Case Kenny: Mindfulness for Entrepreneurs, How to Gain Clarity and Make Smarter Decisions | E311

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0:01:10 Mindfulness is learning to talk to yourself.
0:01:14 I think it’s the most masculine and empowering thing you could do because it’s having a positive
0:01:17 internal dialogue and that manifests in great things.
0:01:21 Make trust your default, and you’ll earn more, you’ll be promoted more, and you’ll be happier.
0:01:24 Be soft and fluffy on the outside.
0:01:26 Don’t take any shit on the inside.
0:01:29 Anytime you speak up, you either get what you want or you get what you need.
0:01:32 Why do you think that there’s some positives related to our ego?
0:01:36 There is a healthy side of the ego, and it’s faith in yourself.
0:01:40 You should have some confidence, a little bit of swag, that no one’s out of your league,
0:01:44 that no business objectives out of your reach, that you could do these things.
0:01:47 And the humility side is, no matter what happens, you can handle it.
0:01:52 I’m a sucker for doing the difficult thing consistently because I’ve just seen what happens
0:01:55 when you’re consistent with those things that most people don’t want to do.
0:02:15 Young and Profiters, do you want to be more intentional with your life?
0:02:19 Do you need help with decision making and clarity?
0:02:25 If so, then you might need to start incorporating a mindfulness practice in your life.
0:02:29 Mindfulness is something that people tend to think is for sad people.
0:02:32 Mental health in general, people think is for sad people, but it’s not.
0:02:34 It’s for all people.
0:02:38 If you want clarity, if you want to live your life with purpose, if you want to feel super
0:02:43 fulfilled because you know yourself, you know what you want, then you need mindfulness.
0:02:47 And mindfulness simply is asking yourself really good questions.
0:02:52 Self-Q&A so that you can get clarity, so you can know what you want.
0:02:56 And we’ve got the best person today to talk to us about this mindfulness expert, Kase
0:02:57 Kenney.
0:03:00 Kase is an author, an entrepreneur.
0:03:03 He’s released many different self-guided journals.
0:03:08 He’s also a podcast host of a very popular podcast called New Mindset, Houdis.
0:03:12 And he’s an Instagram influencer famous for his quotes and his thoughts that he puts
0:03:13 on Instagram.
0:03:16 I’ve shared his quotes and thoughts hundreds of times.
0:03:18 I’m sure you guys have also shared them.
0:03:20 You can’t miss him on Instagram.
0:03:21 He’s very, very popular.
0:03:24 Today on the podcast, we’re going to talk about mindfulness.
0:03:28 We’re going to get into his new book, That’s Bold of You.
0:03:32 And we’re going to talk about Kase’s own life, journey, and career because there’s so many
0:03:35 lessons to unpack in that itself.
0:03:36 Let’s get right into it.
0:03:39 Here’s my conversation with Kase Kenney.
0:03:42 Kase, welcome to Young and Profiting Podcast.
0:03:43 Thanks for having me.
0:03:50 I’m really looking forward to this conversation and a lot of my listeners are male millennials.
0:03:54 And I’ve heard in the past that you’ve called yourself a dude bro guy.
0:03:58 And you also said that you share your feelings for a living.
0:04:03 And I know that a lot of guys have trouble sharing their feelings, showing emotion.
0:04:06 And so this first question is for all the boys.
0:04:10 Can you explain to us how mindfulness can still be masculine and why mindfulness is
0:04:12 something that every man should consider?
0:04:13 For sure.
0:04:18 As a millennial man myself, I think I can address that acutely.
0:04:22 Over the years, I’ve referred to myself as a dude bro guy just as a way to round myself
0:04:26 and the brand for people to let them know, really, that I’m just a regular guy.
0:04:27 Truly.
0:04:32 I don’t have a background in psychology or sociology or a training and some kind of
0:04:33 meditation technique or anything like that.
0:04:34 Really, really a regular guy.
0:04:35 Truly.
0:04:38 I like house music, lifting weights, Chipotle.
0:04:40 Those are my hierarchy of needs.
0:04:46 And when it comes to saying I share my feelings for a living, I say that to really break down
0:04:50 what mindfulness is and in the most practical way, because I think a lot of people, men
0:04:52 in particular, we think about mindfulness.
0:04:53 We hear this word.
0:04:55 Personally, I’m 36 in my 20s.
0:04:59 I used to think mindfulness was for other people because I would associate it with things
0:05:05 like energy and vibrations and chakras and abundance and these things that as a man,
0:05:09 a type, a hustle mentality type man was like, well, that can’t be for me.
0:05:10 Like I’m going to go out and get what I want.
0:05:11 I’m not going to manifest.
0:05:13 I’m just going to do the freaking thing.
0:05:16 I’m going to do the difficult things and I’m going to have a great result.
0:05:18 So I used to think that mindfulness was for other people.
0:05:22 It’s really when I came to understand how practical mindfulness is, how it truly is
0:05:27 for everyone, and specifically what it is that I came to really embrace its power and
0:05:31 why I encourage everyone, men, women, it doesn’t matter, but particularly men, to embrace
0:05:32 it.
0:05:36 I’ll even give you an example from something recent I did just to answer your question directly.
0:05:40 Why should men have a mindfulness practice?
0:05:41 Why should men share their feelings for a living?
0:05:47 I recently led a mental health mindfulness guided journaling session for the Raiders,
0:05:54 a group of 200 grown men, huge dudes who hit each other for a living doing these techniques,
0:05:58 feelings sharing techniques in the form of guided journaling.
0:06:02 And I’m not saying this just to create a nice narrative arc here, but they loved it.
0:06:04 They wanted more of it.
0:06:07 And I see it all the time with, I do a lot of work with athletes, but I see it all the
0:06:11 time with men, they love this kind of stuff.
0:06:14 When we break it down into what it really is and stop thinking that it’s this thing
0:06:21 for overly sensitive men, mindfulness, when I approach mindfulness, mindfulness is not
0:06:25 just knowing yourself and being present in how you feel.
0:06:28 That’s certainly a large part of mindfulness, happy to talk about it, but at its core, mindfulness
0:06:31 is learning to talk to yourself.
0:06:32 So we really think about that way.
0:06:33 It’s your internal dialogue.
0:06:36 How do you talk to yourself?
0:06:38 And I think men are all about training their bodies.
0:06:41 They’re all about lifting sports, these things.
0:06:46 A big part of that now in sports culture and masculine culture now is learning to train
0:06:47 your mind.
0:06:50 So I think it’s becoming a much more approachable topic when we break it down and we escape
0:06:57 the thing that sharing your feelings is a sensitive thing for people who are not masculine.
0:07:01 I think it’s the most masculine empowering thing you could do because it’s learning to
0:07:05 talk to yourself, having a positive internal dialogue, and that manifests in great things
0:07:10 and being a man and doing all the things that make a masculine man great, but it starts
0:07:11 there.
0:07:15 So yeah, I would start there as encouraging people to really redefine what they think
0:07:20 about when they think about sharing your feelings and making it much more practical and approachable.
0:07:21 Yeah.
0:07:24 And mindfulness is something that we hear a lot.
0:07:30 And even though I’ve done many podcasts on the topic, it’s still a little bit unclear
0:07:34 in terms of what mindfulness exactly is.
0:07:39 And when I was studying for this podcast, I heard you say that mindfulness is self-Q&A.
0:07:41 And I just thought that was such a good definition.
0:07:43 I’ve never really thought of it like that.
0:07:45 And it’s such a simple way of thinking about mindfulness.
0:07:51 So can you talk to us about why questions and asking yourself questions and asking why
0:07:54 is such an important part of mindfulness?
0:07:57 When I say it’s self-Q&A, I mean that in the most practical way possible.
0:08:02 There’s a reason that I choose journaling, guided journaling as my preferred method of
0:08:04 mindful practice.
0:08:08 There’s so many mindful practices and they’re all great from yoga to meditation, of course,
0:08:12 to therapy, to going on a walk, to doing sound therapy.
0:08:14 These are all great things that are mindful habits.
0:08:18 I think guided journaling is the best mindful habit because it encapsulates what I think
0:08:23 is the crux of mindfulness, which is self-inquiry, putting your feelings on trial.
0:08:25 It’s really asking yourself questions.
0:08:28 And I say that because, you know, a lot of times we think about mindfulness, again to
0:08:32 my point earlier, that mindfulness, mindfulness is being present.
0:08:35 Yes, that’s a big part of it, it’s being present, mind, body, it’s being present in
0:08:38 how you feel, it’s being non-judgmental of how you feel.
0:08:42 But I don’t think that’s quite enough because if you’re into any of the work of, say, Michael
0:08:47 Singer, learning about the subconscious mind and where do our thoughts originate, a lot
0:08:52 of the common understanding is that we don’t initiate a lot of our thoughts, we receive
0:08:54 a lot of our thoughts.
0:09:00 So if we’re only in receiving mode, in retention mode, and we’re not in intention mode, we’re
0:09:01 missing half the battle.
0:09:06 And that’s why when I say Q&A, Q&A is saying I receive these thoughts, maybe they’re mine,
0:09:07 maybe they’re not.
0:09:11 Now it’s time to figure that out with question, answer, question, answer.
0:09:16 And that’s why I say mindfulness isn’t just listening to yourself, it’s the second part,
0:09:18 which is talking to yourself.
0:09:19 And how do you know what to say to yourself?
0:09:22 How do you know what you need to say to yourself when you start asking yourself questions?
0:09:26 So that’s why Q&A, I think, is a really practical way to put it.
0:09:29 Guided journaling is a great way to bring that to life.
0:09:33 And then past journaling, it’s a matter of just living that as a mentality that when
0:09:37 you receive a feeling, you feel it, you receive it, you don’t judge it, but then you start
0:09:39 asking questions of it.
0:09:42 And that’s when you get to the bottom of whether you’re receiving it and initiating it with
0:09:46 or it needs some intention and some examination, but I think Q&A is a good way to describe
0:09:47 it.
0:09:53 Are there any signs or symptoms that you need more mindfulness in your life?
0:09:56 I think everyone needs more mindfulness in their life.
0:09:59 The reason that I started my whole journey into this, I think, is one that is probably
0:10:01 pretty common.
0:10:06 In my 20s, I very, very much identified with my job, which was great.
0:10:08 I worked in advertising technology sales.
0:10:09 It’s one of those hustle, hustle, hustle things.
0:10:10 You can make a lot of money.
0:10:12 You could do really well.
0:10:15 I really liked who I’d become over the course of that.
0:10:17 I started as an account executive at this company, worked my way up to regional vice
0:10:20 president as sales leader.
0:10:21 We close deals.
0:10:22 We take clients out.
0:10:23 We entertain.
0:10:24 We close deals.
0:10:28 Really, I’d become type A, could turn on the charisma, do this thing.
0:10:33 That was me on the outside, but on the inside, I really did not feel like I knew who I was
0:10:35 at all as a man, as a person.
0:10:39 I felt like I was borrowing a lot of definitions of happiness, success, timelines, all these
0:10:40 things.
0:10:44 For me, the catalyst for all this, maybe some people can relate to, is I just felt like
0:10:46 there were so many different versions of me.
0:10:49 There was work case, and dating case, and friend case, all these different things.
0:10:50 I was like, “I don’t like that fact.
0:10:51 I just want to be one person.”
0:10:55 I’m sure you maybe behave different in different settings because of practicality, but I did
0:10:59 not like the fact that I felt like I was borrowing and rushing, and I had all these different
0:11:00 masks that I would put on.
0:11:06 I want to be this one person, and I want to say why I’m this one person, and where that
0:11:07 truth is coming from.
0:11:08 I’m not borrowing it from other people.
0:11:09 That’s why I started the podcast.
0:11:13 I would just hop on the podcast without a guest, and for like 20 minutes, I would just
0:11:16 take a feeling or a question, and I would examine it.
0:11:20 So that, at the end of it, I could say, “Here’s what I believe, and here’s where it came
0:11:24 from,” as opposed to, “I believe this thing, but I don’t really know why, I don’t really
0:11:25 know where it came from.”
0:11:29 I think a lot of people, we’re not bad people, but a lot of people live that way.
0:11:34 We have certain ideals, and timelines, and values even that we just have, but we don’t
0:11:37 know where they came from, or why we believe them.
0:11:40 I think in that instance, we need mindfulness.
0:11:44 We need introspection to say, “I believe this because, and here’s the experiences in my
0:11:45 life that led me to it.”
0:11:51 That is the power of mindfulness, and the matter of identity, and then we all need mindfulness
0:11:56 when it comes to stress, and anxiety, and dating, and all these areas of life where we’re
0:11:59 so quick to jump to conclusions.
0:12:03 Mindfulness is the pause in that that allows us to then initiate some Q&A, and then come
0:12:09 up with, “In my world, I’m really into encouraging optimism,” but to come up with more hopeful
0:12:12 conclusions about life.
0:12:16 Whether it’s your character, who am I, rushing, borrowing, or it’s in the immediate, reacting
0:12:20 to stress, I think we all need an element of mindfulness, certainly.
0:12:25 I have a quote from you that I think kind of relates to this, the fact that mindfulness
0:12:29 is something that you kind of always need, it’s something that never really ends, there’s
0:12:32 always going to be things that come up, and you’re going to need to figure out and think
0:12:33 them through.
0:12:38 You said, “I understand that there’s no right way to live my life, but there is a wrong
0:12:39 way.”
0:12:41 The wrong way is to think that there’s a right way.
0:12:45 To assume there’s a right way would be happy, a right way to have a career, a right way
0:12:48 to be in a relationship, to be successful, to be fulfilled.
0:12:50 Can you help us understand what you mean by this?
0:12:51 Yeah.
0:12:55 Yeah, that’s always the sound bite that I dropped, so you got ahead of it before I would just
0:12:56 say that to you anyway.
0:13:00 The idea is that there are so many areas of life where we think there’s a right way to
0:13:02 do things, and maybe there is a right way.
0:13:06 Maybe there absolutely is a right way to be in a healthy relationship, to start a business,
0:13:07 to be profitable.
0:13:10 Maybe there actually is a textbook right way.
0:13:15 I’ve found so much freedom and truth, although I always think it’s funny when people say,
0:13:16 “What is my truth?”
0:13:21 But there is clarity when it comes to figuring out what works for me.
0:13:26 If we’re always caught in a cycle of trying to emulate other people’s right way or only
0:13:30 doing what our parents told us was the right way or previous generations, we’re stuck in
0:13:32 a cycle that truly doesn’t allow us to breathe.
0:13:36 That sounds more rebellious than it needs to be, but I really think a life truly lived,
0:13:40 a life where you’re saying, “Okay, I’ll be inspired by other people, I’ll look to other
0:13:43 people, but I’m going to figure out what is the right way.”
0:13:46 I think this is just so helpful across the board.
0:13:47 Two examples.
0:13:51 One, my life as an entrepreneur, I joke that I share my feelings for a living, but that’s
0:13:53 kind of a unique profession.
0:13:57 I’m an author, I’m a podcaster, I’m these new age things that are becoming more and
0:14:02 more doable and achievable, but I had a great career before this, and I threw it all the
0:14:05 way to do something that is so out of left field for me.
0:14:08 My brother’s a cardiologist, went to Harvard.
0:14:11 My mom was a lawyer, very traditional career paths.
0:14:17 If I, back in the day, before I started getting into mindfulness and self-introspection, if
0:14:20 I would have said, “Kase, you’re going to quit your job and you’re going to write quotes
0:14:23 on the internet for a living,” I would have said, “That’s a ridiculous thing.”
0:14:25 Of course not, because that’s not the right way, right?
0:14:26 Just practically, I would have said.
0:14:28 So that’s example one.
0:14:32 Example two is I talk a lot about dating, but in dating, I think that one of the quickest
0:14:37 ways to give yourself anxious thoughts that are so unnecessary, even one of the quickest
0:14:42 ways to ruin your relationship is to look at other people’s relationships and say, “Well,
0:14:43 that’s the right way.
0:14:45 Mine doesn’t look exactly like that.
0:14:48 Therefore, mine’s the wrong way,” even though it’s a perfectly healthy relationship, or
0:14:53 you look at the latest hottest influencer and what she or he is saying that they need in
0:14:57 a relationship and you’re like, “Well, I don’t really want that or need that, or my needs
0:14:58 are different.
0:14:59 Maybe there’s something wrong with me.”
0:15:03 We’re so quick to add this anxiety to our life that it’s not necessary because we’ve
0:15:10 defined things by right and wrong, the way, my way, and I think there’s such a form of
0:15:15 both peace and power that comes from deciding what is right for you.
0:15:20 This goes across the board, but it’s basically just not … I hate to be like, “I was like,
0:15:24 don’t just do what you’re told,” but I think there is an element here of introspection that
0:15:28 comes down to the ultimate question for mindfulness, which is why?
0:15:29 Where is that why coming from?
0:15:30 Is it coming from theory?
0:15:33 Is it coming from what you’ve been told, or is it coming from your experience?
0:15:38 Our experience is for, in my line of mindfulness, there’s different kinds of mindfulness.
0:15:40 There’s more spiritual, esoteric mindfulness.
0:15:44 For me, my mindfulness is almost like being a lawyer.
0:15:45 Here’s the evidence.
0:15:46 Here’s the conclusion.
0:15:48 Jerry, what is your verdict?
0:15:49 I’ve lived through this.
0:15:51 I believe this.
0:15:54 Here’s what I’m capable of based on what I believe because of my experiences.
0:15:57 I’ve lived through A. I believe B. And so on and so forth.
0:16:01 And I think that is the power for us to decide what is right for me, might not be right for
0:16:02 other people.
0:16:04 What’s wrong for someone else?
0:16:07 Someone says, “Kasey, you can’t make a living from sharing your feelings online.”
0:16:08 That might be right for me.
0:16:11 And I think there’s just freedom that comes from embracing the bridge between those two.
0:16:17 I’d love to stick on your personal story for a minute here because I think a lot of people
0:16:20 are in the shoes that you once were when you were in corporate.
0:16:22 You’ve got these other desires.
0:16:24 You’ve got an amazing, cushy job.
0:16:26 You’re worried about what’s going to happen.
0:16:30 If you leave that all behind, if you fail, you’ve got the pressure of your family who’s
0:16:34 really successful and had traditional jobs.
0:16:39 So talk to us about how you guided yourself to make the decision to follow your dreams
0:16:42 and to become an entrepreneur and a podcaster.
0:16:43 Yeah.
0:16:44 I think about this a lot.
0:16:45 There’s a couple of elements.
0:16:49 For one, there was a timing element, which I think is the most important element ever.
0:16:50 When do you make that jump?
0:16:52 There’s no right or wrong answer here.
0:16:55 From my experience, I see a lot of people jump too early.
0:17:02 I think having leverage when you leave your day job to move into full time into your entrepreneurial
0:17:05 effort, your creative effort, whatever it is, leverage is the most important thing you
0:17:06 can have.
0:17:10 That is financial leverage, of course, but also decision making leverage.
0:17:15 I did the podcast for almost three years concurrent to my job.
0:17:16 I would run the sales team.
0:17:17 I would travel twice a week.
0:17:18 I was out of Chicago.
0:17:21 I’m in Miami now, but I was out of Chicago and I would go to St. Louis in Kansas City
0:17:24 and I would run the region and I was traveling twice a week.
0:17:29 Then I would produce two episodes a week of the podcast, found a way to make it work.
0:17:32 Somewhere along the way, I started to find a way to make money.
0:17:35 I started to create and sell these guided journals.
0:17:38 I started getting these proof points, “Oh, there is a business model.
0:17:40 It’s not just fanciful thinking.
0:17:44 I’ve got historical data to support that I can make money every month, five grand, ten
0:17:46 grand,” so on and so forth.
0:17:51 I started to create some proof that this was possible and then COVID hit.
0:17:52 It pumped the brakes on all my travels.
0:17:54 I said, “Well, I’ve got some free time here.”
0:17:57 Really started to dive into social, posting more on social.
0:18:01 There was this large and heightened demand on the e-commerce front as well as demand
0:18:02 for wellness products.
0:18:06 I went from selling a couple of journals a day to hundreds a day.
0:18:10 The thing blasted off and it became very apparent that I’m making more money doing this than
0:18:11 my day job.
0:18:15 Here’s a real opportunity, but back to my point about leverage.
0:18:20 If I had jumped too soon, I would have lost all that leverage, specifically in the form
0:18:21 of decision-making leverage.
0:18:26 When you leave too soon and you jump into your effort, and let’s say you’re a creator
0:18:31 or a writer or a podcast host and you rely on maybe advertising or collaborations and
0:18:35 things like that, when you’re not making money, when you don’t have the financial foundation
0:18:39 of a day job, money comes to you, opportunity comes to you, you basically have to take it
0:18:42 to survive and it takes out that decision-making leverage.
0:18:47 I left after having a couple of years’ worth of the data and the support and I could turn
0:18:48 down deals.
0:18:49 I could continue to say, “Here’s the brand.
0:18:52 I’m not just going to take money because I need it.”
0:18:56 I think that was really, really important to me, especially in the wellness space where
0:18:57 I’m not an influencer.
0:19:01 I don’t really do brand deals, but there was some time there where I was like, “Well,
0:19:02 I might need to.
0:19:03 I need the money.
0:19:04 I need to do these things.”
0:19:09 I think having been more patient, leaving the job, allowed me to leave and then continue
0:19:10 saying, “Nope.
0:19:11 This is what case is.
0:19:12 This is what I represent.
0:19:13 I don’t have to do these things.”
0:19:18 I think that was really important to me and at a certain point, just with the timing and
0:19:22 COVID and more time on my hands, I just realized if I poured more energy into this, I could
0:19:23 do it.
0:19:28 I had years’ worth of data before to really put some fire on that.
0:19:32 Let’s hold that thought and take a quick break with our sponsors.
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0:24:22 We have a lot of similarities in our own stories.
0:24:31 So for example, I had a blog, a very popular entertainment news blog in 2012, 13, 14.
0:24:34 I also started my podcast in 2018.
0:24:40 I also quit my corporate job over COVID to start my social agency and now podcast network.
0:24:41 So you took a different route.
0:24:46 You did more of like the authoring and the journaling and really focused on becoming
0:24:48 a huge Instagram star.
0:24:51 I really focused on building a company as well as my podcast.
0:24:56 So we kind of take a different route, but I’d love to understand, even though you had
0:25:02 this traditional job, you were still doing what I call opportunity set Bs, right?
0:25:05 So opportunity set A is what you get paid for at your job.
0:25:09 Opportunity set B is just anything else you can learn outside of your job.
0:25:14 For example, you starting a blog because that was your own thing.
0:25:15 You created that blog, right?
0:25:18 And that was while you were working your corporate job.
0:25:24 So talk to us about how that experience lent itself for you to even have confidence to
0:25:28 become a podcaster and do your own thing because I think it’s probably all tied together.
0:25:29 Yeah.
0:25:30 Oh, I like that a lot.
0:25:31 I think about that a lot too.
0:25:34 I’ve got a lot of empathy for people who are like, I don’t know, investment bankers
0:25:38 during the day, but rappers at night where there’s not a whole lot of oversight, not
0:25:42 a lot of transfer of skills, although maybe there is that I’m not thinking about.
0:25:47 But for me, I started a blog called Pursuit in 2014.
0:25:53 I go way back with trying things on the side, but I’m super grateful that I was in advertising
0:25:59 and sales specifically and creative expression on the side.
0:26:03 The confidence I got from my day job, walking into a meeting, having to entertain people,
0:26:08 having to find a reason to strike up a conversation with people, having confidence in speaking
0:26:13 and leading and empathy and working with a team so transferable immediately to this.
0:26:18 Nowadays, I do a lot of public speaking and workshops with sports teams and corporate
0:26:19 groups.
0:26:23 I used to really be an introvert and I used to be really averse to public speaking truly.
0:26:25 And now I love it.
0:26:28 And it’s not because I’ve been doing a lot more now.
0:26:32 It was because of the eight years I ran a sales team and had to grow into that.
0:26:34 So those skills were so transferable.
0:26:38 And then also I would say there’s something about working in sales in particular about,
0:26:42 again, I was an introvert, started as an account executive, I was like, “Oh, little me.
0:26:43 I’m going to sell a deal.”
0:26:46 And by the end of it, I was like, “Yeah, I’m going to sell a deal.
0:26:47 Give me a bigger goal.
0:26:48 Let’s do this.
0:26:49 I want more commission.”
0:26:54 I grew so much confidence in my ability to go from a book of business of zero to selling
0:26:57 in to Fortune 500 companies.
0:26:59 I could go from zero to nothing.
0:27:04 And I think that really gave me the confidence on this side to say, “I can go from having
0:27:08 no social presence to having a bit large social presence or having no books to having a book
0:27:10 deal and a best seller and these kinds of things.”
0:27:15 So I think those skills were very transferable and really helped me.
0:27:19 And I think it was right time, right place for sure for a lot of that.
0:27:23 And I’m very grateful for a lot of the perspective I learned along the way.
0:27:28 And I think I’m a very impatient person, truthfully, if I had to wait for an elevator or someone’s
0:27:30 walking slow on the sidewalk, it really irks me.
0:27:35 But I think there was something that I’m really grateful for where my intuition was saying,
0:27:37 “Just be patient when it comes to the right time.”
0:27:41 So that when I did do that jump, I had that confidence in place.
0:27:44 And I think that’s guided me even three years later in the right direction.
0:27:48 I think the other thing is your consistency, the fact that when you were in a corporate
0:27:53 job, you were saying even while traveling and having this full-time job, you were doing
0:27:55 two episodes a week.
0:28:00 Talk to us about your ability to be consistent and how you had the motivation when you first
0:28:01 started.
0:28:04 I know you did get quite a bit of downloads when you first started, but what kept you
0:28:08 going before you were the super popular podcaster?
0:28:10 First off is what I referenced earlier.
0:28:12 I started the podcast for myself.
0:28:16 Someone messaged me the other day and they said, “Kase, can you give me some advice to
0:28:18 be a successful podcaster?”
0:28:21 And I wrote back and I said, “Don’t try to be a successful podcaster.
0:28:24 Get a mission and use a podcast to amplify the mission.
0:28:29 That’s the only way in social, in podcasting, in writing, you can’t just want to be an author
0:28:31 or be a content creator.
0:28:36 You have to have a fire for a thing and then you use the platform to amplify it.”
0:28:38 For me, I never wanted to be a podcaster.
0:28:40 I wanted to know myself better, truthfully.
0:28:43 I know that sounds a little noble and like a nice little soundbite.
0:28:46 That was the only reason I started the podcast.
0:28:50 Alongside of wanting to be creative, I’ve always been creative and I love writing and
0:28:55 expressing myself, but I truly started the podcast because I was frustrated with myself.
0:28:58 And that’s always kept me going 630 episodes later.
0:29:00 You can’t help but grow.
0:29:03 You talk about the 10,000 hour rule, whether that’s real or not.
0:29:07 I’ve done so much more than that and I’ve grown and reinvented myself so many times
0:29:11 and I have so much clarity into myself that I can’t help but grow every single time I
0:29:12 sit down and do the podcast.
0:29:14 So I’ve always been motivated to do it twice a week.
0:29:18 And to your point, I was traveling twice a week.
0:29:21 I would be doing the podcast in the back of an Uber.
0:29:22 I would be writing it.
0:29:24 I would be getting to the hotel late and recording it.
0:29:28 I’d bring my mic with me on the road.
0:29:33 It was difficult, but I think it was a combination of what I just described, that internal drive.
0:29:34 And then also, I got lucky.
0:29:39 I remember my first month, I got 56,000 downloads, which at our size were privileged to have
0:29:40 large podcasts.
0:29:43 Now, that’s not a lot, but it’s not insignificant.
0:29:47 And for a first one month podcast, that’s actually quite a bit.
0:29:48 And I owe that to a couple of different things.
0:29:49 Good timing.
0:29:52 I had an email list at the time and it helped grow some of that.
0:29:53 But I saw that.
0:29:57 I was like, “Wow, if I could do that in one month, what could I do in a year?”
0:30:01 And I was like, “I’m not going to stop until I have at least 50 episodes under my belt.”
0:30:07 And just committing to that 50 by the end of the 50, I was well beyond 50,000 downloads
0:30:08 a month.
0:30:10 And I was like, “Wow, let’s just keep going.”
0:30:15 And by that time, the podcast had become a routine as simple as breathing.
0:30:19 I know that sounds more poetic than it needs to be to describe releasing a podcast.
0:30:22 But for me, it’s like, I do it twice a week.
0:30:26 Every Sunday and every Wednesday, I sit down and I write and I record and I release just
0:30:27 what I do.
0:30:29 It’s not, “Oh gosh, I’ve got to come up with content.
0:30:31 What is my content strategy?”
0:30:34 It’s like, “No, I’m just going to do the thing because that’s what I do on Sundays.
0:30:36 That’s what I do on Wednesdays.”
0:30:37 So for me, it’s become that simple.
0:30:41 It’s a lifestyle at this point and it works for me.
0:30:46 It’s all those things combined and creating evidence for yourself of why you should continue.
0:30:51 Get out of theory, get out of writing down your goals and just starting the thing, putting
0:30:55 it on paper, seeing what people say, using that to inspire you, listen to your followers,
0:30:56 all those things.
0:31:00 But yeah, for me, it always did start though with why I started it in the first place.
0:31:01 I love that.
0:31:07 I also love that you took sort of a self journaling approach and you really just kept your podcast
0:31:08 yourself.
0:31:09 So many people go the interview route.
0:31:14 That’s the route that I ended up going with for majority of my episodes.
0:31:18 And when I look back, because I started my podcast in 2018 as well and similar to you,
0:31:19 I had a corporate job.
0:31:26 I’m so proud of Young Hala for doing episodes every week, even when nobody was listening.
0:31:32 And to your point, my why was bigger than just wanting to be a popular podcast.
0:31:36 I literally just wanted to help people and had a lot of fun.
0:31:41 I had a volunteer team helping me with my podcast and even just building something with
0:31:43 somebody else was something that I was enjoying.
0:31:45 It wasn’t like a selfish thing.
0:31:47 So I always give that advice too.
0:31:51 You’ve got to want it and want to help people and want to improve your own life.
0:31:56 And it shouldn’t just be this goal of making money or becoming some huge podcaster.
0:31:57 Yeah.
0:31:58 Yeah, agreed.
0:31:59 We’re very similar.
0:32:00 It’s funny how similar we are.
0:32:04 I bet if you were to look at podcasters who have been doing it for more than five years,
0:32:09 we’d probably find the commonality that we share that the mission was first and the channel,
0:32:11 the means was second.
0:32:15 I bet we would find that common because I think there’s a stat that I see passed around
0:32:20 a lot, you know, 99% of podcasts released less than 10 episodes or something like people
0:32:21 give up so fast.
0:32:22 Yeah.
0:32:23 Yeah.
0:32:24 It’s a crazy number.
0:32:28 And it’s probably because of a couple of things here, the mission, the lack of maybe
0:32:31 immediate results, all these things that derail people.
0:32:32 Totally.
0:32:33 Okay.
0:32:35 Let’s move on to your latest book.
0:32:36 You released it last year.
0:32:38 It’s called That’s Bold of You.
0:32:42 So similar to mindfulness, you can interpret it in many different ways.
0:32:45 So what does being bold mean to you?
0:32:47 I’m an author and I read on Instagram.
0:32:51 My whole day is about words, word choice, 12, 14 word, little short little senses.
0:32:53 So I live in words.
0:32:59 And on that note, you know, over the years, I’ve really leaned into trying to break down
0:33:04 the identities that we give ourselves, specifically the words that we use to describe ourselves.
0:33:07 Those are other words that other people have called us.
0:33:11 You’re too much, you’re too needy, you’re too intense, you’re too quiet, you’re too loud
0:33:15 across the board, these things, and that we’ve internalized and say, well, maybe I am.
0:33:20 And the way that we let perception, right, the way that we let feedback, the way that
0:33:25 we let our parents, the way we let the internet basically create our identities for us unless
0:33:26 we push back.
0:33:27 So I think it’s a bold thing.
0:33:31 That’s why I call it That’s Bold of You to allow yourself to push back against these
0:33:34 identities and decide that, well, maybe they are true.
0:33:38 Maybe you are too intense, but maybe that is a good thing for X, Y, Z reasons.
0:33:43 So basically, it’s a mindful examination of who you are and why you are that way.
0:33:48 And the reason I wrote the book was I’m all in on vulnerability, not like sappy vulnerability,
0:33:52 not like feelings, time vulnerability, but just being radically honest about how you
0:33:53 feel.
0:33:54 So we don’t have to beat around the bush.
0:33:55 We don’t have to guess.
0:33:58 We don’t have to play mental gymnastics, none of that, whether it’s in dating or business
0:34:00 or friends or just with yourself.
0:34:07 We say how we feel and we act upon how we feel and we’re clear and we’re healthy about it.
0:34:08 Vulnerability.
0:34:09 Right?
0:34:10 Vulnerability.
0:34:12 I read this study that really kicked off the book called the beautiful mess effect, which
0:34:16 was basically these social scientists and these researchers were looking at the fact
0:34:19 that we applaud certain qualities in other people.
0:34:22 We like weird, wild, eccentric people.
0:34:23 We like honest people.
0:34:25 We like that friend who’s like, “Oh, he’s so real.
0:34:26 He’s got no filter.
0:34:27 We love that.”
0:34:28 In general, right?
0:34:29 Not on the extreme.
0:34:33 So in general, we like people who are real, a little out there quirky, a little too loud,
0:34:34 a little too this.
0:34:38 We like that and other people, but for some reason, when we think about ourselves being
0:34:42 that same way, we pass so much unfair judgment upon ourselves and we say, “Well, I can’t
0:34:47 be that way because people won’t appreciate that quality in me, even though we said we
0:34:48 like that quality in other people.”
0:34:52 So the beautiful mess effect was basically saying, “Why do we applaud the beautiful mess
0:34:54 in other people, but in ourselves, we detest it?”
0:34:58 And they ran all these participants through these studies to basically show that across
0:35:01 the board, there’s a bit of hypocrisy there.
0:35:04 It was one instance where they took these two groups of people.
0:35:08 They had one group and said, “Hey, you’re about to go into this room and there’s going
0:35:10 to be a group of people in there and you’re going to sing this song to them.
0:35:12 You’ve never sang this song before.
0:35:13 It’s going to be awkward.
0:35:15 You’re going to go in there and sing it.
0:35:16 Get ready.”
0:35:17 The other group, they said, “Hey, by the way, these people are going to come in and sing
0:35:18 a song to you.”
0:35:21 And right before they did it, they asked each group, “Hey, how do you think this is going
0:35:23 to be received?”
0:35:25 The group that was told that they’re about to sing, they were like, “Well, this is going
0:35:26 to be horrible.
0:35:27 They’re going to laugh at me.
0:35:28 They’re going to think I’m an idiot.
0:35:29 It’s going to be me.”
0:35:30 So on and so forth.
0:35:31 Very condemning, very judgmental.
0:35:34 To the group that they told, “Hey, you’re about to have these people come sing to you.
0:35:35 What do you think?
0:35:36 How are you going to react?”
0:35:37 They said, “Well, it doesn’t really matter.
0:35:38 I applaud them for doing that.
0:35:39 That’s awkward.
0:35:40 That’s vulnerable.
0:35:41 I applaud that.
0:35:42 I like that.”
0:35:46 So basically showcasing the idea that we’re all in our heads about these vulnerable things.
0:35:51 And then they ran other tests too about asking for help, exposing your body in a vulnerable
0:35:55 way, expressing your feelings first, all these different vulnerable acts.
0:35:59 And across the board, it was always, “They will hate it if I do it.”
0:36:02 But across the board, the judgment was, “This is a great thing.”
0:36:07 And that always really struck me as a glimpse into humanity of a little bit how hypocritical
0:36:12 we are when it comes to judging ourselves for these things that are unfair.
0:36:16 So basically I wrote the book from that perspective, that it’s a bold thing to push back against
0:36:20 our programming, our conditioning, our judgment.
0:36:24 So it’s basically a book about being kinder to yourself, but in an informed way.
0:36:28 And to not be so conforming in life.
0:36:32 I want to dig deeper on being vulnerable.
0:36:38 And I want to talk about dating for a second, because I feel like that with dating is especially
0:36:39 relevant right now.
0:36:44 Because in the online dating world, a lot of people have the impression that they’ve
0:36:50 got to be cold, maybe not make the first move necessarily, especially if they’re a woman
0:36:54 or not show their soft side, because they’re afraid of being hurt, right?
0:36:57 They don’t want to get ghosted, they don’t want bad things to happen.
0:37:02 So can you talk to us about how being vulnerable can actually be something that is attractive
0:37:05 and maybe talk to us about how we should rethink that?
0:37:06 Yeah.
0:37:10 I’ll instead, in the traditional way I do, but I’ll actually add some very, very recent
0:37:11 sauce to that.
0:37:15 I released an episode yesterday, because I read this piece of research in the Harvard
0:37:20 Business Review about why optimism in life literally makes you happier and makes you
0:37:23 more money and it makes you more fulfilled.
0:37:26 I see vulnerability and optimism as two sides of the same coin.
0:37:30 And basically the research showed, and HBR of course is about in the workplace, so it’s
0:37:34 about workplace professionals earning more, being happier and being more fulfilled.
0:37:38 And it basically showed that cynics, people who are cynical, right, cynical in the sense
0:37:43 of everyone’s out to get me, I need to protect myself first, I only match energy, a little
0:37:49 bit of Machiavellian tactics, right, a little bit of manipulation, little doggy dog kind
0:37:50 of world.
0:37:55 It showed that people who believe that about the world, that people are inherently dishonest
0:37:58 and that maybe you should play some games too.
0:38:02 People who believe that the world is competitive and you need to step on some people’s necks
0:38:03 to be successful.
0:38:08 They showed that those people are across the board, they earn less than their optimistic
0:38:12 counterparts, they’re promoted less than their optimistic counterparts, and across
0:38:15 the board they showed less satisfaction in their jobs.
0:38:19 I take that as a microcosm of larger happiness, right, I think there’s definitely a lot to
0:38:24 be said about the workplace versus life, but they showed that to be very true.
0:38:29 And the suggestion of the research was make trust your default and you’ll earn more, you’ll
0:38:31 be promoted more and you’ll be happier.
0:38:35 And there’s a fine line between being trustful and being naive, but it basically said, look
0:38:39 for the best than others, offer your energy first instead of only being the person who
0:38:43 receives and waits to see what they do and then you make your move because everyone’s
0:38:44 got to move.
0:38:49 So instead of all that crap, you just make trust your default and you’d be a kind, hopeful,
0:38:51 optimistic person, which is very much in my ethos.
0:38:55 But I think that is a very relevant way to approach dating.
0:39:00 I think we’ve all gotten into our heads and our hearts in different ways that have made
0:39:03 us so resistant to being open.
0:39:04 And a lot of it’s for a good reason, right?
0:39:09 If we’ve been hurt in the past, maybe multiple times, maybe it happens to us so many times
0:39:13 when we’ve been disappointed so many times, we can’t help but feel that the whole world
0:39:14 is that way.
0:39:18 I would never dismiss that, of course, because our experiences shape our reality.
0:39:23 But a lot of the time, we’re taking little tidbits of our reality, which is real and
0:39:29 valid and hurtful, and we’re adding to it a whole variety of projection to everyone
0:39:30 else.
0:39:33 And that leads to a lot of the things that you described and that I talk a lot about,
0:39:34 right?
0:39:40 We want someone else to make the first move or we don’t trust anyone at first.
0:39:43 We’re resistant to speaking up for our needs, all these things that just back us further
0:39:45 into that cycle.
0:39:51 So there’s not much great advice I can give other than, “Don’t do that,” but perhaps
0:39:55 with a bit of the research and then a little bit of logic.
0:39:57 I do a lot of dating content.
0:40:00 I don’t ever do dating content around tactics or how to get someone.
0:40:02 What do I freaking know?
0:40:06 But I do know when it comes to the idea of vulnerability in dating, you win every time
0:40:07 when you’re vulnerable.
0:40:09 I really, really do believe that.
0:40:12 And most practically, when I say vulnerable, I mean speaking up for yourself, advocating
0:40:13 for yourself.
0:40:17 What I need, asking questions, speaking up to how you feel.
0:40:22 And 99% of the times when I receive feedback or questions from people, all of the things
0:40:26 that they talk about are solvable through communication.
0:40:31 I know it’s a boring topic, but the way that I really break it down about vulnerability
0:40:36 and dating is anytime you speak up, anytime you’re vulnerable, you either get one of two
0:40:37 things.
0:40:39 And both of those things always help you win.
0:40:42 Anytime you speak up, you either get what you want or you get what you need.
0:40:44 Both of those things always, always help you.
0:40:45 You either get what you want.
0:40:48 You speak up and say, “Hey, you said this thing that makes me feel a certain way.
0:40:49 What are your intentions?”
0:40:50 You get what you want.
0:40:51 They say, “Oh, sorry.
0:40:52 That was confusing.
0:40:53 Here’s what I actually mean.”
0:40:54 Turns out you’re on the same page.
0:40:55 Amazing.
0:40:56 You just needed to talk it out.
0:40:59 On the get what you need side, you say, “Hey, that thing you did or this thing I’m noticing
0:41:01 about your behavior, what does it mean?
0:41:02 Let’s talk about this.”
0:41:03 They say, “Oh, yeah.
0:41:04 No, you’re right.
0:41:05 You caught me.
0:41:06 I’m not really into this.
0:41:07 I’ve been messing with you,” whatever.
0:41:08 That hurts.
0:41:11 That’s what you need because now you can move on and you’re not in that holding pattern
0:41:12 anymore.
0:41:15 I know that’s oversimplified and it’s not as easy as just snapping your fingers, having
0:41:19 a conversation, but that is vulnerability in its most practical form.
0:41:24 For me, mindfulness isn’t always this soft butterflies and rainbows thing.
0:41:26 Sometimes it’s mantra, it’s case.
0:41:32 Right now, you’re feeling confused or trapped in this relationship or you’re feeling used
0:41:33 or whatever negative feeling.
0:41:35 Get what you want or get what you need.
0:41:36 Case.
0:41:37 Get what you want.
0:41:38 Get what you need.
0:41:42 Get yourself to have that conversation because you understand what’s on the opposite side
0:41:43 of that.
0:41:45 That’s what I would say a combination of those two things.
0:41:47 Make trust your default.
0:41:49 Be soft and fluffy on the outside.
0:41:51 Don’t take any shit on the inside.
0:41:52 Speak to what you want.
0:41:53 Get what you want.
0:41:54 Get what you need.
0:42:00 I think that’ll really help people get out of this funk where it’s them against the world,
0:42:02 which I think just doesn’t benefit anyone.
0:42:04 I really, really love that framing.
0:42:09 Something else I wanted to pick your brain about is your perspective on how we should
0:42:11 frame our past.
0:42:15 I always say that you need a happy past and you need an exciting future if you want to
0:42:19 live a content life where you’re not anxious and you’re feeling positive.
0:42:22 You need a happy past, an exciting future.
0:42:26 I’d love for you to help us understand how we should think about our past and how we
0:42:28 should treat our past.
0:42:29 Yeah.
0:42:32 Certainly, there’s areas of life that I love to talk about.
0:42:35 I don’t particularly like to talk about past traumas and things like that.
0:42:38 That’s for a serious mental health care professional.
0:42:44 For me, though, I think about my past as the ultimate piece of clarity in my life.
0:42:50 I love to oversimplify things, but you think about why are certain things good because
0:42:51 of the bad things?
0:42:55 What makes a healthy love, unfortunately, unhealthy love?
0:43:00 What makes a communicative understanding patient partner, someone who always rushed you, someone
0:43:03 who never took time to understand you?
0:43:05 The unfortunate reality of life is we need contrast.
0:43:06 We do.
0:43:11 It’s one of those things that in the midst of contrast, you would never say, “I need
0:43:12 this contrast.
0:43:13 This is good.
0:43:14 We need this.
0:43:15 We needed rain today.
0:43:16 It’s been dry out.”
0:43:17 We don’t think like that when it comes to pain.
0:43:20 We are wired to avoid pain.
0:43:23 Most specifically, we are wired to avoid repeated pain.
0:43:26 We will do anything to avoid making the same mistake twice.
0:43:30 Perhaps that’s what leads us to be so closed off to our previous point.
0:43:32 But our pasts are powerful.
0:43:37 Our pasts are the source of contrast, which is the source of clarity in our life.
0:43:42 I talk a lot about standards and boundaries and fear that a lot of people have of being
0:43:43 too picky.
0:43:47 If I had a conversation around that 99% of the time that comes up, “I don’t want to
0:43:48 be too picky.”
0:43:49 Okay.
0:43:51 Well, let’s figure out if you’re being too picky or not.
0:43:53 Let’s figure out if that’s actually a valid thing.
0:43:58 I talk to people and sometimes I break down standards into standards 1.0 and standards
0:43:59 2.0.
0:44:01 2.0 are theoretical standards.
0:44:03 Standards that you’ll borrow from TikTok.
0:44:06 You deserve someone who does this and does that.
0:44:09 Things that are inspired by other people’s examples.
0:44:10 Things that sound good on paper.
0:44:12 Things that your parents told you.
0:44:13 Back to our original conversation.
0:44:17 Just because someone said something’s right for them doesn’t mean it’s right for you.
0:44:18 That’s standard 1.
0:44:19 1.0.
0:44:20 It’s good.
0:44:21 We’re not going to argue with it.
0:44:22 We’re not going to say that’s not true.
0:44:24 Standards 2.0 come from your experiences.
0:44:29 I lived through this past painful experience in my past.
0:44:31 Here is why I believe my standard to be true.
0:44:37 When you have a past that validates your standard, I consider that to be rather unbreakable and
0:44:39 a non-negotiable for yourself.
0:44:43 That’s why in the present, you can look yourself in the mirror and you’re on that line where
0:44:47 you’re being like, “Man, maybe I am being too needy and I’m asking for too much.”
0:44:48 No.
0:44:49 Point to the past.
0:44:53 This is why I have that standard and that’s what makes it powerful.
0:44:56 If we’re not taking advantage of our past in that sense, again, we’re just floating.
0:45:00 We’re just floating with these theoretical things that aren’t backed by why.
0:45:03 It sucks to have painful experiences, of course.
0:45:08 I’ve been through my fair share, loss, breakups across the board, but those are the things
0:45:12 that make clarity in the present possible and that’s what transforms into the type of
0:45:17 relationships you want, the ones you’re willing to fight for, the ones that you’re willing
0:45:20 to walk away from, the times you’re willing to start over.
0:45:25 You need that clarity and if we don’t look at our past as a source of it, we’re basically
0:45:28 throwing away all of this goodness in our life that we have.
0:45:33 I love everything that you said and something else that I want to touch on is ego.
0:45:35 A lot of us think that it’s bad.
0:45:37 We just assume that ego is the enemy.
0:45:41 We need to fight off anything that is related to ego.
0:45:45 Why do you think that there’s some positives related to our ego?
0:45:48 I think in general, ego is the enemy.
0:45:49 Mr. Ryan Holiday is correct.
0:45:56 Boastful, better than thou, ego of course is bad thinking you know everything is bad.
0:46:00 Mindfulness, the practice of mindfulness, the more mindful you are, the more you meditate,
0:46:03 the more you have mindful practice, the more you journal, the more you realize you don’t
0:46:04 know.
0:46:07 It is a very humbling practice and it should be.
0:46:10 Honestly, that’s the best sign you’re on the right track.
0:46:12 You’re more unsure of yourself from time to time.
0:46:14 That is the greatest sign that you’re doing things right.
0:46:18 But I would say along the way, there is a healthy side of the ego and it’s not even ego.
0:46:23 I think I dress it up as ego because it’s easy to understand and we can create the visual
0:46:25 of two sides of the ego.
0:46:27 But all it is is faith.
0:46:32 It’s faith in yourself that you should have some confidence, a little bit of swag, that
0:46:35 no one’s out of your league, that no business objectives out of your reach.
0:46:37 You could do these things.
0:46:41 You could put yourself in a position to at least try and the humility side is no matter
0:46:43 what happens, you can handle it.
0:46:49 I just think in the day and age of social media and comparison and conformity and what-if
0:46:54 isms, we’re so quick to talk ourselves out of things because of all these things that
0:46:55 we’ve been talking about.
0:46:56 I’m to this.
0:46:57 I’m to that.
0:46:58 They’re this.
0:46:59 I’m that.
0:47:03 That we talk ourselves out of trying in the first place and it’s in those instances where
0:47:07 I think we need the healthy side of ego, the catalyst, the spark for just trying.
0:47:11 I’m not reinventing the wheel here with talking about just motivating yourself to try.
0:47:18 I like people who have a little bit of swag and confidence, but it’s balanced wholeheartedly
0:47:19 by humility.
0:47:23 They’re willing to put themselves into situations where they’re cringe, where they’re weird,
0:47:26 where they’re awkward, where they’re vulnerable.
0:47:27 Only good things come from that.
0:47:32 If we only think of ego and confidence as this thing that is a negative, I find a lot
0:47:34 of times we don’t even put ourselves in those positions.
0:47:38 I think it’s a matter of humility, but it’s also a matter of believing that no matter where
0:47:42 you put yourself, you can react to what happens next.
0:47:43 That’s the healthy side of ego.
0:47:48 We’ll be right back after a quick break from our sponsors.
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0:52:13 I was listening to an interview with you and James Altichur a couple of days ago and you
0:52:16 guys were talking about how luck is similar to faith.
0:52:18 How can we make ourselves more lucky?
0:52:22 What are some ways that we can break the rut that we’re in, the routine that we’re in to
0:52:25 try to bring more luck into our lives?
0:52:26 Yeah.
0:52:32 I like the idea of luck as faith and I like the idea of luck and faith and patience being
0:52:33 intertwined.
0:52:37 When you give yourself patience, that is saying I have faith in myself.
0:52:40 When you’re saying I don’t need to rush to do this, I don’t need to conform to someone
0:52:41 else’s timeline.
0:52:43 I just need to keep doing what I’m doing.
0:52:45 That is faith in yourself and that is what creates luck.
0:52:49 There’s a book that I referenced quite a bit that has been passed around a little bit that
0:52:50 talks about luck.
0:52:55 I’m blanking on the author of it, but it’s called Chase Chance and Creativity, the Lucky
0:52:56 Art of Novelty.
0:53:01 It’s basically written by this scientist professor who was talking about the role that luck has
0:53:06 played in some great scientific breakthroughs, specifically luck in the lab, like the invention
0:53:09 of pasteurization and Louis Pasteur and the invention of penicillin.
0:53:14 These were technically mistakes that were made in the lab when they just randomly did things.
0:53:17 Not scientists that don’t know the exacts, but they randomly mixed things together and
0:53:18 something great happened.
0:53:19 It was luck.
0:53:20 It wasn’t part of the plan.
0:53:21 It was luck.
0:53:26 Basically, the scientist looked over the years, over the many decades and centuries of luck
0:53:30 in the lab and he said, “Luck is actually categorizable.
0:53:33 It’s something we could break down and it’s something we can’t control.”
0:53:35 He said, “There’s four kinds of luck.
0:53:40 One luck is the kind of luck that I think we’re also apt to identify by.
0:53:42 For me, I used to think, “Well, I’m an unlucky person.
0:53:43 I’ve never won a lottery.
0:53:47 I always hit red lights, give something back and it tends to happen to me.”
0:53:49 That’s the kind of luck that we need to ignore.
0:53:50 That’s random luck.
0:53:52 We don’t really care about random luck.
0:53:53 We can’t control it.
0:53:54 It is what it is.
0:53:58 But there’s three other kinds of luck that he identified in the lab that I think is very
0:54:00 immediately transferable to life.
0:54:04 The first was luck that comes from experience and association.
0:54:08 Basically, the more you do something, the wiser you get about it, such that in the future,
0:54:10 you make better decisions.
0:54:15 You’re able to quickly form more mental associations of if this, then that, and you just have better
0:54:16 results.
0:54:18 It’s luck that comes from wisdom.
0:54:23 For me, it’s with writing quotes, I’ve written, I don’t know, a thousand on Instagram.
0:54:26 I kind of know what people want.
0:54:28 I know what makes people feel seen.
0:54:30 I posted something yesterday.
0:54:31 Today, it’s got like 90,000 likes.
0:54:32 That’s a lot of likes.
0:54:34 That’s a little bit lucky.
0:54:36 The algorithm lucked me today.
0:54:37 Well, kind of.
0:54:38 It was just a little bit of association.
0:54:40 So that was luck one.
0:54:42 The other luck was luck that comes from motion.
0:54:43 You can’t deny that.
0:54:47 The more you do the luck you get, objects in motion stay in motion, objects in motion
0:54:49 bump into other objects in motion.
0:54:53 The more you do, the more podcasts you released, the more music you released, the more cold
0:54:56 calls you make, literally the luck you would get.
0:55:02 For some reason, we conflate luck with being irregardless of effort, but luck is truly
0:55:03 effort.
0:55:07 And then the last luck that he broke down was luck that comes from uniqueness, originality,
0:55:11 authenticity, just the fact that the more real you are, the lucky you get in the sense
0:55:13 that people can detect that.
0:55:18 Like if you have blue hair, and that’s authentic to you and your expression, it strikes up
0:55:21 a conversation with someone, “Oh, and they’re an editor for Vogue, and you want to be a
0:55:22 fashion model.”
0:55:23 Things like that.
0:55:28 Luck that comes from originality and authenticity, that in very practical ways, whether it’s
0:55:31 a conversation in an elevator or something you post that shines through, it attracts
0:55:33 the right people, and you get lucky.
0:55:35 But it comes from that level of realness.
0:55:41 So yeah, I like thinking about luck in that sense because I used to really victimize myself
0:55:43 as an unlucky person, and of course that’s not true.
0:55:44 And that’s unfair.
0:55:46 Back to the idea of that’s bold of you and vulnerability.
0:55:50 It’s an unfair thing to say I’m an unlucky person.
0:55:55 You could break yourself free of being unlucky by being real, by leaning on your past for
0:55:58 those associations, and then for doing more, of course.
0:56:02 But all those things combine are faith, and they all require patience, so I think it all
0:56:03 fits nicely.
0:56:07 Something that I think ties with this is your advice that you gave that you got from Seinfeld
0:56:09 about doing the opposite.
0:56:11 Can you tell us about that?
0:56:14 Yeah, for being in the mental health space, I talk a lot about Seinfeld.
0:56:16 It might kind of have left fields unless people watch that.
0:56:21 I think there’s a lot of wise ideas in Seinfeld, but yeah, I’ve done a bunch of episodes and
0:56:24 I talked to it in my book about the idea of you’re feeling stuck in a rut.
0:56:25 You’re feeling ambiguous.
0:56:26 You’re feeling trapped.
0:56:30 I think the best thing you could do is just try the opposite of what you’ve been doing,
0:56:34 whether it’s a habit or routine, a mindset, a standard, a boundary, right?
0:56:38 We’re not talking about going back to zero, but just throwing things to the wall and trying
0:56:39 something different.
0:56:44 Because there was an episode in Seinfeld where George, who is Jerry’s kind of short
0:56:49 king friend who is an unlucky person and he’s not conventionally attractive.
0:56:50 He’s not wealthy.
0:56:51 He’s kind of neurotic.
0:56:55 He doesn’t have any luck with women, and so they’re talking, and George is like, “Nothing
0:56:57 ever good happens to me.
0:56:58 I always make the wrong choice.”
0:57:02 And Jerry’s like, “Well, if every choice you’ve ever made to date has been wrong, then what
0:57:04 would happen if you did the opposite of that?”
0:57:08 And then he gets up from his seat at this table, and he walks up to this attractive
0:57:11 woman at the bar, and he goes, “Hi, my name’s George.
0:57:13 I’m unemployed, and I live with my parents.”
0:57:14 And she’s like, “Hello.”
0:57:15 And they hit it off, and they go on a date.
0:57:17 So it’s just a funny example of him.
0:57:21 Instead of trying to fake it and be this Rico Suave guy, he gets up, and he’s just very
0:57:24 honest with her, and it’s the opposite of how he’d normally react.
0:57:26 And I’ve always taken that to heart.
0:57:31 In my early sales days, I had to be the opposite of who I was at the time, called a fake it
0:57:32 to you make it mentality.
0:57:37 I had to get up and be that funny guy and take clients out and do all those things.
0:57:40 But that helped mold me into actually becoming that person.
0:57:45 And in so many areas of life, I used to be a pretty avoidant attachment type when it came
0:57:50 to relationships, and being willing to sit in that space of discomfort, the opposite.
0:57:54 On the entrepreneurial front, again, my parents, my upbringing has always been very traditional,
0:57:56 and you make money in traditional ways.
0:58:00 You max out your 401(k) to do the opposite of those things, really pushed me out of my
0:58:02 comfort zone, but here we are.
0:58:07 So I think a very piece of practical advice is dip your toe in the water of opposites
0:58:09 and see what it brings you.
0:58:10 So good.
0:58:14 So something else that you talk about is being comfortable with embarrassment.
0:58:18 I thought this one was really funny, because I never really thought about that, but you
0:58:23 say you’re even competitive with yourself about being as embarrassing as possible.
0:58:27 You challenge yourself to be embarrassing, so talk to us about that.
0:58:32 It’s less like trying to be embarrassed and more a willingness to be embarrassed.
0:58:36 For me, it’s to this idea of pushing yourself out of your comfort zone, doing opposites.
0:58:41 A way that I’ve done it in the past was to gamify the experience.
0:58:45 Not so overtly, like I’m literally gamifying it, but you think about confidence, right?
0:58:47 Where does confidence come from?
0:58:50 Confidence comes from, without a doubt, evidence, right?
0:58:54 Confidence can be theoretical at a certain point, but in order to make that confidence
0:58:59 real, you need to generate evidence, evidence that you could trip and fall and still be
0:59:02 confident, evidence that you could start and fail and pivot and still do well, right?
0:59:05 That is what creates confidence, it’s a muscle, it’s evidence-based.
0:59:08 So I always thought about it in the sense of, well, how do you create evidence?
0:59:10 You got to get points on the board.
0:59:17 So I used to treat it that anytime I did something awkward or embarrassing or cringe or uncomfortable,
0:59:22 in my head, I would give myself a point, like a ticket at a county fair, and that I would
0:59:24 redeem that for a big stuffed animal, right?
0:59:25 In my head.
0:59:27 It’s the same idea for confidence.
0:59:28 How do you gain confidence?
0:59:33 You cash in those points, and at a certain point, to our conversation about healthy ego,
0:59:36 at a certain point, you’re like, I could put myself in any position, I could be the one
0:59:40 to say a funny joke and have it fall on deaf ears, I could be the one to introduce myself
0:59:44 to someone and they can dismiss me, but I’m still confident.
0:59:48 In that situation, I’m not less of a person, and it comes from that evidence.
0:59:52 So for me, back to our conversation about motivating yourself to get what you want or
0:59:56 get what you need, that amps me up to have a difficult conversation.
0:59:58 It’s the same idea when it comes to confidence.
1:00:03 It amps me up to do something that is potentially awkward or embarrassing or vulnerable because
1:00:05 I know what it gives me.
1:00:07 We’re so focused on what it takes from us, right?
1:00:11 It takes from us our pride and our respect or maybe even a friend.
1:00:16 I’m more focused on what it gives me, which is those things, those exact same things.
1:00:20 And it’s really helped me evolve my thinking there from, I don’t want to be cringed.
1:00:24 That used to be my biggest roadblock, especially when it comes to being a guy who literally
1:00:29 writes potentially cringe things on the internet as, I can’t be cringed.
1:00:30 Why?
1:00:31 Why?
1:00:32 Why is that a fear of mine?
1:00:35 What am I afraid of being judged by people who think being real and open and honest is
1:00:37 a cringey thing?
1:00:39 That’s a cringe thing, that they would judge that.
1:00:44 So I’ve really evolved my thinking there focused on what being awkward and embarrassing gives
1:00:46 you versus what it takes from you.
1:00:47 Okay.
1:00:52 As we close out this interview, I want to start talking more about your career and your
1:00:54 Instagram and things like that.
1:00:59 I know that you now are merging mindfulness with music.
1:01:01 You haven’t been for a little while now.
1:01:05 Talk to us about why you decided to do that and how personally, how has that made you
1:01:07 feel to be able to combine both of these passions?
1:01:12 Do you feel more fulfilled now that you can merge these passions?
1:01:13 Yes.
1:01:14 I love house music.
1:01:18 I’ve always loved house music growing up in Chicago, now I’m in Miami.
1:01:21 Just love dance music, any genre of dance music.
1:01:22 So that’s part one.
1:01:26 Part two would be back to my passion for mindfulness as a subject matter.
1:01:31 I think a lot of my hesitation towards it in my twenties was because I used to think
1:01:37 that vulnerability, mindfulness, mental health, journaling, therapy, those are things for
1:01:38 sad people.
1:01:42 That is something you do when you’re sad and you’re overwhelmed and it is for broken people,
1:01:43 right?
1:01:46 It’s a ridiculous statement, but I think that’s how I used to think and I think a lot
1:01:50 of people think that too now, particularly with the language that we use around mental
1:01:52 health and stigmas and all these things.
1:01:57 There still is this connotation that it’s for sad people and I don’t take a whole lot
1:01:58 very seriously in life.
1:02:02 I think some of my quotes reflect that, but I’ve always wanted to encourage people to
1:02:05 see mindfulness as something that you celebrate.
1:02:08 It is a journey inward to celebrate who you are.
1:02:11 It is something that you do when you’re happy, not just when you’re sad.
1:02:15 Just for both, of course, but I’ve really always been drawn towards the energetic side
1:02:22 of mindfulness, not the sit in silence and meditate, not the sound bath and meditate
1:02:23 kind of guy.
1:02:24 That’s great for some people.
1:02:26 It’s never been great for me.
1:02:30 I always get the most mental breakthroughs when I listen to dance music.
1:02:32 There’s something about the structure of dance music.
1:02:34 For one, break, build, drop, break, build, drop.
1:02:37 It drop, it’s very euphoric, it’s very journey driven.
1:02:41 I’ve never written anything of substance without listening to dance music.
1:02:44 I’ve always had this creative and emotional connection to dance music.
1:02:47 At a certain point a couple of years ago, I was like, “Well, let me bring this into
1:02:49 some of my practices.”
1:02:52 I started working with different DJs and I would have them on the show where they would
1:02:53 play a set.
1:02:57 I would have Martin Garrix on and he would play for 60 minutes.
1:03:00 The great thing about dance music is there’s usually transitions between the songs where
1:03:05 it’s somewhat easy to come in with a vocal or a piece of audio and I would come in and
1:03:11 just kind of do a little of my usual mindfulness, but over 130 BPM banger house tune.
1:03:14 It’s not for everyone, certainly a lot of people don’t really get it.
1:03:19 They would rather do the quiet, calm mindfulness, but I think a lot of people are leaning towards
1:03:22 mindfulness as something that excites you, mindfulness that’s something that you could
1:03:25 do while you’re moving your body.
1:03:29 It’s more of a creative outlet for me than anything I really do with my business.
1:03:33 I live in Miami now and my girlfriend is a DJ here, so it’s part of my life.
1:03:36 I spend a fair amount of time in clubs here, but I don’t really drink.
1:03:42 I just enjoy the ability for music to be a catalyst for vulnerability, whether that’s
1:03:46 in person or in an episode or with a DJ.
1:03:51 I just think there’s such an inherent, powerful connection between music and mindfulness that
1:03:54 I at least have to put it out into the world and I enjoy doing it.
1:03:58 Yeah, and I think a lot of my listeners are going to want to hear some of that.
1:04:01 Where can they hear your mindfulness music?
1:04:03 Yeah, they’re all on the podcast.
1:04:07 If you go to New Mindset, you just on the Spotify or Apple, you just scroll through,
1:04:09 you’ll see the cover arts different for them.
1:04:12 There’s one I did with Martin Garrix, there’s one I did with two friends, a bunch of different
1:04:15 DJs who are a little bit smaller, but they’re great.
1:04:18 If you want to give it a shot, listen to it and see how you feel.
1:04:23 That’s awesome because I’m somebody who has ADHD, so I like doing mindfulness with yoga
1:04:29 and matching it with different things, so I think it’s a really cool thing.
1:04:33 Your Instagram, couple of questions on your Instagram because you’ve managed to build
1:04:39 such an awesome Instagram and nowadays everyone’s saying, “It’s all about Instagram reels, you’ve
1:04:44 got to do your reels,” but you’re having so much success posting quotes and thoughts
1:04:50 and sliders and I’m curious to understand, where did you come up with this strategy and
1:04:52 why do you think it works so well?
1:04:57 Yeah, I’ll address the video verse static in a second, I always think about that.
1:05:01 It was during COVID, again, a big breakthrough time for me creatively because I literally
1:05:03 had more time on my hands.
1:05:06 I was sitting in my apartment and I was like, “I want to promote the podcast.
1:05:07 How do I get more people to listen to podcasts?”
1:05:10 I was like, “Well, I got to post on social.”
1:05:14 And I was like, “Well, for one, if I talk for 20 minutes on the podcast, how can I show
1:05:16 that I really understand it?”
1:05:19 Well, simplicity is the way to show you understand something, so I was like, “How can I take
1:05:24 something on the podcast that’s a complex conversation, boil it down to one sentence?”
1:05:27 So I really forced myself to be creative in that sense.
1:05:31 And then two, I was like, “Why don’t I want to just do one by one and do a little Canva
1:05:32 digital mock-up?”
1:05:34 I was like, “There’s got to be something more real.”
1:05:37 And at the time, I had these coffee cups in front of me, so I started writing on coffee
1:05:40 cups with a pen.
1:05:41 And those did really well.
1:05:44 At the time, there weren’t a whole lot of people doing handwritten stuff.
1:05:48 And then I started writing on pieces of paper and I lived in downtown Chicago, so I had the
1:05:53 backdrop and I would just start posting them all over and then I also understood the algorithm
1:05:59 somewhat well and saw the power of carousels, and not just the power of carousels, but the
1:06:01 power of series.
1:06:05 Have one idea, but to say it in eight or nine or 10 different ways so that people would
1:06:09 scroll through and find different ones that they relate to.
1:06:11 And the rest is history.
1:06:15 I write them all by hand, I still do, even though now I generally just write on a white
1:06:18 piece of paper with my pen and then I take a photo of it.
1:06:20 People’s preferences changed.
1:06:24 I think people like the simplicity and the minimalism of just the white piece of paper,
1:06:25 but I love my red pen.
1:06:26 I love doing it.
1:06:33 For me, it’s a noble, creative quest to ensure that I can distill down a conversation like
1:06:36 this into a short sentence.
1:06:40 I’m an adamant believer in the power of mantras and affirmations to have these things that
1:06:44 you believe, pieces of clarity that you could put human language behind.
1:06:48 We opened up with talking about learning to talk to yourself, not just listen to yourself.
1:06:51 So this is my way to encourage people to do that.
1:06:56 People tattoo my quotes, it’s crazy stuff, but then to your question, yeah, everyone’s
1:07:00 always like, “Okay, it’s like, why don’t you do more reels, sit down and do reels?”
1:07:01 I just like to write.
1:07:02 I really do.
1:07:07 And at the end of the day, you know, even if I were to get on a reel and basically read
1:07:11 a quote, read one of my quotes, but just say it, it’s going to get shared much more
1:07:12 if it’s already written down.
1:07:15 I’ve tested that a million times, at least in my world.
1:07:19 Maybe I’m not, don’t have the right production value or I’m not handsome enough to really
1:07:21 grab the algo’s attention.
1:07:22 I don’t know.
1:07:26 But for me, I like to write things down because there’s so much more shareable and people
1:07:29 remember it so much more because they can actually see it.
1:07:33 Reels are great and obviously video is the future on social media, but for when it comes
1:07:38 to the type of material that I really want to evangelize and help spread, short written
1:07:42 quotes for me just speaks my truth and people remember them.
1:07:43 And that’s what I want.
1:07:46 I don’t want a quick hit of dopamine that comes from a nice reel.
1:07:52 I want the longevity that comes from a piece of affirmation that people take with them
1:07:55 and print out or tattoo or all these crazy things I’ve seen people do with things that
1:07:56 I’ve written.
1:08:02 So I will continue to be the quote guy and hope people continue to receive them.
1:08:03 And you’re so good at it.
1:08:07 Everybody loves your quotes and it goes back to being true to yourself.
1:08:08 You’re not trying to be somebody else.
1:08:12 You’re not trying to be something that everybody else wants you to be or expects you to be.
1:08:16 You’re just doing your own thing and that’s magnetic to other people.
1:08:22 So if you had to pick one of these quotes to stick up on your fridge, you’ve got hundreds
1:08:23 and hundreds of them.
1:08:24 What would you pick?
1:08:28 I wrote one a while ago where I just said redirection is an upgrade.
1:08:29 I like that a lot.
1:08:34 Back to everything we’re talking about here, faith, patience, luck, vulnerability, our
1:08:39 past, clarity, our ability to see a detour, a failure, a flop, a piece of redirection
1:08:43 as opening another door as opposed to closing all the doors.
1:08:45 I really like that.
1:08:49 It’s optimistic thinking for sure, but you read that enough and you’re in the moment
1:08:51 and someone dismisses you or you’re rejected.
1:08:55 It’s like, oh, that stings, but redirection is an upgrade.
1:08:56 Let me see where this is pointing me to.
1:08:57 So I like that one.
1:08:58 It’s short and sweet.
1:08:59 Yeah.
1:09:00 That’s beautiful.
1:09:01 Okay.
1:09:04 I end my podcast with two questions I ask all of my guests.
1:09:08 The first one is what is one actionable thing our young and profitors can do today to become
1:09:10 more profitable tomorrow?
1:09:12 I’ll just go with the obvious here.
1:09:15 I would start journaling, truthfully, even from a business perspective, it gives you
1:09:19 clarity in what to do next, which I think is the ultimate thing.
1:09:24 As long as you could find things to do next, you will inevitably be profitable, whether
1:09:29 that’s emotionally profitable, mentally profitable, profitable on paper.
1:09:32 I really do advocate for a guided journaling habit.
1:09:34 You said a guided journaling habit.
1:09:37 What are some resources that you recommend?
1:09:39 I’ve made and sell a variety of guided journals.
1:09:41 You’re welcome to pick them up.
1:09:42 You don’t have to.
1:09:43 There’s great ones out there that aren’t mine.
1:09:49 I would just recommend finding a journal that asks different questions every day.
1:09:53 I find that sometimes we get into this performative journaling mode where it’s like, I’m grateful
1:09:55 for this or three things I did today.
1:10:00 Those are great, of course, but it needs to be alongside of a powerful intention driven
1:10:03 question that dives into your past.
1:10:04 I think that’s the most powerful way.
1:10:10 So find a journal that has calibrating questions, some gratitude exercises I think are great,
1:10:14 but find one that hits hard with specific different questions every day so you don’t
1:10:15 get comfortable.
1:10:18 The point of journaling is not to reinforce what you believe.
1:10:19 It’s not.
1:10:22 It’s to make you uncomfortable to evolve your thinking.
1:10:26 Whether that’s through my journal, someone else’s, create your own prompts, if you’re
1:10:30 creative, just focus on the power and depth of the question.
1:10:34 What do you say is your secret to profiting in life?
1:10:36 This can go beyond the topic of today’s episode.
1:10:38 Yeah, I would say consistency.
1:10:43 Truly, whether that’s consistency in the gym or with my business or my podcast, I’m
1:10:46 big on doing difficult things.
1:10:49 I’m a David Goggins stan in that respect.
1:10:50 Do the difficult things.
1:10:51 If it’s difficult, you have to do it.
1:10:53 Just do the freaking difficult thing.
1:10:58 I’m really big on it, whether that’s physically or emotionally or I don’t want to do another
1:10:59 episode.
1:11:00 No, do the difficult thing.
1:11:01 I’d say it’s that.
1:11:05 I’m not a sucker for doing the difficult thing consistently because I’ve just seen what happens
1:11:08 when you’re consistent with those things that most people don’t want to do.
1:11:12 It sets you apart, not that I’m apart from everyone else and there’s me.
1:11:17 It sets me apart from older versions of myself, which is the person that I compete with.
1:11:18 Do the difficult things.
1:11:19 Do them consistently.
1:11:21 Well, this was such an amazing conversation.
1:11:23 I really appreciate your time.
1:11:25 Where can everybody learn more about you and everything that you do?
1:11:26 Yeah.
1:11:27 Thanks for having me.
1:11:31 I love talking about myself, but it was cool to see how much we have in common as well.
1:11:32 Thanks so much for having me.
1:11:34 kase.kenny on Instagram.
1:11:37 The podcast is called New Mindset Who Disks, Everywhere You Listen to Pots, books, journals,
1:11:39 newmindsetwhodisks.com.
1:11:40 Amazing.
1:11:41 We’ll stick all those links in the show notes.
1:11:43 Kase, thank you so much.
1:11:48 Thank you.
1:11:51 Case Kenny is the man.
1:11:56 I love his broader approach to mindfulness, how it’s not just about sharing your feelings
1:12:00 or being present in the moment, but also about learning how to talk to yourself.
1:12:06 Like he said, mindfulness is really self Q and A, asking yourself the right questions
1:12:10 in order to understand yourself and get the most out of yourself.
1:12:14 And when you get better at that, you become more self aware.
1:12:16 You’ll end up being a lot kinder to yourself.
1:12:22 You’ll start to push back against the programming and the conditioning that drives you to be
1:12:25 so much harder on yourself than you are with others.
1:12:27 And here’s the beautiful thing.
1:12:32 Once you let up on yourself, it frees you to become a lot bolder, bolder in relationships
1:12:35 in your job and in your life.
1:12:40 I also liked Kase’s view on the past, how the tough experiences we’ve had in the past
1:12:43 really set the stage for a better future.
1:12:47 Our battle scars help us raise our standards in a good way.
1:12:52 Our failed relationships of the past teach us what to value in future ones.
1:12:57 In short, our past troubles can boost the clarity with which we view the world today.
1:13:03 Finally, like Kase, we can all learn to embrace not just our past experiences, but our present
1:13:05 embarrassment as well.
1:13:11 He actually seeks out embarrassment as a source of growth, a way to build his confidence.
1:13:16 And that’s because having a difficult conversation, an awkward encounter, or a shaky performance
1:13:22 helps us to build the mental evidence that we can survive anything, and even a flourish
1:13:23 in spite at all.
1:13:27 Thanks for listening to this episode of Young and Profiting Podcast.
1:13:32 If you listen, learn to improvise from this conversation with the amazing Kase Kenney,
1:13:36 then it’s time to be bold, take out your phone, and share this episode with somebody
1:13:38 who would benefit from it.
1:13:43 And if you did enjoy this show, and you listen each and every week, or every single morning,
1:13:47 or every time you go to the gym, then share it with us.
1:13:48 Tell us in a review.
1:13:54 Write us a five-star review on Apple or Spotify or wherever you listen to your podcasts.
1:13:56 I really love reading your reviews.
1:13:58 It makes my day.
1:14:01 And if you prefer to watch your podcasts as videos, we’re on YouTube.
1:14:06 I’m starting to do a lot more in-person interviews, which I’m really excited about.
1:14:11 And if you’re looking for me, you can check me out on Instagram at Yap with Hala or LinkedIn
1:14:12 by searching my name.
1:14:13 It’s Hala Taha.
1:14:19 I also have to take a second to say thank you so much to my amazing production team.
1:14:21 You guys are so hardworking.
1:14:22 You do such a great job.
1:14:27 I really appreciate all the experimentation you’re doing with AI and all the cool stuff
1:14:28 you guys are doing at Yap Media.
1:14:29 I love you guys.
1:14:34 This is your host, Hala Taha, aka The Podcast Princess, signing off.
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