I’d talk about negotiating our car rental,
0:05:56 or I’d talk about finding a cheap flight,
0:05:58 obviously with a career, right?
0:05:59 I’m working to make money
0:06:04 and to hopefully have this sense of purpose or passion.
0:06:07 And again, I was becoming more political,
0:06:10 becoming more educated about systemic oppression
0:06:13 and the various aspects of personal finance
0:06:15 that I was not seeing covered, right?
0:06:17 You think about Dave Ramsey, Susie Orman,
0:06:19 these very well-known personal finance experts,
0:06:22 and very rarely do they talk about how racism, sexism,
0:06:25 ableism, homophobia have anything to do with money.
0:06:28 And I talk about this in my book, Financial Feminist,
0:06:30 but 80% of the personal finance equation
0:06:33 is the systemic factors that you have no control of.
0:06:36 Only 20% of the personal finance equation
0:06:38 is how to get a budget together
0:06:41 and making sure you’re optimized in your Roth IRA.
0:06:42 So I wanted to have conversations
0:06:45 that were more nuanced, and during that time,
0:06:47 I think a lot of the financial experts
0:06:48 were starting to have those conversations,
0:06:52 post 2016 with Black Lives Matter in 2020,
0:06:54 the research into that movement.
0:06:55 So I think it was really important for me
0:07:00 to have those conversations be something that was not just,
0:07:02 you can’t buy a house because you buy lattes.
0:07:04 And it’s like, no, what is the real reason?
0:07:05 So yeah, all of that started as a blog
0:07:08 as I was trying to figure out my own voice too.
0:07:09 – I love that.
0:07:11 And we’re gonna talk about how to fight the patriarchy
0:07:13 through finances in a bit.
0:07:14 Let’s put a pin on that.
0:07:16 And I just want to understand your story
0:07:17 a little bit better.
0:07:18 – Sure.
0:07:22 – So you had this goal of saving $100,000.
0:07:24 And once you hit that goal,
0:07:26 you decided to quit your full-time job
0:07:29 and go all in on, you know, first 100K brand
0:07:32 and everything that you’ve built so far.
0:07:34 What made you first think of that idea
0:07:35 of saving $100,000?
0:07:38 Was that really intentional that you did that?
0:07:40 And you knew that that was the plan?
0:07:41 I would love to hear that story.
0:07:45 – I’m just that person that set goals for myself
0:07:45 from a very young age.
0:07:48 I literally have joked in like the promotion of my book.
0:07:49 I sat down when I was seven or eight
0:07:51 and said, I want to write a book someday.
0:07:53 Now, did I think it was gonna be like a personal finance book?
0:07:55 No, hell no, that was not the plan.
0:07:57 But for me, 100K was,
0:07:59 I was reading another personal finance blog
0:08:04 and I saw someone write about their 100K net worth at 25.
0:08:06 And I was probably 23.
0:08:08 And I started doing the math and I was like,
0:08:12 if I can increase my income by X percentage
0:08:14 and if I can continue to save X percentage
0:08:17 and if my investments perform like they’re performing,
0:08:19 I think I can hit this.
0:08:21 The joke was as long as I do it the day before I turned 26,
0:08:22 it still counts.
0:08:24 It was 100K at 25.
0:08:27 And that 100K happened,
0:08:29 I think three months after my 25th birthday.
0:08:31 So it was a combination of a lot of things.
0:08:34 It was the privilege of being able to graduate
0:08:35 college debt free.
0:08:38 I was working three jobs on campus, getting scholarships.
0:08:40 I also had parents who were financially minded
0:08:42 and who were able to contribute to my college.
0:08:44 I like to acknowledge that right off the bat
0:08:45 because it’s not something that everybody
0:08:47 has the privilege of doing.
0:08:49 I was also saving a huge percentage of my income.
0:08:54 My take home pay, 27% at the peak was going towards savings.
0:08:56 And then everything I made in my side hustle,
0:08:59 I was able to contribute to the 100K goal as well.
0:09:02 I was focused on value-based spending.
0:09:03 I was still traveling internationally.
0:09:04 I was still going out to eat.
0:09:05 That’s the other question.
0:09:07 People are like, oh, you ate oatmeal and ramen.
0:09:10 I’m like, no, actually, I still did all of the things
0:09:14 in a huge US city that I wanted to do as somebody in their 20s.
0:09:17 But yeah, that 100K, and this is the thing
0:09:20 that’s so important as a lot of people,
0:09:22 and I find especially women, they’re not necessarily
0:09:24 motivated by the numbers.
0:09:26 For me, there was something about seeing 100K
0:09:30 in the bank account that was like that burst of serotonin.
0:09:32 But it’s very difficult sometimes
0:09:35 to get somebody to care about money
0:09:37 when they think it’s just numbers.
0:09:38 We know that money is psychological.
0:09:41 We know that money is emotional.
0:09:43 And so when I thought about that 100K
0:09:46 and when shit started getting hard, where I couldn’t save,
0:09:48 or there was a period of time that I spent unemployed,
0:09:50 so I was not only not saving money,
0:09:53 I was spending the money I had already saved,
0:09:56 I was trying to figure out, OK, I set this arbitrary goal
0:09:56 for myself.
0:09:58 What’s the point?
0:10:01 The 100K meant that I got to quit my job.
0:10:03 That was the promise I had made to myself
0:10:08 is I attached the number to a goal and to a feeling.
0:10:11 I literally imagined like, what would my life look like
0:10:14 if I didn’t have to make somebody I didn’t respect rich?
0:10:18 What would my life look like if I didn’t have to ask
0:10:20 to take PTO and get it denied?
0:10:23 What would my life look like if I didn’t have to commute
0:10:28 into a job that I didn’t feel aligned with my passions
0:10:31 or aligned with the mission and values of my life?
0:10:33 What did that feel like?
0:10:35 And it felt amazing.
0:10:38 And so that 100K goal, yes, part of it
0:10:42 was seeing the 100K, being able to see the headline, which
0:10:44 I’m grateful that there are many.
0:10:46 How this 25-year-old saved 100K.
0:10:50 But really, it was about, how does my life change?
0:10:52 So if you’re out there and you’re trying to get yourself
0:10:54 motivated, how do I become debt-free?
0:10:57 Or how do I invest enough for retirement?
0:11:01 Or how do I make ends meet so that I don’t feel panicked
0:11:05 all of the time, associate that with a feeling, right?
0:11:09 What does it feel like to not have somebody demanding
0:11:12 that you send them money every month for your student loans?
0:11:14 What does it feel like to know?
0:11:17 Oh, yeah, I can buy this thing without guilt or shame
0:11:19 because I’ve budgeted for it.
0:11:21 What does it feel like to know that you’re
0:11:23 going to be set for retirement?
0:11:26 That 65-year-old you is taken care of.
0:11:27 What does that feel like?
0:11:30 That, for me, was really the driving force
0:11:32 of how does my life change and what
0:11:36 does it feel like to use money as a tool to get me there?
0:11:37 I loved it.
0:11:38 I think that’s really good advice.
0:11:44 And I remember I saved my first 100K at 28, I want to say.
0:11:47 And the amount of freedom I felt and just agency
0:11:49 over my own life, I didn’t need a man.
0:11:50 I didn’t need my parents.
0:11:52 I didn’t need– all of a sudden, I felt like, well,
0:11:54 if I don’t like this job, I could leave
0:11:57 because I have 100 grand and that’s at least going
0:11:59 to keep me afloat for four to six months and whatever.
0:12:03 So it really did unlock a lot of limiting mindsets
0:12:04 for myself.
0:12:06 So I would encourage everybody to have some sort
0:12:08 of a financial goal like that.
0:12:10 Well, and that’s the feeling I want
0:12:11 for every single person listening.
0:12:16 That is the feeling I want is I am in situations I want to be in
0:12:18 rather than situations I’m forced to be in.
0:12:21 Or I don’t have to tolerate bullshit from a partner,
0:12:23 from a company.
0:12:26 I can do what I want because I have the financial means
0:12:26 to do so.
0:12:29 That is so incredibly liberating.
0:12:33 And it reflects in every aspect of your life.
0:12:35 I show up differently in my relationships
0:12:38 because I know that I’m not dependent on somebody financially.
0:12:40 I show up different in my career.
0:12:42 I show up different in my business.
0:12:46 I show up different to myself in how I talk to myself.
0:12:48 And I think, again, that’s the feeling
0:12:49 I want for every single person listening
0:12:53 is when you start becoming financially confident,
0:12:55 when you start having that financial foundation,
0:12:58 not just your financial life, but all of the rest
0:12:58 of your life changes.
0:13:01 The rest of your life changes.
0:13:02 Yeah, and that kind of confidence
0:13:04 is actually very attractive, right?
0:13:07 Because it’s like you’re not coming out
0:13:09 in an insecure way to anyone.
0:13:12 And people gravitate to that kind of confidence.
0:13:17 So speaking of confidence, you have a theater background.
0:13:20 And I’ve had traditional financial experts on the show,
0:13:23 like Suzy Orman, like you mentioned, Peter Maluk,
0:13:26 and lots of great financial experts.
0:13:28 But what’s the advantage of learning from somebody
0:13:31 outside of our traditional background?
0:13:32 So many advantages.
0:13:34 Thank you for asking this question.
0:13:37 I spoke at Morningstar at one of their big splashy conferences
0:13:41 probably about a month ago, and I was keynoting.
0:13:43 And it was really interesting to see people’s responses,
0:13:45 because I did say on stage, I studied theater.
0:13:48 And I was joking, the girls that get it get it,
0:13:50 and the girls that don’t don’t.
0:13:52 It was very interesting to see what kind of people were like,
0:13:53 oh, you’re a theater major.
0:13:54 How are you qualified?
0:13:57 And I’m like, all of these other qualifications.
0:13:58 OK, a couple of things.
0:14:01 One, I think there’s something actually so refreshing
0:14:07 about hearing this complicated, inaccessible topic explained
0:14:10 by somebody who’s not in it.
0:14:13 I know that there’s a certain level of jargon
0:14:17 in any industry, but specifically personal finance.
0:14:19 And this is no fault of any financial professional.
0:14:21 But when you’ve been in it for a while,
0:14:23 that’s just the language you use.
0:14:26 And I was on a panel at the beginning of her first 100K.
0:14:28 It was probably 2019.
0:14:30 I was still working as a marketer,
0:14:31 and this was my side hustle.
0:14:34 And I had all of these people on this panel who were venture
0:14:36 capitalists and financial advisors
0:14:38 and who had been doing this for years.
0:14:41 And it was so interesting to them.
0:14:44 They were speaking to this room of 20 and 30-something women
0:14:46 who are my primary demographic.
0:14:49 And using the words that they thought
0:14:53 were investing 101 terms like asset allocation or portfolio
0:14:56 rebalancing, you and I know what that means.
0:14:57 Right?
0:15:00 But I literally saw the rest, like the entire audience’s
0:15:02 eyes glaze over, because they’re like,
0:15:03 I don’t know what that means.
0:15:07 And also, this industry is so veiled and so gate-kept
0:15:09 that I’m afraid of looking stupid if I ask.
0:15:11 But there’s something so refreshing about seeing me,
0:15:15 not in a pencil skirt, but in a leather jacket and adidas,
0:15:17 being like, hey, I’m going to explain everything to you
0:15:19 like you’re five, and not because you’re dumb
0:15:21 and not to condescend you, but because nobody
0:15:22 taught you this.
0:15:26 So coming outside of that industry, I think, is so helpful.
0:15:28 In terms of running a business, there
0:15:31 are so many people that I have met who
0:15:33 have arts or theater backgrounds who
0:15:35 are incredibly successful entrepreneurs,
0:15:37 even in the personal finance space.
0:15:40 I don’t know if you know, Steph O’Connell, theater person.
0:15:43 Erin Lowry broke Millennial, theater person.
0:15:46 There are so many of us who studied theater or did theater,
0:15:48 because when you’re an entrepreneur,
0:15:50 that is what you do all day.
0:15:52 This right here, I’m staring at a camera.
0:15:54 This is my theater degree.
0:15:58 Am I comfortable speaking in front of 5,000 people?
0:16:02 Am I comfortable going live on CNBC yesterday?
0:16:04 Am I comfortable doing that?
0:16:07 And am I comfortable being able to story
0:16:11 tell what I am doing and why this brand matters, which
0:16:13 is your entire job as a CEO or entrepreneur.
0:16:16 It’s just like jazz handing your company, right?
0:16:18 Just like jazz hands the entire time of like,
0:16:20 this is what we’re doing, this is why it matters.
0:16:23 Storytelling is what theater gave me the opportunity to do,
0:16:26 as well as be comfortable on stage in front of people
0:16:28 being able to adapt.
0:16:31 We run a financial media company, much like you.
0:16:34 Yes, I have tons of knowledge about personal finance,
0:16:36 but really, I run a media company that
0:16:37 just happens to talk about money.
0:16:40 I run a feminist company that talks about money.
0:16:42 And I think that my theater background and my communications
0:16:45 background is absolutely huge for that.
0:16:50 Let’s hold that thought and take a quick break with our sponsors.
0:16:52 Hello, young and profitors.
0:16:55 Running a small business means you’re wearing a lot of hats.
0:16:57 Your personal phone becomes your business phone.
0:17:00 And before you know it, you’re juggling calls day and night.
0:17:02 When I first started YAP, I made the mistake
0:17:04 of using my personal cell phone to handle
0:17:06 all of my business inquiries.
0:17:09 It worked fine at first, but as soon as my team and business
0:17:12 scaled, it became impossible to manage things.
0:17:14 And that’s where Open Phone comes in.
0:17:17 Open Phone is the number one business phone system.
0:17:19 They’ll help you separate your personal life
0:17:21 from your growing business.
0:17:24 And for just $15 a month, the cost of a few coffees,
0:17:27 you get complete visibility into everything happening
0:17:28 with your business phone number.
0:17:31 Open Phone works through an app on your phone or your computer,
0:17:35 and it integrates with HubSpot and hundreds of other systems.
0:17:38 They use AI-powered call transcripts and summaries.
0:17:41 So what that means is that you get a summary of your phone
0:17:43 call and action items as soon as you hang up.
0:17:45 And if you miss a call, automated messages
0:17:47 are sent directly to your customer.
0:17:49 Open Phone is affordable.
0:17:52 It’s easy to use, and whether you’re one person operation
0:17:55 and you just need help managing your own calls,
0:17:56 or you’ve got a large team and you’re
0:17:59 looking for more efficient collaboration,
0:18:01 Open Phone is the solution for you.
0:18:04 Right now, Open Phone is offering 20% off your first six
0:18:07 months when you go to openphone.com/profiting.
0:18:11 That’s O-P-E-N-P-H-O-N-E.com/profiting
0:18:13 for 20% off the first six months.
0:18:16 That’s openphone.com/profiting.
0:18:18 And by the way, if you have an existing number
0:18:21 with another service, Open Phone will port them over
0:18:23 at no extra charge.
0:18:25 That’s openphone.com/profiting.
0:18:26 Hey, AppBam.
0:18:28 Launching my LinkedIn secrets masterclass
0:18:30 was one of the best decisions that I’ve ever
0:18:32 made for my business.
0:18:35 And I didn’t have to figure out all the nuts and bolts
0:18:37 of creating a website for my course.
0:18:40 I needed a monthly subscription option.
0:18:42 I needed chat capabilities.
0:18:44 I needed a laundry list of features
0:18:48 to enable what I was envisioning with my course.
0:18:50 But here’s the thing, all I had to do
0:18:53 was literally lift a finger to get it all done.
0:18:56 And that’s because I used Shopify.
0:19:02 Shopify is the easiest way to sell anything,
0:19:04 to sell online or in person.
0:19:07 It’s the home of the number one checkout on the planet.
0:19:09 And Shopify is not so secret secret as Shoppay,
0:19:12 which boosts conversions up to 50%.
0:19:14 That means way fewer cards get abandoned
0:19:16 and way more sales get done.
0:19:19 If you’re into growing your business,
0:19:21 your commerce platform better be ready to sell
0:19:25 wherever your customers are scrolling and strolling
0:19:28 on the web, in your store, in the feed,
0:19:30 and everywhere in between.
0:19:34 Put simply, businesses that sell more sell with Shopify.
0:19:36 Upgrade your business and get the same checkout
0:19:38 we use at YAP Media with Shopify.
0:19:41 Sign up for your $1 per month trial period
0:19:44 at Shopify.com/profiting.
0:19:46 And that’s all lowercase young and profitors,
0:19:49 that’s Shopify.com/profiting.
0:19:53 Go to Shopify.com/profiting to upgrade your selling today,
0:19:56 Shopify.com/profiting.
0:19:58 (bell dings)
0:20:03 I’m like vigorously nodding
0:20:06 because I 100% agree with you.
0:20:09 As an entrepreneur, there’s so much creativity
0:20:12 that’s involved in being an inventor that’s involved.
0:20:14 And by the way, entrepreneurship is not something
0:20:15 that you tackle alone.
0:20:17 So if for some reason you have a gap in business
0:20:20 or financial knowledge, you can fill that gap
0:20:22 with other people that you can hire on your team.
0:20:25 And by the way, you’re also allowed to be a dynamic person
0:20:28 that can be good at business and finance and the arts, right?
0:20:31 So I’m totally aligned with everything that you’re saying.
0:20:34 So something that you touched on that I wanna dig deeper on
0:20:36 is this fact that you were speaking to all this women
0:20:38 and you felt like these words were sort of just glazing
0:20:40 over their heads.
0:20:41 And I know you’ve talked about in the past
0:20:44 about how women and men are sort of taught different things
0:20:46 when it comes to finance.
0:20:49 From when we’re young children to adulthood,
0:20:52 the way that we’re taught this financial information
0:20:53 tends to be different.
0:20:55 Can you talk to us about that?
0:20:58 – Yes, the entire thesis of my book really is that,
0:21:01 is just the lack of financial education
0:21:04 and specifically how money affects women
0:21:06 or any marginalized group differently.
0:21:08 And if you’re a man listening, I need you to not like
0:21:11 check out because this is not like I hate all men.
0:21:12 The patriarchy does not mean we hate men.
0:21:16 The patriarchy hurts men just as much as it hurts women.
0:21:21 So when we’re talking about the way we speak about money,
0:21:24 first of all, nobody’s taught about money unless you were.
0:21:26 And that sounds kind of like no dub,
0:21:27 but like unless you had parents like mine
0:21:29 who sat down to teach you about money,
0:21:31 you were not taught about money.
0:21:33 Regardless of your gender identity, that’s the reality.
0:21:36 It’s like there are very few places
0:21:37 to actually learn about money.
0:21:40 And even when it’s taught to you,
0:21:42 it is emotionally charged typically.
0:21:47 And it depends on your parents or your teacher’s background.
0:21:50 I can’t tell you the amount of first gen
0:21:52 or people of color who have come to me and been like,
0:21:53 I learned about money.
0:21:55 I learned that credit cards were evil
0:21:57 and that I shouldn’t trust banks
0:21:59 and that money was the thing we didn’t have enough of
0:22:02 so that when we got money, we had to just hoard it.
0:22:06 And that’s not exactly the perspective we want, right?
0:22:08 So first of all, nobody’s taught about money.
0:22:11 Second, I could spend an hour talking to you just about this,
0:22:13 but I’ll give you a very specific example.
0:22:15 Look at the toys that we give boys
0:22:18 versus what we give girls stereotypically.
0:22:21 We give boys Legos, trucks, things to build, right?
0:22:26 Things that build their sense of self-reliance
0:22:29 and of creativity and of their own ingenuity.
0:22:31 What do we give girls?
0:22:34 Dolls, easy bake ovens, things to take care of.
0:22:38 We give a literal child another child to take care of.
0:22:42 So what we’re telling kids is we’re telling boys
0:22:44 your inherent worth and value
0:22:47 is in your own creativity and your own thinking, right?
0:22:49 Your own initiative.
0:22:53 We’re telling girls your value to society
0:22:56 and your identity is in caregiving and altruism.
0:22:58 Now that altruism is beautiful and lovely
0:23:01 and it’s one of the things I love most about being a woman.
0:23:03 But what happens then
0:23:06 when we do start becoming financially confident as women?
0:23:07 When I do go on social media
0:23:10 and talk about the fact that I’m a millionaire.
0:23:14 When I do talk about me negotiating my salary
0:23:16 or me negotiating my rate,
0:23:20 suddenly it’s why aren’t you grateful for your opportunities?
0:23:23 She’s greedy, she’s bossy, she’s bragging.
0:23:26 The weaponization of the altruism starts happening.
0:23:29 So when we are conditioned to be altruistic,
0:23:32 we’re conditioned to be givers, which is again beautiful
0:23:35 and we should donate and we should give.
0:23:37 When we don’t conform to that roller identity,
0:23:39 when we’re no longer controllable,
0:23:41 ’cause really that’s what it is.
0:23:43 When I have money, I’m no longer controllable,
0:23:47 the perspective shifts to we need to remind her
0:23:48 that she needs to tax herself
0:23:50 and just be grateful for where she’s at
0:23:52 and not go above her station.
0:23:54 We don’t do that for men.
0:23:57 A man can post a photo on Instagram or on Twitter
0:24:02 with him at the golf course in a Rolex.
0:24:03 And the comments are cool Rolex, bro,
0:24:06 you’re doing well for yourself, right?
0:24:09 The comments for women, if I show up in a designer dress
0:24:11 or if I have the audacity and I’m putting this in quotes
0:24:13 to flaunt my wealth,
0:24:15 suddenly it’s why aren’t you donating more?
0:24:18 It’s not aspirational the way it is for men.
0:24:22 Also, it’s more socially acceptable for men
0:24:25 to not only pursue wealth, but to talk about wealth.
0:24:26 Nobody’s educated about it,
0:24:30 but there is the shift that happens with teenagers,
0:24:32 literally teenage boys, like going on Reddit,
0:24:35 talking with their friends about crypto or the hot stock.
0:24:39 Women are just not allowed into those conversations
0:24:43 and not socially conditioned to have them.
0:24:44 And my final point I’ll make,
0:24:46 in heteronarbative relationships
0:24:48 when a man is with a woman,
0:24:50 the men are handling the wealth building,
0:24:53 the women are handling the day-to-day finances still.
0:24:55 So in 2023, women are handling the budgeting
0:24:58 and the coupon clipping and like the household management.
0:25:01 And that’s important, that’s how households run,
0:25:02 but that’s not the wealth building.
0:25:05 Men are handling the real estate and the investing
0:25:10 and these like $30,000, $50,000, $100,000 decisions.
0:25:14 Women are handling the like which cottage cheese is cheaper.
0:25:19 And so if we really want to see the wealth gap
0:25:23 start to lessen, we have to have conversations about money
0:25:26 and we as a society have to be comfortable
0:25:28 with women’s pursuit of wealth
0:25:31 in a way that we just aren’t right now.
0:25:32 We are okay with men pursuing wealth,
0:25:36 we are okay with men managing these huge decisions
0:25:38 in a way we just aren’t with women.
0:25:40 – It’s so interesting to hear you talk about this
0:25:43 and then thinking back to my own experiences.
0:25:45 I feel like my fans and my listeners,
0:25:48 very positive about me speaking about money
0:25:52 and how to make money and being really supportive.
0:25:53 But then at the same time,
0:25:54 like I’ll have people like my mom
0:25:56 who will constantly be like,
0:25:58 “Hala, stop saying how much money you make.”
0:25:59 And I’m like, why?
0:26:02 – My own parents who taught me about money
0:26:04 are the ones who will call me
0:26:06 and be like, “I’m really worried about you.
0:26:07 “I’m really worried about you talking
0:26:09 “about how much money you make.”
0:26:10 And they’re not wrong though.
0:26:12 That ’cause that’s the thing.
0:26:13 That’s another example.
0:26:14 Men can talk about how much money they make
0:26:16 and they’re lauded.
0:26:19 Women, it’s a risk, a career risk,
0:26:22 a like literally safety risk.
0:26:26 It becomes a risk when you are transparent about money
0:26:28 in a way that just it isn’t for men.
0:26:30 And so I am doing the same thing where like,
0:26:32 I will show you my pay steps.
0:26:33 I will show you how much I make.
0:26:36 I also now know that there is a certain inherent risk
0:26:38 to that just because of my gender identity
0:26:41 in a way that there isn’t for a straight white man.
0:26:42 There just isn’t.
0:26:43 It’s so crazy.
0:26:46 And again, we have this own internalized stuff
0:26:47 going on ourselves, right?
0:26:50 This is not like men necessarily like putting this on us.
0:26:53 This is so many women coming to me being like,
0:26:54 “Yeah, but I should just be grateful
0:26:55 “that I have a job at all.”
0:26:56 And I’m like, “Yes.”
0:26:59 And you’re not being compensated fairly.
0:27:00 So let’s get you a raise.
0:27:06 – So let’s talk about how women are shamed for spending
0:27:08 and the double standards around that.
0:27:10 – I have a whole section of my book.
0:27:12 We have a whole chapter about spending.
0:27:15 And one of the just such interesting things
0:27:17 ties back to what I was saying before
0:27:20 of like the Rolex problem, right?
0:27:21 Men can purchase Rolexes
0:27:23 and it’s like you’re doing well for yourself.
0:27:25 Women have the audacity to spend money
0:27:26 on anything remotely nice.
0:27:28 And it’s like, why aren’t you donating more?
0:27:29 That was a waste of money.
0:27:33 Specifically, let’s talk about how we think
0:27:35 of spending in general.
0:27:38 The words frivolous spending
0:27:40 almost are only attached to women.
0:27:42 And what are the things that are deemed frivolous?
0:27:44 Things that are innately feminine,
0:27:49 lattes, pedicures, manicures, again, designer bags.
0:27:51 The things that we deem frivolous
0:27:54 are the things that are innately feminine.
0:27:57 They’re not NFL season tickets or golf clubs.
0:27:59 So when you Google like how to save money 2023,
0:28:02 the advice is still minimize.
0:28:04 The advice for men is maximize.
0:28:06 Maximize your earning, right?
0:28:09 Maximize your investments.
0:28:10 How can you make more money?
0:28:12 How can you expand?
0:28:14 The advice for women is how can you spend less?
0:28:16 How can you shrink?
0:28:18 The advice for men getting rich is make more money,
0:28:19 which is good advice.
0:28:22 But the advice for women is spend less money.
0:28:25 There’s only so much less money you can spend.
0:28:27 In theory, you can make as much money as you want.
0:28:29 Again, that’s like a huge asterisk.
0:28:33 But in theory, you can only not spend
0:28:34 up to a certain point.
0:28:36 You still have to pay your rent.
0:28:38 You still have to buy food for yourself.
0:28:42 So it’s really interesting the difference there
0:28:44 in how, again, we educate people about money
0:28:47 and specifically like what is deemed frivolous.
0:28:50 The frivolous spending is stuff that’s innately feminine.
0:28:52 – Yeah, super, super interesting stuff.
0:28:56 I want to move on to talk about the psychology of money
0:28:57 and mindsets behind money.
0:29:01 So you say that we have to understand our emotions
0:29:04 behind money and that money is not inherently bad.
0:29:08 So how should we start reframing our mindset around money?
0:29:11 – Yeah, when I was embarking on writing my book
0:29:14 and really educating people about money in general,
0:29:18 I was like, okay, we got to get to the actionable advice
0:29:18 ’cause that’s what I’m really good at.
0:29:20 I’m really good at like, you do this
0:29:21 and then you do this and you do this
0:29:23 and here’s what a Roth IRA is
0:29:25 and here’s how to take advantage of one.
0:29:27 And what happened in my early days,
0:29:29 I used to do one-on-one coaching with people
0:29:30 and what would happen is they would be successful
0:29:32 for a period of time,
0:29:33 but then they would fall off the bandwagon
0:29:35 for whatever reason.
0:29:37 And when I would ask them or like dig into that deeper,
0:29:38 I started to realize,
0:29:41 oh, there’s so many emotional hangups.
0:29:44 There are so many psychological trauma,
0:29:46 quite honestly, about money.
0:29:49 Money is emotional, it’s psychological.
0:29:51 When it’s good, when it’s bad,
0:29:54 we feel a certain way about every financial choice we make,
0:29:56 whether that’s how we spend our money,
0:29:59 how we’re saving our money, what we’re saving it for,
0:30:01 everything is psychological.
0:30:04 So I very intentionally spent the first chapter
0:30:06 before we go into the rest of it,
0:30:08 before we go into the how to pay off debt
0:30:09 and how to budget,
0:30:11 about how to navigate the emotional,
0:30:13 psychological sides of money.
0:30:16 Even we were talking about before these kind of like narratives,
0:30:17 you’re told about money.
0:30:19 The biggest one is you shouldn’t talk about money.
0:30:20 That’s impolite, right?
0:30:22 You shouldn’t talk about money.
0:30:23 That is a psychological narrative
0:30:26 meant to keep you underpaid and overworked.
0:30:27 Because if you don’t talk about money,
0:30:29 you don’t know that Chad,
0:30:30 who was hired two years after you
0:30:32 is making 20% more than you.
0:30:36 You don’t know that the debt shame you feel
0:30:37 your friend group feels too.
0:30:39 You don’t know.
0:30:41 That’s one of those that is so steeped in us.
0:30:45 The other one is that money can’t buy you happiness.
0:30:47 That is complete and utter bullshit.
0:30:50 Money can 100% buy you safety and stability
0:30:53 and that for most people is happiness.
0:30:55 Now, it’s true in theory, right?
0:30:58 You shouldn’t buy a Ferrari to make you happy.
0:31:02 But it buys me the freedom to purchase something
0:31:04 that feels like a small luxury
0:31:09 or to hire a house cleaner if I need to do that
0:31:11 and to be able to tip them 30%.
0:31:14 There’s so much flexibility that that offers
0:31:15 and I would argue that that is happiness.
0:31:18 But again, that’s a narrative told to you
0:31:20 that you have internalized
0:31:23 in order to not have you pursue money.
0:31:25 And one of the other ones is this misconception
0:31:27 that like if you work hard,
0:31:29 you will be financially successful.
0:31:31 Plenty of people, I would argue most people
0:31:33 work their fucking asses off
0:31:35 and yet have nothing to show it for financially
0:31:37 because of again, of this system
0:31:39 that constantly keeps them in poverty.
0:31:42 So there’s so many things that we have ingrained
0:31:45 or narratives we’ve started to believe.
0:31:46 And these start from our parents,
0:31:47 these start from society,
0:31:50 these start from again, how we’re raised around money.
0:31:53 And so the first step to start unpacking that
0:31:55 is to figure out what sort of again,
0:31:59 misconceptions or narratives have I been believing?
0:32:02 And do I want to carry those with me?
0:32:05 Do I believe that talking about money is taboo?
0:32:09 Do I believe that actually it’s okay to talk about sex
0:32:11 and death and politics and religion
0:32:13 and anything else controversial
0:32:14 before I’ll talk about money
0:32:15 ’cause that’s what the stats say right now.
0:32:18 We’re more likely to have any other uncomfortable conversation
0:32:20 before we’ll have a financial conversation.
0:32:25 Do I want to see people who have money as inherently evil?
0:32:28 Is that something that I want to carry with me?
0:32:30 You have to decide that for yourself.
0:32:31 And the other practice I do in my book
0:32:33 and we can even do this live if you’d like
0:32:36 is thinking about your first money memory.
0:32:39 – I was gonna bring that up next, so let’s do it.
0:32:41 – What is the first time you remember thinking about money
0:32:44 because that will have a huge impact
0:32:46 on the way you’re viewing money in general
0:32:48 because it’s again, it’s how your parents
0:32:51 or how your caregivers were using money.
0:32:54 So my first money memory is saving any penny
0:32:58 or change I had in that Altoids tin to go see a musical.
0:33:01 The theater major runs deep.
0:33:02 But like that was what I wanted to do
0:33:04 ’cause my mom told me if you want a ticket to this
0:33:05 you need to save your money.
0:33:08 So I internalized, okay, if I want something
0:33:09 I have to save my money.
0:33:11 I have plenty of other people I’ve talked to
0:33:14 my first money memory is my parents screaming at each other
0:33:16 and arguing about how they didn’t have enough money.
0:33:21 My money memory is having to get its separate line
0:33:23 and a separate ticket to get like my school funded lunch
0:33:27 because my parents couldn’t afford my school lunch.
0:33:28 There’s plenty of money memories
0:33:29 that have everything to do
0:33:31 with how you’re managing money now.
0:33:33 So if you’re willing to share
0:33:34 what your first money memory is.
0:33:36 – So I remember I have two cousins
0:33:38 that lived down the street that are my age
0:33:41 and we had a master plan that we were gonna save money
0:33:42 to go to Disneyland.
0:33:47 And so we had a big plastic crayon piggy bank
0:33:51 that we’d fill with quarters and I would put them to work.
0:33:54 I would make them create little paintings and pictures
0:33:56 and then sell it at Sunday school.
0:33:59 And we’d have like slushy stands in the summer.
0:34:00 – Hustling.
0:34:03 – I’d be like massaging my parents’ feet for $20.
0:34:05 Like I was always hustling
0:34:08 to try to make this money for Disneyland.
0:34:10 And then I think we did it for like two years
0:34:12 and then we, I think we just like blew the money
0:34:14 at the mall or something and like switched gears.
0:34:17 But it was actually making money
0:34:21 as a little entrepreneur, putting my cousins to work
0:34:23 so that we could fund this Disneyland trip.
0:34:25 And so I always felt like I guess anything was possible
0:34:29 in terms of money and just making it happen.
0:34:32 So pretty interesting.
0:34:36 – Yeah, it’s so crazy to think about how it connects, right?
0:34:40 And how it ends up manifesting in our lives now.
0:34:42 So if anybody at home can do that
0:34:43 and can start digging into that.
0:34:45 And then the follow up question is not just
0:34:49 what is my money memory, but how does my first money memory
0:34:51 again shape the way I’m managing money now?
0:34:53 What through lines are there?
0:34:54 And sometimes it’s the exact opposite.
0:34:56 Like we were talking about before of,
0:35:00 I see again a lot of first gen or people of color,
0:35:02 they saw their parents not grow up with a lot.
0:35:06 And so then their thought is any dollar I get I have to save.
0:35:08 And I have no flexibility with myself at all
0:35:11 because I’m not sure when my next paycheck’s coming, right?
0:35:15 So even money memories that could be deemed positive of,
0:35:19 okay, it’s encouraging me to save, but at what cost, right?
0:35:22 Are you completely depriving yourself of all joy?
0:35:23 Well, that’s not great either.
0:35:25 I had a client that I mentioned in the book
0:35:27 who was saving 90% of her income.
0:35:29 And she wasn’t, you know, making a million dollars.
0:35:31 It was like 90% of 75K.
0:35:35 And I was like, you don’t need to save that much.
0:35:37 But when we dug into it, she didn’t grow up with a lot.
0:35:39 And she was like, I need to save every single penny
0:35:42 because I don’t know what the future holds for me.
0:35:44 And I’m like, you can ease off the gas.
0:35:45 It’s okay.
0:35:47 It’s okay to not to save all of this money.
0:35:49 – Yeah, this reminds me of,
0:35:52 I had a remit Seiti on the show
0:35:54 and he talks about this concept of a rich life.
0:35:55 And basically- – Rich life, baby.
0:35:57 – Yeah. – He came on our show
0:35:58 as well and talked about it.
0:36:00 And then he’s also featured in my book Financial Feminists.
0:36:04 But yeah, perfect, perfect example of what is your rich life?
0:36:07 What is the life you dream for yourself
0:36:09 that money can afford you, totally?
0:36:10 – Yeah, totally.
0:36:12 So just for context for my listeners,
0:36:13 basically what he says is like,
0:36:16 you should have these different categories or money dials,
0:36:19 figure out what you like to spend money on
0:36:21 and go ahead and splurge in those areas
0:36:23 and then really pull back on the areas
0:36:25 that you don’t care about
0:36:27 and don’t worry about feeling judged.
0:36:31 So for example, I like to spend a lot of money on clothes
0:36:32 and shoes and bags.
0:36:34 Certain people are like, you shouldn’t do that.
0:36:38 That’s bad, but I’ve released myself from any of that guilt
0:36:40 and I’ve set up my money dial.
0:36:44 So for you, what does your rich life look like?
0:36:46 – Yeah, Remit has a huge impact
0:36:48 on the way I manage money and the way I teach it.
0:36:51 We call them value categories at her first center K.
0:36:53 So it’s like three areas in your life
0:36:54 that bring you the most joy
0:36:55 that you want to see your money going to.
0:36:57 And then very similar to him,
0:36:59 you spend most of your money there
0:37:01 and then you don’t spend a lot of your discretionary
0:37:02 you spend elsewhere.
0:37:06 So my three value categories are travel, food out.
0:37:08 I am a huge foodie.
0:37:10 I love going to restaurants and plants.
0:37:14 There’s like probably 15 in this room.
0:37:16 There’s like one in the corner.
0:37:16 I love them.
0:37:18 They’re my babies.
0:37:19 I love spending money on them.
0:37:21 I will buy their cute little pots.
0:37:22 I will buy hangers for them.
0:37:24 Like I love my plants.
0:37:25 Do I buy the occasional Starbucks?
0:37:29 Yeah, do I, you know, just water sale at TJ Maxx?
0:37:30 Yeah, I’m in there like swimwear.
0:37:34 However, I am not spending all of my money on those things
0:37:36 because those are the things that are less important to me.
0:37:38 Yeah, and I think the big message here
0:37:42 is don’t feel guilt about what you love to spend money on.
0:37:43 Because it’s your happiness.
0:37:44 It’s your life.
0:37:47 Society tells you that you can spend money on travel,
0:37:48 but you can’t spend it on luxury
0:37:52 and whatever society wants to kind of dictate.
0:37:53 But don’t worry about that
0:37:55 and live your own happy rich life.
0:37:59 So speaking of another sort of tool that you talk about,
0:38:01 you’ve got this concept of a money diary.
0:38:03 Can you explain to us what that is
0:38:05 and the framework around that?
0:38:07 Yeah, it was a practice that I started doing
0:38:09 when I would coach clients one-on-one.
0:38:12 And it was this realization of, you know,
0:38:15 I would ask people, okay, what money’s coming in?
0:38:18 And they could total that up for me, usually, right?
0:38:20 Like, okay, I’m getting paid this amount during this time.
0:38:22 And, you know, maybe I have this side hustle
0:38:23 or if you’re a business owner, right?
0:38:25 I have, you know, these four clients
0:38:27 and these are my revenue streams.
0:38:30 And then I would say, okay, where is that money going?
0:38:32 And they would kind of be like, well,
0:38:33 I think it’s going to this.
0:38:35 And then we would look at their credit card statements
0:38:36 and they’re like, just kidding.
0:38:38 I have no idea where the hell my money went.
0:38:38 I don’t know.
0:38:41 And if that feeling is your feeling
0:38:42 of I look at my bank account and I’m like,
0:38:43 I don’t know where my money went,
0:38:45 then this is the practice for you.
0:38:49 It’s literally writing down every purchase you make,
0:38:51 especially discretionary purchases for a period of time.
0:38:53 And it’s not to shame you.
0:38:56 It’s more just to watch what behavior
0:38:57 and what sort of mindset you have.
0:39:00 So again, talk about this more in my book,
0:39:01 but you do four things.
0:39:03 You write down where you spent the money
0:39:05 or what you spent it on, how much.
0:39:08 So I went to Starbucks, about a $5 mocha, right?
0:39:10 And then why you made the purchase
0:39:11 and how it made you feel.
0:39:12 I was meeting up with a friend
0:39:13 and it made me feel great
0:39:15 ’cause I haven’t seen her in a while.
0:39:17 The why and how it made you feel
0:39:18 is the transformational part.
0:39:21 Because again, money’s psychological.
0:39:22 It’s emotional.
0:39:26 I need you to understand why you’re making this purchase.
0:39:28 Is it, I went out with my friends
0:39:29 and I had a little too much to drink
0:39:32 and I suddenly was buying shots for the entire bar.
0:39:35 Cool, probably wasn’t a great use of your money.
0:39:37 Maybe it was, I don’t know.
0:39:38 For me, probably not a great use of my money.
0:39:40 Now, am I shaming and judging myself?
0:39:41 No, 100% not.
0:39:43 I’m just like, interesting.
0:39:47 Okay, I did that because I maybe wanted this feeling
0:39:50 of belonging or I wanted this feeling of I am ballin’ out
0:39:53 and I can show people that I can buy an entire round.
0:39:54 Maybe it’s, okay, I bought this pair of shoes
0:39:56 I didn’t need and didn’t want
0:39:58 because my boss made me feel like shit today, right?
0:40:01 And I was spending to emotionally cope.
0:40:04 I think we can all find a place in our life
0:40:07 where we did that, especially like pandemic, right?
0:40:10 I bought a $75 pregnancy pillow.
0:40:10 Am I pregnant?
0:40:12 Am I planning on becoming pregnant?
0:40:14 No, did I need to feel something?
0:40:15 Yes, yes.
0:40:16 Was it a great purchase?
0:40:18 Actually, yes, 100%.
0:40:19 I still use it all the time.
0:40:22 But that’s the thing is you have to start understanding
0:40:24 my purchases, even the ones that are minor,
0:40:26 are psychological and emotional.
0:40:28 And what’ll start happening is before you lay down
0:40:30 that credit card or before you hit add to cart,
0:40:32 you’ll start going, okay, do I need this thing?
0:40:33 Do I actually want this thing?
0:40:35 Because I want your hard earned money
0:40:37 going to things that you actually love.
0:40:38 It’s your hard earned money.
0:40:39 It doesn’t mean don’t spend it,
0:40:40 like we were talking about before.
0:40:42 It doesn’t mean don’t spend money.
0:40:44 It just means spend your hard earned money
0:40:46 on things that light you on fire.
0:40:47 And if it doesn’t light you on fire,
0:40:49 we don’t do lukewarm in 2023.
0:40:52 We don’t do lukewarm with spending, with men.
0:40:53 We don’t do lukewarm.
0:40:56 Like we don’t do lukewarm in 2023.
0:40:58 We do things that light us on fire.
0:41:00 So if that’s something that you’re like,
0:41:01 I don’t care, then don’t worry about it.
0:41:03 – Yeah, I really like that advice
0:41:06 because what it does is it uncovers all these things
0:41:08 that you may have not realized
0:41:11 in terms of what was actually driving your actions.
0:41:14 And then it will also uncover, this is genuine.
0:41:15 I genuinely like doing this.
0:41:16 This made me feel good.
0:41:20 There was no like ulterior reason for why I did it.
0:41:22 That’s like in my subconscious mind.
0:41:25 So I really like this advice.
0:41:28 Another piece of advice from your book Financial Feminist
0:41:30 is this idea of a financial priority list.
0:41:35 And you give like a one time, I think four step outline
0:41:36 of what you should tackle first.
0:41:38 And I thought I could bring this up
0:41:40 and kind of ask some follow up questions,
0:41:42 make it more relevant to my audience.
0:41:45 So number one in this financial priority list
0:41:47 is to start an emergency fund.
0:41:51 So what are the details or recommendations around this fund
0:41:53 and why do you think that’s step number one?
0:41:55 – Yeah, one of the misconceptions I hear a lot
0:41:59 is I need to pay off my debt first before I save.
0:42:03 I just so strongly disagree with that for a couple of reasons.
0:42:06 One, I don’t want you going into more debt
0:42:07 trying to pay for an emergency
0:42:09 because one will come up, right?
0:42:12 And the second is that we prioritize mental health
0:42:13 at her first under K.
0:42:15 And like we were talking about this before
0:42:18 of this feeling of stability or this feeling of choice,
0:42:20 there is something so soothing
0:42:22 about your head hitting the pillow at night
0:42:23 and knowing that you’re covered.
0:42:26 You lose your job tomorrow, you get laid off,
0:42:27 you’re gonna be fine.
0:42:30 A medical unexpected medical cost comes up,
0:42:31 you’re gonna be fine.
0:42:33 Or at least fine for a period of time, right?
0:42:35 The emergency funds there to tide you over.
0:42:37 So there’s something so freeing about that
0:42:40 but also so comforting about that mentally.
0:42:42 Just knowing like, okay, I’m good.
0:42:44 Your emergency funds should be at least three months
0:42:46 of living expenses in a high yield savings account.
0:42:48 It’s a good starter emergency fund.
0:42:51 That is our first step before we pay off any kind of debt
0:42:52 and that includes credit cards.
0:42:53 So that’s priority number one,
0:42:56 is that emergency fund in a high yield savings account.
0:42:57 Everybody listening,
0:42:59 if you do not have a high yield savings account,
0:43:02 you are losing amounts of money on interest.
0:43:04 It’s the easiest thing you can do
0:43:05 to immediately better your life
0:43:07 because it’s just like a savings account
0:43:08 except a higher yield.
0:43:11 It’s just going to boost your savings.
0:43:12 If your savings is just gonna sit there,
0:43:14 which is what we want,
0:43:16 we may as well have it work hard or feel.
0:43:17 So that’s priority number one.
0:43:20 Priority number two is paying down debt
0:43:22 that is over 7% in interest.
0:43:23 Why 7%?
0:43:25 Well, that’s the average amount we can expect
0:43:26 in the stock market, right?
0:43:27 Seven to 8%.
0:43:30 So if your debt is costing you more money
0:43:31 than you could be earning somewhere else,
0:43:33 that needs to be paid off first.
0:43:34 Credit cards, every credit card
0:43:36 is over 7% in interest, right?
0:43:39 So we want to start paying down our credit card debt next.
0:43:41 Some student loans are, all credit cards are.
0:43:43 So anything above 7% start paying that down
0:43:47 and making sure you’re staying out of debt in the meantime.
0:43:50 The third priority is kind of like a two-parter
0:43:51 where you’re saving for your retirement,
0:43:54 you’re starting to prioritize your retirement savings,
0:43:56 while also paying down your lower interest debt,
0:43:58 anything under that 7% to 8%.
0:44:01 So most student loans, car loans, mortgages.
0:44:03 And then finally, as you’re starting to save for retirement
0:44:05 and as you’re paying down your lower interest debt,
0:44:07 start saving for what I call like the big life stuff,
0:44:10 the new car, the house, the getting married,
0:44:12 the having children, the starting a business,
0:44:14 the retiring early, right?
0:44:16 The big things that you need to save for.
0:44:18 The only thing that trumps this list
0:44:19 or that adjusts it a little bit
0:44:22 is if you get a 401(k) match at work.
0:44:26 A match is, if it’s 3%, that means if you contribute 3%
0:44:28 that your employer will match you at 3%, right?
0:44:32 So we do a lying king one and a half kind of situation
0:44:33 and it slides in right between one and two.
0:44:35 So one is that emergency fund,
0:44:37 one and a half is getting that 401(k) match
0:44:39 because it’s free money.
0:44:39 And we’re actually gonna do that
0:44:42 before we start paying off our credit card debt.
0:44:45 – We’ll be right back after a quick break from our sponsors.
0:44:50 (whooshing)
0:44:52 Okay, couple of follow-up questions here.
0:44:55 A lot of my listeners are freelancers,
0:44:57 entrepreneurs, solopreneurs.
0:45:00 If there’s no 401(k),
0:45:03 is there another alternative that you suggest?
0:45:03 – 100%.
0:45:05 So we have a section in the book
0:45:06 that breaks down retirement accounts
0:45:09 for various different kinds of income sources.
0:45:12 So W2, right, if you’re a nine to fiveer,
0:45:13 if you get that 401(k), great.
0:45:17 An IRA, either a Roth or traditional IRA are great options.
0:45:19 That is an individual retirement account.
0:45:20 That’s what IRA stands for.
0:45:23 You can also open up an IRA if you’re a self-employed person.
0:45:25 I have a Roth IRA.
0:45:26 It’s actually a great option for you
0:45:27 because it’s not tied to an employer,
0:45:29 even your business.
0:45:30 It is something that is yours.
0:45:34 I believe the maximum this year is 6,500 unless you’re over 55.
0:45:35 So that’s a great option.
0:45:38 There’s also a various different self-employed options.
0:45:41 There’s actually a solo 401(k) that you can open
0:45:42 that works just like a 401(k)
0:45:44 except you’re your own sponsor
0:45:46 because you’re your own business owner.
0:45:48 The other thing that’s really cool
0:45:50 that I took advantage of when I was side hustling
0:45:51 is what’s called a SEP IRA.
0:45:55 A SEP IRA can be for full-time business owners
0:45:58 or for people who are making some sort of money
0:45:59 in a side business.
0:46:01 So when I was at my nine to five,
0:46:02 I had my 401(k) through work.
0:46:04 I had my Roth IRA.
0:46:07 And then I actually had my SEP IRA through my business.
0:46:09 So when you’re a full-time business owner,
0:46:11 a full-time freelancer, you got to pick one or the other,
0:46:13 either a solo 401(k) or a SEP IRA.
0:46:15 But the SEP IRA contribution limits
0:46:18 are something in the $60,000 range this year.
0:46:20 So it’s a really, really great opportunity for you
0:46:22 to start saving for retirement.
0:46:23 Very similar to your question,
0:46:25 I think a lot of people who are self-employed
0:46:27 or freelancers are like, there’s no options for me.
0:46:30 There’s actually, I would argue, better options for you.
0:46:32 I know that when I was working my nine to five,
0:46:35 sometimes my nine to five didn’t offer a 401(k) at all.
0:46:37 And so I didn’t have that option.
0:46:38 When you are your own employer,
0:46:42 you can open up whatever retirement plan makes sense for you
0:46:44 and for your business.
0:46:46 – This is all really, really great advice.
0:46:47 They’re so knowledgeable.
0:46:50 I mean, screw everyone who says,
0:46:52 you only have a theater background.
0:46:54 – Oh, I mean, I can show you bank statements.
0:46:56 It’s always men who are user.
0:46:58 It’s anonymous users in there.
0:46:59 Literally, I got one last night that’s like,
0:47:01 how are you qualified?
0:47:03 And I was like, does the New York Times best-selling author
0:47:06 and millionaire business owner work?
0:47:07 And he was like, no.
0:47:09 And I was like, okay, we can compare bank statements.
0:47:11 I’m doing fine.
0:47:14 Bless and block wish you the best.
0:47:16 – Okay, so another question,
0:47:17 and this is related to debt.
0:47:20 And I really want you to try to dig deep
0:47:21 in explaining this,
0:47:23 ’cause I think this is really important.
0:47:25 Sometimes it makes sense to pay off debt.
0:47:26 You did allude to this a bit.
0:47:29 Sometimes it makes sense to pay off debt as soon as you can.
0:47:32 Sometimes it makes sense to actually let that debt linger
0:47:35 and leverage your cash differently
0:47:37 and make more money on your money.
0:47:38 Talk to us about that
0:47:40 because I think a lot of people get this wrong.
0:47:42 – This word you just used, leverage.
0:47:47 So the word debt is associated in our society with shame.
0:47:50 And even the very people we have sought out
0:47:52 to teach us how to manage money,
0:47:54 my nemesis Dave Ramsey, right?
0:47:56 As he has told you that debt is wrong and bad
0:47:58 and needs to be eradicated immediately.
0:48:01 Debt is for poor people.
0:48:04 But when you get to a certain level of financial standing,
0:48:06 debt has a new name.
0:48:09 It gets like fancy Gucci shoes
0:48:11 and suddenly it’s called leverage.
0:48:13 It’s the same thing.
0:48:15 But leverage is this idea of,
0:48:19 you’ll see like Adele buy this $30 million house
0:48:20 and take out a mortgage.
0:48:23 We know Adele has $30 million, right?
0:48:25 She could buy that house cash.
0:48:26 Why doesn’t she?
0:48:31 She doesn’t because she could be using the money
0:48:35 that she would put towards buying that in cash,
0:48:36 towards a different investment
0:48:38 that’s going to make her more money.
0:48:40 So she’s willing to take on the mortgage,
0:48:41 which at the time I think when she bought the house
0:48:43 was like 4% interest
0:48:45 because she’s gonna make more money somewhere else.
0:48:47 So the question that I was alluding to before
0:48:50 of like, do I pay off debt or do I invest?
0:48:51 Depends on your interest rate.
0:48:54 So if it’s less than you could be making in the stock market,
0:48:57 it actually makes sense to prioritize investing.
0:48:58 Now, if you’re in credit card debt
0:49:00 and that’s 25% interest,
0:49:03 nothing’s offering you 25% interest, right?
0:49:06 So you need to start paying that off first.
0:49:09 I will also say one of the biggest things that I believe
0:49:11 is personal finance is personal.
0:49:13 And that’s the math on this.
0:49:15 But if you are the kind of person where you’re like,
0:49:20 I know there would be a significant boost in my life
0:49:22 if I didn’t have to worry about this anymore,
0:49:23 cool, pay it off.
0:49:26 But don’t neglect your retirement.
0:49:27 This is again, Dave Ramsey is like,
0:49:29 all of your debt needs to be gone.
0:49:31 But most people have mortgages
0:49:33 that they will be paying off for decades.
0:49:34 So, okay, cool.
0:49:36 You buy a house hypothetically at 30,
0:49:39 you pay it off when you’re 50,
0:49:40 then you start saving for retirement.
0:49:42 Like that doesn’t work.
0:49:43 That financially doesn’t work.
0:49:45 You’re not gonna have enough time
0:49:47 to be able to contribute for retirement.
0:49:50 So don’t ever feel like debt is this thing
0:49:52 that needs to be eradicated at all costs.
0:49:54 There are variations of debt, right?
0:49:56 Some is debt is quote unquote like worse than others
0:49:58 because of that interest rate.
0:49:59 It’s okay to have student loans.
0:50:01 It’s okay to have a mortgage.
0:50:03 I had a car loan for a long time
0:50:05 because it was like 2% interest.
0:50:07 I can make a lot of money investing
0:50:10 that cash I would have put down
0:50:11 towards paying that off faster
0:50:15 or towards just not having a loan at all.
0:50:16 And I can put that towards investing
0:50:19 and make that 100K that I did.
0:50:21 – To me, this is such a great strategy
0:50:24 that so many people are not thinking about.
0:50:25 Look at all your debt.
0:50:27 See what your interest rates are.
0:50:30 See where you can put that money differently
0:50:32 and make more money and really plan it out.
0:50:34 So I have another question for you, Tori.
0:50:38 So I’m an entrepreneur and I’ve got this mentality
0:50:40 in terms of like, I don’t care about retirement.
0:50:41 I’m like a hustler.
0:50:44 I always figure out how to make money.
0:50:47 I’m not inspired to save money for retirement.
0:50:49 What inspires me is I’ll buy whatever I want
0:50:51 and then I’m like, all right, I’ll just make more money.
0:50:53 You know what I’m figuring out how to make more money.
0:50:57 And I invest a lot in my own business, right?
0:51:00 And take a lot of risks because it’s served me well.
0:51:03 I take risks and then I make higher rewards typically, right?
0:51:06 And I’m investing myself continually.
0:51:08 Whether that’s my own company, starting new companies,
0:51:11 investing in teammates, whatever it is.
0:51:13 And so I guess my question is this whole idea
0:51:16 of saving for retirement feels so passive to me
0:51:19 and feels like very uninspiring.
0:51:21 And I just love to hear your thoughts about that.
0:51:23 – It’s really interesting.
0:51:24 Thank you for sharing.
0:51:26 Two things, the average person,
0:51:29 like you will not be able to retire if you don’t invest.
0:51:31 So to get the average person investing
0:51:33 and maybe this will connect with you,
0:51:38 I try to have them picture what 65 year old you looks like
0:51:40 because there is this arbitrary thing
0:51:41 where you’re just like, I’m saving for this thing
0:51:43 that’s so far away, especially if you’re like 20s or 30s.
0:51:46 You’re like, what’s the point?
0:51:49 65 year old Tori, Nana Tori
0:51:51 is going to be drinking Savion Blanc with lunch.
0:51:53 She’s going to be flirting with her
0:51:55 a much younger Pilates instructor named Luca.
0:51:58 She has a Tuscan villa where she adopts dogs.
0:52:01 She is somehow more badass than I am right now.
0:52:03 And I can’t wait to meet her.
0:52:05 But she doesn’t get all of that
0:52:08 unless I do some heavy lifting right now.
0:52:09 So again, we were talking about this
0:52:10 as a perfect roundabout.
0:52:12 We were talking about before at the very beginning
0:52:16 of the interview about how do I attach something emotional
0:52:18 so that I am motivated to do it.
0:52:20 I literally can picture 65 year old Nana Tori
0:52:23 with her cute little handbag and her little wrinkles,
0:52:25 but she’s just so excited to be alive.
0:52:29 I have to save money in order to get her to that place.
0:52:31 On the flip side, I’m 28.
0:52:34 I will never have to work another day if I don’t want to
0:52:36 because I have saved enough.
0:52:41 I have the option to burn all of HFK to the ground tomorrow
0:52:44 if I wanted to and never work again and still be fine
0:52:48 because I have saved and invested enough money
0:52:49 from all of the money I’ve made.
0:52:51 Now I won’t do that for many reasons.
0:52:52 I love what I do.
0:52:55 It continues to make a huge impact, right?
0:52:56 Like I won’t do that.
0:52:58 I will continue to make a lot of money.
0:53:00 The business will continue to make a lot of money.
0:53:04 But I have the option as someone who isn’t even 30 yet
0:53:07 to stop working, work is now optional.
0:53:09 There is something so freeing about that.
0:53:11 So in the same way that it sounds like it is freeing
0:53:13 for you to be like, I can just make more money.
0:53:16 I feel that way in some aspects
0:53:17 where it’s kind of cool to just be like,
0:53:20 yeah, I could put something on sale and make 20K in a day.
0:53:21 That’s great.
0:53:25 But I also get so much stability and happiness
0:53:28 and excitement out of the baller ass move
0:53:30 that is like, yeah, I don’t have to work.
0:53:34 So in terms of that mindset shift for me,
0:53:37 I started reading about financial independence
0:53:39 when I was in my early 20s.
0:53:41 And it was less like, especially in the early days
0:53:44 that 100K it was less about how much money can I make
0:53:45 or how much money can I earn?
0:53:48 And more like, what can I put away so that I have options
0:53:51 and I can save as much as possible
0:53:53 and invest as much as possible
0:53:57 while still traveling and going out to restaurants
0:53:59 and having the experience that I want
0:54:00 as somebody in their 20s.
0:54:03 So I think that that for me was the kind of shift,
0:54:07 the ability to have this money saved
0:54:09 that work is optional.
0:54:11 – Yeah, and I think that we should all take this,
0:54:12 what do you call it, Nana vision?
0:54:14 – Nana, yeah, I literally call it in the book
0:54:17 like grandparent you or like Nana you like,
0:54:18 what does that look like?
0:54:21 And again, like we were talking about remit,
0:54:23 your rich life, like your Nana version of you
0:54:25 is gonna look different, right?
0:54:27 I’ve asked people in workshops before,
0:54:28 like what does Nana you look like?
0:54:30 And for some people, yeah, it’s very similar to mine.
0:54:32 It’s like adopting dogs and like not giving a fuck.
0:54:35 And for other people, it’s just like, I feel content.
0:54:37 I have enough money, I feel content, I’m not stressed.
0:54:40 And I’m like, great, that’s amazing, that’s amazing.
0:54:41 – I think mine is living in Miami
0:54:44 with like a pink Lamborghini or something.
0:54:45 – Perfect, perfect.
0:54:47 And it doesn’t mean I sacrifice everything now,
0:54:49 it just means that I am balancing that
0:54:52 to make sure that she’s not living in poverty,
0:54:54 but she’s not having a good time
0:54:57 because I didn’t do a little bit of the heavy lifting now.
0:54:59 – Okay, so let’s close out this interview
0:55:02 talking about earning potential since we just brought that up
0:55:05 and how it’s not just about saving investing.
0:55:07 We talk a lot about that on the podcast.
0:55:10 You started your business as a side hustle.
0:55:12 So I’d love to close out the interview
0:55:14 getting your best side hustle advice.
0:55:16 Why do you think side hustles are something smart
0:55:18 that people should consider?
0:55:19 And what are your suggestions
0:55:22 in terms of getting started with a side hustle?
0:55:25 – Yeah, wanna acknowledge that sometimes a side hustle
0:55:27 is just a fancy word for a second job
0:55:29 and it’s not a choice, it’s a necessity.
0:55:31 And if you are the person who’s working a second job
0:55:33 because you cannot afford life,
0:55:36 it might feel a little cringey to hear me talk about
0:55:37 side hustles, this nice fancy thing
0:55:39 where you can diversify your income
0:55:40 or you’re just like, no, I need a second job.
0:55:43 So wanna acknowledge if that’s you, I see you
0:55:44 and I’m here to support you
0:55:46 and I know that fucking sucks.
0:55:47 In terms of actual side hustle,
0:55:49 if you’re like, I wanna diversify my income
0:55:51 or maybe I wanna be an entrepreneur someday
0:55:54 or maybe I just wanna explore what this looks like.
0:55:55 I’ll walk you through the exercise
0:55:57 that I walk people through in my book.
0:55:59 I call it the three T’s, time, talent, treasure.
0:56:02 Time, how much time do you realistically have
0:56:02 for this thing?
0:56:03 A lot of people are like,
0:56:05 oh, I’ll start a side hustle and I’ll be a business owner.
0:56:06 And then they look at their calendar
0:56:09 and they’re like, I have no time to do that.
0:56:12 How much time are you realistically able to give?
0:56:15 For talent, do you have something
0:56:17 that you have already cultivated,
0:56:19 a skill or talent that you’ve already cultivated
0:56:20 that you wanna continue doing
0:56:23 or do you wanna cultivate something else, right?
0:56:25 For me, I was a social media marketer.
0:56:28 I was good at that, I was good at storytelling
0:56:31 that lent itself very well to be an entrepreneur.
0:56:34 I had already had experience as well being an entrepreneur.
0:56:35 For some people, they’re like,
0:56:37 I wanna do something completely different
0:56:38 or I wanna do something that’s more creative
0:56:40 ’cause my job isn’t.
0:56:42 It’s gonna take longer to get off the ground,
0:56:45 most likely because you will have to cultivate that skill.
0:56:47 And then finally, treasure is exactly what it sounds like
0:56:50 of is this the thing you want to make money doing?
0:56:52 I wish somebody had told me when I was 22
0:56:55 that not every hobby needs to be monetized.
0:56:57 Not everything you do that brings you joy
0:56:59 needs to make you money.
0:57:01 And in fact, there should be things in your life
0:57:02 that don’t make you money.
0:57:05 If this is a I wanna make money off of this
0:57:07 or I need to make money off of this,
0:57:09 becoming an entrepreneur is not immediately
0:57:11 going to make you money.
0:57:15 So if you want to be someone who is running their own business
0:57:17 but you need money right now,
0:57:19 probably not the best option.
0:57:22 I didn’t see money from her first 100K for a couple years
0:57:24 and I didn’t see substantial money from it
0:57:26 until like year four.
0:57:29 It did not pay my bills until year four.
0:57:31 So that’s kind of what you have to balance.
0:57:34 If you’re like, I need money tomorrow,
0:57:35 catering a couple of days, right?
0:57:38 Or becoming a part-time barista at Starbucks.
0:57:41 There’s things that you can do more immediately
0:57:42 to start making you money
0:57:45 versus these things that are like the longterm plays
0:57:47 that you hope eventually will make you a ton of money.
0:57:49 You just won’t see it on the front end.
0:57:52 So that’s the kind of questions to ask yourself
0:57:55 to figure out what side hustle is right for you.
0:57:56 Time, how much time do I have
0:57:58 and how much time am I willing to spend?
0:58:00 What kind of talents do I need
0:58:02 in order to do the thing that I wanna do?
0:58:04 Can I just do freelance social media?
0:58:05 If I’m a graphic designer, okay,
0:58:08 I’ll just become a freelance graphic designer on the side.
0:58:10 And then finally, do you want this thing to make you money?
0:58:13 And if so, how quickly does it have to make you money?
0:58:15 Because that’s gonna shift what you choose.
0:58:17 – And I think for me, when it comes to side hustle,
0:58:19 something that I want my listeners to remember
0:58:22 is that getting skills and experiences is so key
0:58:24 before you go out and branch
0:58:26 and start your own business and company.
0:58:29 And so don’t underestimate working in corporate
0:58:31 or working for another person
0:58:32 or getting an internship
0:58:35 and just really trying to get real life experience
0:58:36 that you can then monetize.
0:58:38 But you have to be good at something first,
0:58:41 typically when you’re starting a side hustle.
0:58:43 So I definitely wanna call that out.
0:58:44 The other thing I wanna call out
0:58:46 is that not all side hustles are sexy
0:58:49 and not all side hustles need to be something
0:58:51 that you’re passionate about.
0:58:52 Can you talk to us about that?
0:58:55 – Yeah, I don’t know if it’s a lie that’s fed to us
0:58:58 that your work has to be your calling.
0:58:59 No, there are many things
0:59:02 that you can do outside of work that give you happiness.
0:59:05 And as long as you feel like you’re compensated fairly
0:59:08 and you have a general like of a thing,
0:59:11 that doesn’t have to be your life’s work.
0:59:14 That is really like America.
0:59:15 You go anywhere in Europe and they’re like,
0:59:17 yeah, I work and it’s fine,
0:59:20 but I work so I can live, right?
0:59:22 A lot of us here are just living to work.
0:59:24 So your identity does not have to be your job
0:59:26 and I would argue shouldn’t.
0:59:27 I can take that advice for myself
0:59:29 because my identity has become my job
0:59:30 and become what I do.
0:59:32 So when you’re thinking about making money,
0:59:34 yeah, it definitely doesn’t have to be sexy.
0:59:35 It doesn’t have to be the thing
0:59:37 that looks good on Instagram.
0:59:39 It can be something that’s making you money
0:59:41 and giving you more financial security
0:59:44 and it doesn’t have to be your life’s work
0:59:46 or your like capital P passion.
0:59:48 It could just be something that makes you money.
0:59:49 And again, as long as you feel like
0:59:52 I am like motivated somewhat, right?
0:59:55 And it aligns with my values
0:59:56 or it’s something that I feel
0:59:58 like I’m getting compensated fairly at.
0:59:59 Cool, go for it.
1:00:04 – Tori, I end my show with two questions.
1:00:07 The first one is what is one actionable thing
1:00:09 our young and profitors can do today
1:00:11 to become more profitable tomorrow?
1:00:13 – Automate everything you possibly can.
1:00:16 Automate your savings, automate your investments,
1:00:17 automate your bills.
1:00:21 If something has the ability to be automated, do it.
1:00:24 I think we believe we get this gold star
1:00:26 if we make things harder than they have to be.
1:00:27 No, that’s not true.
1:00:28 Especially when it comes to personal finance,
1:00:31 if the option is available to you, automate it.
1:00:31 – I love that.
1:00:34 And what is your secret to profiting in life
1:00:36 and this can go beyond financial?
1:00:38 – I have realized over the past couple of years
1:00:40 that confidence is a self-worth issue
1:00:42 but no one’s talking about it like that.
1:00:45 The biggest question, which is very flattering
1:00:47 that I get asked other than a financial question
1:00:49 is like, how are you so confident?
1:00:51 Or like, how do you build your own confidence?
1:00:54 I believe myself worthy of every opportunity
1:00:57 of every piece of love and belonging.
1:01:00 When I walk into a date, it is not,
1:01:02 oh my God, is this person gonna like me?
1:01:05 It is, how does this person fit in with my life?
1:01:07 I’m not worried about how I’m presenting myself.
1:01:09 I’m just trying to figure out,
1:01:11 is this person worthy of me?
1:01:13 Is this relationship worthy of my time?
1:01:16 When I walk into a meeting with a client,
1:01:18 I am wondering how is this person going to seem
1:01:20 the value and the worth that I offer?
1:01:22 And if they’re not, it’s not of interest to me.
1:01:24 So in terms of building confidence,
1:01:26 financial confidence, career confidence,
1:01:30 relationship confidence, it is a self-worthiness issue.
1:01:33 If you believe yourself worthy of love and opportunity
1:01:36 and belonging and of every good thing,
1:01:38 you will not be shocked when all of that starts happening
1:01:40 in your life.
1:01:43 I have never once questioned if I’m worthy of those things.
1:01:46 I joke when I walk into a new therapist’s office,
1:01:47 there are many other things we’re gonna have to talk about,
1:01:49 but worthiness is not one of them.
1:01:52 So when you believe yourself worthy of those opportunities,
1:01:55 you will show up differently in every aspect of your life.
1:01:57 – That’s a very beautiful attitude to have, Tori.
1:02:00 Where can our listeners learn more about you,
1:02:03 your new book, your podcast?
1:02:04 – Thank you so much for having me.
1:02:07 I am @herfirsthunderk on all the socials,
1:02:09 H-E-R-F-I-R-S-T-1-0-0-K,
1:02:11 you can also go to herfirsthunderk.com,
1:02:13 and I host the Financial Feminist podcast,
1:02:16 and I wrote the book Financial Feminist.
1:02:18 – Amazing, we’ll stick all those links in the show notes.
1:02:21 Thank you so much, Tori, I really enjoyed this conversation.
1:02:22 – Thank you.
1:02:26 (upbeat music)
1:02:28 (upbeat music)
1:02:31 (upbeat music)
1:02:33 (upbeat music)
1:02:43 [BLANK_AUDIO]